Am 26. Februar 2021 00:01:35 MEZ schrieb "Carlos E. R."
Nobody appears to know, not even Per.
I told Per as much as I know, he has access to the mailing lists in the same capacity as I
do, has hopefully seen the tickets related to this on opensuse-admin on progress. Added
him to subscribers of moderators mailing list so he sees as much as everyone else.
I'm not hiding anything, moderators aren't hidden from him.
As the board, last year, we announced the moderation effort publicly to openSUSE Project
mailing list. We answered questions and concerns to the best of our ability.
Look, recently someone had a problem with
unsubscribing. He wrote to the
owner, the owner replied, said he would handle it, then disappeared (he
had handled out wrong instructions, meanwhile). The person complained to
the mail list, and then Per jumped to the rescue.
Probably worth noting that the moderators aren't just men ;)
That's fun, I wonder how the owner system in mailman works. Considering we have a
bunch of dead emails and/or no emails set up for owners and moderators of some lists, that
has to be a magic experience for our users.
Tell me what else we can do to satisfy that mailing list though: I'm really trying my
best to have working systems based on which the project can work its best, facilitate the
contributors and help the users. All I get in return is unconstructive criticism, which
doesn't even land at the hands of the people it's pointing fingers at, basically
an equivalent of publicly talking behind someone's back. Can we please do better than
That happens literally every time I make a change in the project, my work is shunned on
the users mailing list, and I only learn about the shunning a few weeks later from a
random person who more often than not has nothing to do with it. There are plenty of
official ways to contact the people who make the project go, to report your issues and
concerns directly to the developers. However instead the people on that mailing list
choose to be not just rude, but also actively work against getting their issues fixed. I
honestly give up trying to understand this logic.
In addition, since I made this pretty personal for no particular reason, this doesn't
affect just me, I know plenty of people who left the project because of this god awful
approach to other people's work specifically on the mailing lists. Mailing lists
being the primary way to contact a large portion of the developer base make it impossible
to avoid all of this too. Let me just say this: if you don't see the problem, you are
openSUSE isn't just a project that exists to keep the same old people satisfied, old
people have the unfortunate disadvantage of being more prone to die. It's our duty to
help the newbies to be able to use and contribute to the openSUSE Project in the same
capacity as any other person around. This means not talking crap on somebody's work
behind their back, reporting appropriate issues, working with the developers on resolving
your problems. We are supposed to be a community, all I see is making it hard to feel like
open source is the right way to have the developers feel like they are doing something
Sorry for the language,