[opensuse-marketing] Attracting Windows Users

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Stephan Binner

22 Oct 2008 22 Oct '08

10:58

Hello, without doubt the current MS Windows users are the biggest chunk which we can and want to make switch to openSUSE. But IMO we are are not targetting marke- ting and development efforts to that goal enough. We have some good pieces in place or development like InstLux[1] or Mango[2] and some (rather thin) docu- mentation [3,4] but we can and should do better as others do a better job [5]. So any idea what are we missing, how to reach and help Windows users better (this can be also feature requrests for future distro releases like [6])? :-) For inspirations maybe also have a look at what Apple and its user community are doing with the "Apple Switcher" campaign, tutorials and help sites. Bye, Steve [0] http://www.benkevan.com/blog/switching-from-windows-to-linux-what-you-need-t... [1] http://en.opensuse.org/Instlux [2] http://en.opensuse.org/Mango [3] http://en.opensuse.org/How_to_migrate_from_Windows [4] http://en.opensuse.org/Application_Equivalents [5] https://help.ubuntu.com/community/SwitchingToUbuntu/FromWindows [6] https://features.opensuse.org/?rm=feature_show&id=305308 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org

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Martin Lasarsch

22 Oct 22 Oct

11:54

On Wednesday 22 October 2008 12:58:41 Stephan Binner wrote:

...

So any idea what are we missing, how to reach and help Windows users better (this can be also feature requrests for future distro releases like [6])? :-)

Wubi is really nice. I tried it and it's perfect for people who are afraid of the installation. This is something we should have to attract more Windows user. -- with kind regards, Martin Lasarsch, Core Services SUSE LINUX Products GmbH, Maxfeldstr. 5 90409 Nürnberg GF: Markus Rex, HRB 16746 (AG Nürnberg) martin.lasarsch@suse.de - http://www.opensuse.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org

Gabriel Franco

12:09

...

From my experience trying to get more people to use and get to know

Hi all, linux these are the major problems usually I have to deal with: 1) Linux is hard to install: Most people that tried Linux for the first time a few years ago and experienced a bad install, hard to config and no device drivers, are afraid to give linux a try again. These are the easy to convert scenario... Usually with a Live CD or a USB Distro we can convince them that the reality for linux is different now. 2) There's no <put your fav application name here> port to linux: Most people are used to a group of application and most of them doesn't have a linux port (most have a Mac port tough), and when you try to say you can run it on Wine or any other emulator they say "why bothering configuring a linux to run windows applications? Just install windows...". And showing them equivalents is no good. They don't want to work with a similar application that *might* have all the features. I think that our main focus wouldn't be try to migrate windows users to linux, but rather get the new users to start with linux. One research here on Brazil showed that people that had a contact with Linux first (on our public schools that uses Linux on their computers) they tend to keep linux on their home desktops, because that's what they are used to use on school. For the old users that are used to Windows, we would only be able to actually convince them if the major software companies started releasing their software for linux too. []'s Gabriel 2008/10/22 Martin Lasarsch :

...

On Wednesday 22 October 2008 12:58:41 Stephan Binner wrote:

...
So any idea what are we missing, how to reach and help Windows users better (this can be also feature requrests for future distro releases like [6])? :-)

Wubi is really nice. I tried it and it's perfect for people who are afraid of the installation. This is something we should have to attract more Windows user.

-- with kind regards,

Martin Lasarsch, Core Services SUSE LINUX Products GmbH, Maxfeldstr. 5 90409 Nürnberg GF: Markus Rex, HRB 16746 (AG Nürnberg) martin.lasarsch@suse.de - http://www.opensuse.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org

-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org

Rupert Horstkötter

13:16

Hi all, 1. I pretty much agree with what Gabriel said. We'll have a hard time to convince long time Windows users to switch over as long as there are no Linux ports for their favourite applications available. What I'm frequently faced with when trying to convince Windows users to use Linux instead are questions like "Is e.g. Adobe's software available for Linux?" - that's certainly something that's not in our control, the only way would be to either convince software vendors to port their applications to our operating system (which will be a hard challenge) or to provide at least rock solid emulator solutions like Wine "on steroids". 2. As of ease of installation: From my perspective we made a great step forward with the 11.0 installer and the live-installer, but something like WUBI would certainly help to further enhance the installation experience especially for Windows users. I mean the standard installation procedure can hardly be further improved. 3. Something very important from my perspective is to significantly lower the entrance barriers to try out Linux in a sufficient way. I mean LiveCDs are certainly providing a possibility to try out Linux or openSUSE in particular, but they are on the one hand damn slow and what's even more important, they are non-persistent. If we want to convince Windows users to switch over we need to provide a way to trying out Linux over a certain period of time and the solution from my perspective would be... ready-to-use LiveUSB images with persistent overlay. They are pretty much as fast as an harddrive installation and are able to provide the user an understanding of what Linux actually has to offer over a period of several days. They can tinker around, try out things, save their bookmarks and some files to deal with, they can try out package management and get an understanding of how easy it actually is compared to Windows. Most major distributions are providing LiveUSB solutions nowadays and honestly, our KIWI system is way more powerful than competitors offerings - we could even provide ready-to-use raw-images to just "dd" onto a stick, something superior to what Ubuntu https://launchpad.net/usb-creator or Fedora https://fedorahosted.org/liveusb-creator has to offer currently and therefore something to differentiate from competitors. 4. Something additional that come to my mind, I already mentioned that in former marketing team meetings, would be, to further enhance our presentation of openSUSE at http://opensuse.org - In that context I mean visual presentation and explanantion of what openSUSE has to offer. The screenshots available as of lately are a step into the right direction from my perspective, but there could be done much more. Seeing is believing and especially Windows users are still thinking that Linux is plain shell, don't laugh, that's really something I hear frequently. We need to find ways (screencast and presentations of the major parts of the operating system) to present what openSUSE actually has to offer. In reagard of Windows users we have, at least from my perspective, the possibility to outline the really superior parts of the OS compared to their current solution. One of the best arguments in that context is ease of software installation and update. I mean I know very few Windows users that are aware of a package management solution and that's honestly an area where we are way better than Windows will ever be. Cheers, Rupert 2008/10/22 Gabriel Franco :

...

Hi all,

From my experience trying to get more people to use and get to know linux these are the major problems usually I have to deal with:

1) Linux is hard to install: Most people that tried Linux for the first time a few years ago and experienced a bad install, hard to config and no device drivers, are afraid to give linux a try again. These are the easy to convert scenario... Usually with a Live CD or a USB Distro we can convince them that the reality for linux is different now.

2) There's no <put your fav application name here> port to linux: Most people are used to a group of application and most of them doesn't have a linux port (most have a Mac port tough), and when you try to say you can run it on Wine or any other emulator they say "why bothering configuring a linux to run windows applications? Just install windows...". And showing them equivalents is no good. They don't want to work with a similar application that *might* have all the features.

I think that our main focus wouldn't be try to migrate windows users to linux, but rather get the new users to start with linux.

One research here on Brazil showed that people that had a contact with Linux first (on our public schools that uses Linux on their computers) they tend to keep linux on their home desktops, because that's what they are used to use on school.

For the old users that are used to Windows, we would only be able to actually convince them if the major software companies started releasing their software for linux too.

[]'s

Gabriel

2008/10/22 Martin Lasarsch :

...
On Wednesday 22 October 2008 12:58:41 Stephan Binner wrote:

...
So any idea what are we missing, how to reach and help Windows users better (this can be also feature requrests for future distro releases like [6])? :-)

Wubi is really nice. I tried it and it's perfect for people who are afraid of the installation. This is something we should have to attract more Windows user.

-- with kind regards,

Martin Lasarsch, Core Services SUSE LINUX Products GmbH, Maxfeldstr. 5 90409 Nürnberg GF: Markus Rex, HRB 16746 (AG Nürnberg) martin.lasarsch@suse.de - http://www.opensuse.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org

-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org

-- Rupert Horstkötter, openSUSE Community Email: rhorstkoetter@opensuse.org Phone: +49 6151 7897817 Mobile: +49 176 21820039 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org

Rupert Horstkötter

13:27

Hi all, something I missed in regard of ready-to-use LiveUSB images and their advantage over competitor solutions is, that "dd" onto a stick is even possible out of a Windows environment, which is obviously essential in our current discussion. There's a utility from the m0n0wall project similar to "dd" called "physdiskwrite" available, that we maybe could adopt. http://m0n0.ch/wall/physdiskwrite.php Cheers, Rupert 2008/10/22 Rupert Horstkötter :

...

Hi all,

1. I pretty much agree with what Gabriel said. We'll have a hard time to convince long time Windows users to switch over as long as there are no Linux ports for their favourite applications available. What I'm frequently faced with when trying to convince Windows users to use Linux instead are questions like "Is e.g. Adobe's software available for Linux?" - that's certainly something that's not in our control, the only way would be to either convince software vendors to port their applications to our operating system (which will be a hard challenge) or to provide at least rock solid emulator solutions like Wine "on steroids".

2. As of ease of installation: From my perspective we made a great step forward with the 11.0 installer and the live-installer, but something like WUBI would certainly help to further enhance the installation experience especially for Windows users. I mean the standard installation procedure can hardly be further improved.

3. Something very important from my perspective is to significantly lower the entrance barriers to try out Linux in a sufficient way. I mean LiveCDs are certainly providing a possibility to try out Linux or openSUSE in particular, but they are on the one hand damn slow and what's even more important, they are non-persistent. If we want to convince Windows users to switch over we need to provide a way to trying out Linux over a certain period of time and the solution from my perspective would be... ready-to-use LiveUSB images with persistent overlay. They are pretty much as fast as an harddrive installation and are able to provide the user an understanding of what Linux actually has to offer over a period of several days. They can tinker around, try out things, save their bookmarks and some files to deal with, they can try out package management and get an understanding of how easy it actually is compared to Windows. Most major distributions are providing LiveUSB solutions nowadays and honestly, our KIWI system is way more powerful than competitors offerings - we could even provide ready-to-use raw-images to just "dd" onto a stick, something superior to what Ubuntu https://launchpad.net/usb-creator or Fedora https://fedorahosted.org/liveusb-creator has to offer currently and therefore something to differentiate from competitors.

4. Something additional that come to my mind, I already mentioned that in former marketing team meetings, would be, to further enhance our presentation of openSUSE at http://opensuse.org - In that context I mean visual presentation and explanantion of what openSUSE has to offer. The screenshots available as of lately are a step into the right direction from my perspective, but there could be done much more. Seeing is believing and especially Windows users are still thinking that Linux is plain shell, don't laugh, that's really something I hear frequently. We need to find ways (screencast and presentations of the major parts of the operating system) to present what openSUSE actually has to offer. In reagard of Windows users we have, at least from my perspective, the possibility to outline the really superior parts of the OS compared to their current solution. One of the best arguments in that context is ease of software installation and update. I mean I know very few Windows users that are aware of a package management solution and that's honestly an area where we are way better than Windows will ever be.

Cheers, Rupert

2008/10/22 Gabriel Franco :

...
Hi all,

From my experience trying to get more people to use and get to know linux these are the major problems usually I have to deal with:

1) Linux is hard to install: Most people that tried Linux for the first time a few years ago and experienced a bad install, hard to config and no device drivers, are afraid to give linux a try again. These are the easy to convert scenario... Usually with a Live CD or a USB Distro we can convince them that the reality for linux is different now.

2) There's no <put your fav application name here> port to linux: Most people are used to a group of application and most of them doesn't have a linux port (most have a Mac port tough), and when you try to say you can run it on Wine or any other emulator they say "why bothering configuring a linux to run windows applications? Just install windows...". And showing them equivalents is no good. They don't want to work with a similar application that *might* have all the features.

I think that our main focus wouldn't be try to migrate windows users to linux, but rather get the new users to start with linux.

One research here on Brazil showed that people that had a contact with Linux first (on our public schools that uses Linux on their computers) they tend to keep linux on their home desktops, because that's what they are used to use on school.

For the old users that are used to Windows, we would only be able to actually convince them if the major software companies started releasing their software for linux too.

[]'s

Gabriel

2008/10/22 Martin Lasarsch :

...
On Wednesday 22 October 2008 12:58:41 Stephan Binner wrote:

...
So any idea what are we missing, how to reach and help Windows users better (this can be also feature requrests for future distro releases like [6])? :-)

Wubi is really nice. I tried it and it's perfect for people who are afraid of the installation. This is something we should have to attract more Windows user.

-- with kind regards,

Martin Lasarsch, Core Services SUSE LINUX Products GmbH, Maxfeldstr. 5 90409 Nürnberg GF: Markus Rex, HRB 16746 (AG Nürnberg) martin.lasarsch@suse.de - http://www.opensuse.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org

-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org

-- Rupert Horstkötter, openSUSE Community Email: rhorstkoetter@opensuse.org Phone: +49 6151 7897817 Mobile: +49 176 21820039

Stephan Binner

25 Oct 25 Oct

09:12

On Wednesday 22 October 2008 14:09:35 Gabriel Franco wrote:

...

These are the easy to convert scenario... Usually with a Live CD or a USB Distro we can convince them that the reality for linux is different now.

Having some official USB images would certainly be nice.

...

And showing them equivalents is no good. They don't want to work with a similar application that *might* have all the features.

We could also advertize applications more which have a Windows versions available (OOo, Firefox, Gimp, ...) so they can try before switching OS.

...

I think that our main focus wouldn't be try to migrate windows users to linux, but rather get the new users to start with linux.

New users that don't know Windows? From where should they come? I can only think of preloads (as in netbooks primarily).

...

One research here on Brazil showed that people that had a contact with Linux first (on our public schools that uses Linux on their computers)

"First time users at schools" sounds like a small fraction/niche to me. Bye, Steve -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org

manchette

22 Oct 22 Oct

13:53

Martin Lasarsch a écrit :

...

On Wednesday 22 October 2008 12:58:41 Stephan Binner wrote:

...
So any idea what are we missing, how to reach and help Windows users better (this can be also feature requrests for future distro releases like [6])? :-)

In my opinion translation in national languages is very important, i mentionned it here already. I think its more difficult to grasp this aspect when english is your mother tongue or when you're able to cope with it, but you can't even imagine how many people around me are stuck when it comes to the english reading/speaking realm ... Moreother, I had some friends that switched to openSuse 11 recently , newcomers in windows so that they could easily agreed to learn something else instead of improving their windows skills, so very new users in Suse Linux and willing to discover it. Their first question was where to find documentation in french about applications and suse. Fabrice -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org

Martin Schlander

15:24

Onsdag 22 oktober 2008 12:58:41 skrev Stephan Binner:

...

So any idea what are we missing, how to reach and help Windows users better (this can be also feature requrests for future distro releases like [6])? :-)

One thing that strikes me particularly is pretty poor netbook support from openSUSE. These boxes are selling like crack, and they generally come with sucky limited operating systems that people wish to replace with something useful. Should be a great window of opportunity for openSUSE, but openSUSE isn't nearly the easiest distro to get on these things, and I'm not aware of any special effort being made to make openSUSE 11.1 the lord of the netbooks... Here are some more general remarks on the subject... I don't think the problem is attracting Windows users - I see a million n00bs on forums, irc and lug meetings trying out openSUSE every week. The problem is _keeping_ them on openSUSE or GNU/Linux in general imo. My impression is that most attempts at switching to GNU/Linux fail. And a lot of them even fail miserably. Because people don't know what to expect, they're not really motivated, they have noone to help them and online help is incredibly ineffecient compared to face to face help/demonstration - especially when people don't even know the absolute basics of anything. I think quite a few of these people end up angry and disappointed and discouraging others from trying GNU/Linux. Firstly we need to try and target "the right segments". In my opinion that's either: 1) young people/students with free time and some technical savvy and perhaps even some ethical ideals 2) middleaged and older people where the kids have left home and they don't really like the wife that much anymore, they have spare time and their computing needs are fairly simple. Secondly we need to figure out how to help, educate and motivate these people better. For help maybe a better and smaller quickstart guide - maybe 30-40 pages would be great. I an all modesty I think my Danish guide is a pretty good example of how it should be done (http://suse.linuxin.dk/). Some training/courses and more local user groups offering face-to-face support would be excellent - perhaps existing lugs could be used as a platform for this - in my lug we have weekly meetings in three different towns every week where people can get help (or just have fun) face to face. We need to motivate people more to switch. I'm not sure how to do this, but we should think of ways to brand openSUSE and GNU/Linux as a system for cool and intelligent people. Maybe by pushing the message of freedom, openness, open standards more... or maybe that just works on me :-) -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org

Claes Backstrom

16:17

On Wed, Oct 22, 2008 at 5:24 PM, Martin Schlander wrote:

...

Onsdag 22 oktober 2008 12:58:41 skrev Stephan Binner: One thing that strikes me particularly is pretty poor netbook support from openSUSE. These boxes are selling like crack, and they generally come with sucky limited operating systems that people wish to replace with something useful. Should be a great window of opportunity for openSUSE, but openSUSE isn't nearly the easiest distro to get on these things, and I'm not aware of any special effort being made to make openSUSE 11.1 the lord of the netbooks...

I am working to get 11.1 to work on the ASUS eeePC. I have a 701, 900 and 901 that I'm testing the beta releases on. And would gladly get help from others. Right now I have hit a bump in the road with the WIFI card in 901. Can't get it to build on factory... :-( Warm Regards, Claes Backstrom -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org

Stephan Binner

25 Oct 25 Oct

09:22

On Wednesday 22 October 2008 17:24:53 Martin Schlander wrote:

...

I'm not aware of any special effort being made to make openSUSE 11.1 the lord of the netbooks...

Well, Novell puts some efforts into netbook SLED preloads (where no Linux [Open Source] driver exist yet), but agreed that for other top sellers like eeePC some other distros like Mandriva do a better job.

...

Because people don't know what to expect, they're not really motivated, they have noone to help them and online help is incredibly ineffecient compared

So better education and documentation.

...

2) middleaged and older people where the kids have left home and they don't really like the wife that much anymore, they have spare time and their

Uhm, focus on people with relationship in trouble? :-)

...

For help maybe a better and smaller quickstart guide - maybe 30-40 pages

How have existing quickstart and user guides to change, or are they not read?

...

Some training/courses and more local user groups offering face-to-face

Web trainings? For comparision,for Ubuntu they're offered only for cash afaik. Bye, Steve -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org

Martin Schlander

10:38

Lørdag 25 oktober 2008 11:22:59 skrev Stephan Binner:

...

On Wednesday 22 October 2008 17:24:53 Martin Schlander wrote:

...
For help maybe a better and smaller quickstart guide - maybe 30-40 pages

How have existing quickstart and user guides to change, or are they not read?

The startup guide included in the box, and available as pdf and html, is certainly under-exposed - not many know about it. Even if they did I'm afraid it's a little too long to be considered a quick start guide - only very enthusiastic people will pick it up. It also suffers from not being able to cover such things as how to get support for multimedia codecs. What I have in mind is a little short guide of 1-3 pages per topic (installing packages, using a terminal, configuring network etc.), for the impatient. Almost like a pamphlet or something. A lot of electronic devices will have a little "Getting started quick" guide, alongside the full manual.

...

...
Some training/courses and more local user groups offering face-to-face

Web trainings? For comparision,for Ubuntu they're offered only for cash afaik.

Ideally real life training, but of course getting lecturers and rooms is difficult - doesn't have to be free (as in free beer) though. My lug is currently looking into creating a 6-8 lecture "Linux on the desktop for n00bs" course - each lecture covering a basic topic "installation", "desktops", "terminal", "free software/open source", "troubleshooting", "major applications", etc. Hopefully we can get if off the ground, and do it twice a year. Unfortunately there's still some debate as to whether it should be Ubuntu centric or distro agnostic.. damn hobbits are everywhere :-| Something like the videos included in the 11.0 German box set might also do the trick - if they were only done right, covering the right topics. Advanced use of OOo and GIMP or how to lose all your KDE data is all very nice. But a lot of new users give up in the first day or two I think - maybe 5-10 minute screencasts showing "howto add repositories and install packages", "basic use of a terminal", "how to configure network", "installing 3d blobs", "how to get multimedia support", "(proper) introduction to a KDE4 desktop" etc. This is also something that the community could do. The problem is just who can and will do a good job producing the screencasts - preferably a native English speaker - and how to make sure the stuff gets seen by as many people as possible. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org

Chris Coray

22 Oct 22 Oct

16:56

I agree with much of what has already been said. I think that one of our biggest assets for attracting new users, whether from Windows or elsewhere, is the web site. I don't feel we're utilizing it to its full extent right now. As a new user myself (I've been on Linux completely at work for about three weeks), I can relate to the frustrations that a new user feels. Steve (decriptor) came to my office when I told him I'd made the switch to openSUSE 11.0 after a bad Windows crash, and he showed me things on the website like the 1-click installs section and other resources that probably would have taken me a long time to realize are even there. I think Martin is on the right track with his quickstart guide. If we had a section that was clearly for beginners with links to the various resources on the site, I think it would help. If you want to convert the Windows user, in my opinion WINE and some of the emulators don't cut it. The best thing to do is sell them on the "right tool for the right job" attitude. Inform them about GRUB and how easy it is to set up a Windows/openSUSE partition with the installation software. They can use Linux for surfing the web, office productivity, etc., and leave the Windows partition for gaming or other use. A lot of this would simply be creating pages with links to existing resources, both on and off opensuse.org. The information is out there, we just expect that people are computer-savvy enough to go through and type "YaST repository configuration" in the search bar, and then to have it provide the exact results they want. The search function, while it works, does not allow for operators (so typing in "YaST repository configuration" with the quotation marks will return all references to YaST, repository, and configuration). If we had a beginner section with clearly laid out FAQs, I personally feel it would be more inviting and less intimidating. I realize this isn't an entirely original idea, but I also have no idea what the status of it is. If we could get some volunteers to help gather this information (such as Martin's quickstart guide), I could try and start to put something together using the current page template. On the flip side, we've got some great ideas here - which one do we focus on? What is the most valuable for right now? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org

Joe 'Zonker' Brockmeier

17:26

On 10/22/2008 06:58 AM, Stephan Binner wrote:

...

Hello,

without doubt the current MS Windows users are the biggest chunk which we can and want to make switch to openSUSE. But IMO we are are not targetting marke- ting and development efforts to that goal enough. We have some good pieces in place or development like InstLux[1] or Mango[2] and some (rather thin) docu- mentation [3,4] but we can and should do better as others do a better job [5].

So any idea what are we missing, how to reach and help Windows users better (this can be also feature requrests for future distro releases like [6])? :-)

Do we, in the marketing area, want to get involved with feature requests? I'm thinking that's a bit of feature creep, in terms of what the scope of -marketing is, but I'm interested in feedback. (OTOH, we might want as a group to research what features users most want.) Best, Zonker

...

For inspirations maybe also have a look at what Apple and its user community are doing with the "Apple Switcher" campaign, tutorials and help sites.

Bye, Steve

[0] http://www.benkevan.com/blog/switching-from-windows-to-linux-what-you-need-t... [1] http://en.opensuse.org/Instlux [2] http://en.opensuse.org/Mango [3] http://en.opensuse.org/How_to_migrate_from_Windows [4] http://en.opensuse.org/Application_Equivalents [5] https://help.ubuntu.com/community/SwitchingToUbuntu/FromWindows [6] https://features.opensuse.org/?rm=feature_show&id=305308

-- Joe 'Zonker' Brockmeier openSUSE Community Manager http://zonker.opensuse.org/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org

Hekkro

23 Oct 23 Oct

12:06

Marketing, Marketing and Marketing.... to get us known everywhere....that's what is missing, not focusing only on internet presence. How....(imo)....via the traditional models....Leaflets, Flyers, Pamphlets and Posters. Let me share an experience, I was part of the organization committee of the Software Freedom Day Singapore. And although I wanted to have an OpenSuse booth, I didn't have the time for everything, and I mean, to design the material from scratch. I did a search and couldn't find anything. But Team Ubuntu Singapore....oh man...they have it all!!! And it was as easy as visit their website and download what they want...Flyers, Leaflets, Banners, Posters, Pamphlets...everything!!! And of course, the veneered Ubuntu Stickers and Ubuntu DVDs, they got them from their HQ. For them it was a success...for me...mmm, how do you call it....(Green) Envy, maybe... So why not to organize a contest to get all this covered. Kind of an Event Marketing Kit, and be ready for the next event near us! These should not only mention Opensuse's Features...but what else is inside (applications). What do you think? Regards, Hekkro Joe 'Zonker' Brockmeier wrote:

...

On 10/22/2008 06:58 AM, Stephan Binner wrote:

...
Hello,

without doubt the current MS Windows users are the biggest chunk which we can and want to make switch to openSUSE. But IMO we are are not targetting marke- ting and development efforts to that goal enough. We have some good pieces in place or development like InstLux[1] or Mango[2] and some (rather thin) docu- mentation [3,4] but we can and should do better as others do a better job [5].

So any idea what are we missing, how to reach and help Windows users better (this can be also feature requrests for future distro releases like [6])? :-)

Do we, in the marketing area, want to get involved with feature requests?

I'm thinking that's a bit of feature creep, in terms of what the scope of -marketing is, but I'm interested in feedback.

(OTOH, we might want as a group to research what features users most want.)

Best,

Zonker

...
For inspirations maybe also have a look at what Apple and its user community are doing with the "Apple Switcher" campaign, tutorials and help sites.

Bye, Steve

[0] http://www.benkevan.com/blog/switching-from-windows-to-linux-what-you-need-t...

[1] http://en.opensuse.org/Instlux [2] http://en.opensuse.org/Mango [3] http://en.opensuse.org/How_to_migrate_from_Windows [4] http://en.opensuse.org/Application_Equivalents [5] https://help.ubuntu.com/community/SwitchingToUbuntu/FromWindows [6] https://features.opensuse.org/?rm=feature_show&id=305308

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Martin Lasarsch

12:15

On Thursday 23 October 2008 14:06:03 Hekkro wrote:

...

So why not to organize a contest to get all this covered. Kind of an Event Marketing Kit, and be ready for the next event near us! These should not only mention Opensuse's Features...but what else is inside (applications).

We are working on it to support events better, see the spokesperson thread. -- with kind regards, Martin Lasarsch, Core Services SUSE LINUX Products GmbH, Maxfeldstr. 5 90409 Nürnberg GF: Markus Rex, HRB 16746 (AG Nürnberg) martin.lasarsch@suse.de - http://www.opensuse.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org

manchette

12:32

In terms of helping newcomers from other OS experience : We have these people buying netbooks massively recently, they often are coming from windows and need help when Linux is the OS of the new toy ... An example with SLED 10 sp1 (Msi wind U90x machine for example ). They're not professionals for all of them and are thus willing firefox 3.0.3 and recent applications . They've got no clue how to update their applications or to install openSuse 11 (for example) They are coming from a different world and should find very easily ways to upgrade/update applications or to install opensuse 11 if needed. So in terms of features needed : simple tools like the following : -Why not summarise the netbooks on the market and see which ones are supported by which OS ? It'd be nice, so that we won't have to wonder if Atom will work ok or not , 512 mb of ram is this enough ... and the like . - An easy install guide as discussed before will also do for this kind of users. Fabrice -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org

Gabriel Franco

13:02

I mentioned on one of the previous threads the idea of a mentoring program on openSuSE. Have a person or group of people nominated as openSuSE Migration Mentor for example and they would be the focal point of the new comers to ask for help (even if it is to show them the forums and wikis we have available for support). Also the idea of the spokesperson for different regions would help cover the need of someone to get the information going. To Walk the Talk (how we call it on the company we work), get the info that people usually find difficult to get and make them flow easilly to everyone. 2008/10/23 manchette :

...

In terms of helping newcomers from other OS experience : We have these people buying netbooks massively recently, they often are coming from windows and need help when Linux is the OS of the new toy ... An example with SLED 10 sp1 (Msi wind U90x machine for example ). They're not professionals for all of them and are thus willing firefox 3.0.3 and recent applications . They've got no clue how to update their applications or to install openSuse 11 (for example) They are coming from a different world and should find very easily ways to upgrade/update applications or to install opensuse 11 if needed.

So in terms of features needed : simple tools like the following : -Why not summarise the netbooks on the market and see which ones are supported by which OS ? It'd be nice, so that we won't have to wonder if Atom will work ok or not , 512 mb of ram is this enough ... and the like . - An easy install guide as discussed before will also do for this kind of users.

Fabrice

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Stephan Binner

25 Oct 25 Oct

09:03

On Wednesday 22 October 2008 19:26:06 Joe 'Zonker' Brockmeier wrote:

...

Do we, in the marketing area, want to get involved with feature requests?

Requesting features is open for anyone (well, not yet on features.o.o, and we want to foster submitting ideas too) so I don't see how this excludes someone also engaging in marketing from giving feedback. :-) Bye, Steve -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org

Andrew Wafaa

29 Oct 29 Oct

09:03

On Wed, 22 Oct 2008 12:58:41 +0200 Stephan Binner wrote:

...

Hello,

without doubt the current MS Windows users are the biggest chunk which we can and want to make switch to openSUSE. But IMO we are are not targetting marke- ting and development efforts to that goal enough. We have some good pieces in place or development like InstLux[1] or Mango[2] and some (rather thin) docu- mentation [3,4] but we can and should do better as others do a better job [5].

So any idea what are we missing, how to reach and help Windows users better (this can be also feature requrests for future distro releases like [6])? :-)

For inspirations maybe also have a look at what Apple and its user community are doing with the "Apple Switcher" campaign, tutorials and help sites.

Bye, Steve

[0] http://www.benkevan.com/blog/switching-from-windows-to-linux-what-you-need-t... [1] http://en.opensuse.org/Instlux [2] http://en.opensuse.org/Mango [3] http://en.opensuse.org/How_to_migrate_from_Windows [4] http://en.opensuse.org/Application_Equivalents [5] https://help.ubuntu.com/community/SwitchingToUbuntu/FromWindows [6] https://features.opensuse.org/?rm=feature_show&id=305308

One of the key factors in getting uptake from Windows users is exposure, or lack there of. This is where the -edu guys and gals can help us and we can help them. Here in the UK at the start of each school term Microsoft do a huge advertising campaign, focused on students _and_ parents. This needs to be responded to. I'm not saying openSUSE has to do it alone, but maybe we could lead the charge? When I say we shouldn't do it alone, I mean soliciting the help of other key Open Source projects i.e. OpenOffice, GNOME, KDE etc. Heck we could even solicit the help of other distros! I also think doing a "RoadShow" style marketing campaign directed at schools and other establishments (Scouts/Youth Centres/etc) would help raise the profile of the Open Source Community and openSUSE. Working with other projects in this way will generate good publicity for openSUSE and show the community at large that we are not reliant on the proprietary pimping of our sponsor, and are a serious player and advocate in the Open Source sphere. Regards, Andy -- Andrew Wafaa, openSUSE Member: GNOME / Marketing. openSUSE: Get It, Discover It, Create It at http://www.opensuse.org awafaa@opensuse.org | http://www.wafaa.eu -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org

manchette

13:16

Is there a list of sites (or the ones you know of) where it is possible to buy desktop or laptop pcs with Suse as default ? This could be a good way to attract users to Suse. Thanks ;=) Fabrice -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org

ricardo varas s

14:07

I have not seen any =(, only Dell offering PCs/notebooks with ubuntu (not the latest release thou) installed, and it's not even like any of their machines can have it, just a few models. Greetings, -Ricardo V. --- On Wed, 10/29/08, manchette wrote:

...

From: manchette Subject: Re: [opensuse-marketing] Attracting Windows Users To: opensuse-marketing@opensuse.org Date: Wednesday, October 29, 2008, 10:16 AM Is there a list of sites (or the ones you know of) where it is possible to buy desktop or laptop pcs with Suse as default ? This could be a good way to attract users to Suse. Thanks ;=) Fabrice -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org

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Andrew Wafaa

14:26

On Wed, 29 Oct 2008 14:16:07 +0100 manchette wrote:

...

Is there a list of sites (or the ones you know of) where it is possible to buy desktop or laptop pcs with Suse as default ? This could be a good way to attract users to Suse. Thanks ;=) Fabrice

Fabrice, Almost all of the SUSE pre-loads are SLED, multiple reasons for this which hopefully someone in the know in Novell can expand on. I think it comes down to support (as in telephone/e-mail/etc) and also hardware binary drivers. I've only seen Shuttle provide openSUSE with *some* of their PCs [0]. Unfortunately Ubuntu had managed to create such a hysteria around their distro that vendors believed the hype (and if I was synical, which I am sometimes, I'd say they also took a kickback too ;) ). Regards, Andy [0] - http://eu.shuttle.com/en/Desktopdefault.aspx/tabid-53/140_read-14333/ -- Andrew Wafaa, openSUSE Member: GNOME / Marketing. openSUSE: Get It, Discover It, Create It at http://www.opensuse.org awafaa@opensuse.org | http://www.wafaa.eu -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org

manchette

15:09

Thank you ;-) i asked for a guy who was lookling a laptop with Suse or would go to Os x, i was not able to answer him (i'm kindof 'against' laptops and can't tell a lot about them). Well, in fact i've got this impression that apart from a few geeks that are into computers in their jobs or because they're curious enough people just do not care about the motor inside their pc, they just look for something that works. I visited friends with windows xp the other day, i was amazed they were still using internet explorer default version, and had pop ups each 5 minutes on their screen ! , it was no problem for them : they're just used to it ! So, it's our "job" to show them there is an alternative. I'm convinced Suse it's one of the best distro around , but it's so unknown it's a pity. This underunlines a vast margin of progress, specifically in the communication field in the openSuse/free software realm. Fabrice Andrew Wafaa a écrit :

...

On Wed, 29 Oct 2008 14:16:07 +0100 manchette wrote:

...
Is there a list of sites (or the ones you know of) where it is possible to buy desktop or laptop pcs with Suse as default ? This could be a good way to attract users to Suse. Thanks ;=) Fabrice

Fabrice,

Almost all of the SUSE pre-loads are SLED, multiple reasons for this which hopefully someone in the know in Novell can expand on. I think it comes down to support (as in telephone/e-mail/etc) and also hardware binary drivers.

I've only seen Shuttle provide openSUSE with *some* of their PCs [0]. Unfortunately Ubuntu had managed to create such a hysteria around their distro that vendors believed the hype (and if I was synical, which I am sometimes, I'd say they also took a kickback too ;) ).

Regards,

Andy

[0] - http://eu.shuttle.com/en/Desktopdefault.aspx/tabid-53/140_read-14333/

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participants (12)

Andrew Wafaa
Chris Coray
Claes Backstrom
Gabriel Franco
Hekkro
Joe 'Zonker' Brockmeier
manchette
Martin Lasarsch
Martin Schlander
ricardo varas s
Rupert Horstkötter
Stephan Binner