Hello, an addendum On Apr 15 16:25 Johannes Meixner wrote (shortened):

On Apr 15 16:06 Stephan Kulow wrote (shortened):

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Open requests are basically everything installed by the DVD and is not from the CD. This includes e.g.: ... - the complete printing locally stack (e.g. drivers, filters)

If a printing locally stack is possible at all one can omit the following packages because they are not strictly required:

cups-backends usually not needed at all

ghostscript-omni usually not needed at all, see https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=492690#c2

gutenprint recommended well working driver in particular for Epson printers but cups-drivers already provides basic support

hplip recommended perfectly working driver for HP printers but cups-drivers already provides basic support and hplip pulls in sane-backends scanner driver stuff

manufacturer-PPDs recommended perfectly working PPDs for PostScript printers but cups already provides basic support Kind Regards Johannes Meixner -- SUSE LINUX Products GmbH, Maxfeldstrasse 5, 90409 Nuernberg, Germany AG Nuernberg, HRB 16746, GF: Markus Rex -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Stephan Kulow a écrit :

You can boot into runlevel 1 or 2 and call yast2 live-installer - is that what you're asking to be automated? If so, just provide a patch.

I see. I could try it with 11.0 cd. Install is extreeeeeeeemely slow (going from a YaST screen to an other - virtualbox, 512Mo ram) and not in graphic mode (may be usefull) and I don't see any menu.lst in the install and have no idea how the boot options are managed may be is could simply be an option in the Fx secondary menu - even a comment should be good jdd -- http://www.dodin.net http://valerie.dodin.org http://news.opensuse.org/2009/04/13/people-of-opensuse-jean-daniel-dodin/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

On Wednesday 15 April 2009 19:31:52 jdd wrote:

did you notice the build 52 is 440 *ko*

Yeah, the build service loves to do such things ;( Greetings, Stephan -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Am Mittwoch 15 April 2009 schrieb Vincent Untz:

Le mercredi 15 avril 2009, à 16:06 +0200, Stephan Kulow a écrit :

...

Open requests are basically everything installed by the DVD and is not from the CD. This includes e.g.:

- gimp - java runtime - beagle - the complete printing locally stack (e.g. drivers, filters) - 4 more text editors - 3 more shells

And there is the request to include more languages on the livecd. This is actually my preferred solution - as I see the live cd use case (smaller download) more visible in countries that speak languages other languages than german and english. If you look at http://en.opensuse.org/Statistics, this would mean: russian, italian, spanish, spanish, polish, french (as it fits).

I'd go with gimp and languages. At the moment, the fact that we only have two languages (iirc) on the livecd is really bad for most countries...

Do you know how many languages we could add? (or do you first need the languages to check the size they require?)

With compression I'm unable to guess. So I would have to add language by language once we know it's the way to go. Greetings, Stephan -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Il mercoledì 15 aprile 2009, Greg Freemyer scrisse:

My ideal would be to download just the KDE liveCD and then use it plus the online repositories to upgrade my various computers. This should be great ! Maybe someone can put this in FATE.. Bye.

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Il mercoledì 15 aprile 2009, jdd scrisse:

Daniele a écrit :

...

Il mercoledì 15 aprile 2009, Greg Freemyer scrisse:

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My ideal would be to download just the KDE liveCD and then use it plus the online repositories to upgrade my various computers.

This should be great ! Maybe someone can put this in FATE.. Bye.

why don't use the mini cd for that? yes but mini/net cd is "only" useful for update/installation. I always download both, net install is my preferred way for new installation or upgrade. Live CD for testing or rescue system... Live CD with a full installer should be a must!

Oh well, waiting for Kulow requesting patch :)) Bye. -- *** Linux user # 198661 ---_ ICQ 33500725 *** *** Home http://www.kailed.net *** *** Powered by openSUSE *** -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Il mercoledì 15 aprile 2009, Stephan Kulow scrisse:

On Wednesday 15 April 2009 19:32:26 Daniele wrote:

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yes but mini/net cd is "only" useful for update/installation. I always download both, net install is my preferred way for new installation or upgrade. Live CD for testing or rescue system... Live CD with a full installer should be a must!

Yeah, a CD that has the full DVD would be cool. Perhaps one of the readers can do magic? You don't need magic, but a full repo avaible (local/network). Bye.

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On Wed, Apr 15, 2009 at 12:17 PM, Larry Stotler wrote:

On Wed, Apr 15, 2009 at 10:06 AM, Stephan Kulow wrote:

...

So I ask: what do you think I should add. Open requests are basically everything installed by the DVD and is not from the CD.

1. You can get rid of beagle as far as I'm concerned. It's got severe performance issues and I remove it from my machines right after an install. 2. Both Evolution and Thunderbird ought to be there. 3. On the Gnome CD, you can get rid of XChat -- Pidgin does pretty good IRC now. On the KDE CD, Kopete is enough. 4. If there's room, put on Base Development, C/C++ Development and Linux kernel development patterns. 5. All of the gvim - vim-enhanced - vim-data and emacs. 6. Maybe some gizmo like Ubuntu has to go out and grab the proprietary drivers for your sound, wireless, video, etc. after an install. 7. Make an XFCE LiveCD?? -- M. Edward (Ed) Borasky http://www.linkedin.com/in/edborasky I've never met a happy clam. In fact, most of them were pretty steamed. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

M. Edward (Ed) Borasky wrote:

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7. Make an XFCE LiveCD??

+1 - xfce4 has long been my desktop of choice for anything more than a few years old. It runs really well even on machines sporting a Pentium 1 and 256M!

With all the space freed by that change there would be room for the development stuff...

Richard (MQ) a écrit : this could be a studio work. but are studio images available to anybody?? thanks jdd -- http://www.dodin.net http://valerie.dodin.org http://news.opensuse.org/2009/04/13/people-of-opensuse-jean-daniel-dodin/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Stephan Kulow wrote:

Am Donnerstag 16 April 2009 schrieb Richard (MQ):

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M. Edward (Ed) Borasky wrote:

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7. Make an XFCE LiveCD?? +1 - xfce4 has long been my desktop of choice for anything more than a few years old. It runs really well even on machines sporting a Pentium 1 and 256M!

Will you maintain the live cd?

Stephan, I'm not sure how much you're inviting volunteers and how much pointing out the consequences of such an action? I've no experience building or maintaining a live CD so I've no idea of the work load involved (though I suspect it's a fair amount). It might be worth adding at this point that DSL (Damn Small Linux) already offers an excellent live CD with xfce4 - there's no point in trying to compete with it. what could we (openSuSE) add that they don't have, apart from the completely different package management - DSL is Debian based. Finally, I frequently use openSuSE with xfce4, and I know that a live CD would be much quicker than the existing KDE / gnome ones. This does matter, especially on older hardware. -- Cheers Richard (MQ) -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Am Donnerstag 16 April 2009 schrieb M. Edward (Ed) Borasky:

On Wed, Apr 15, 2009 at 12:17 PM, Larry Stotler wrote:

...

On Wed, Apr 15, 2009 at 10:06 AM, Stephan Kulow wrote:

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So I ask: what do you think I should add. Open requests are basically everything installed by the DVD and is not from the CD.

1. You can get rid of beagle as far as I'm concerned. It's got severe performance issues and I remove it from my machines right after an install. 2. Both Evolution and Thunderbird ought to be there. For what reason?

3. On the Gnome CD, you can get rid of XChat -- Pidgin does pretty good IRC now. On the KDE CD, Kopete is enough. The GNOME team has a different oppinion - bnc#381620

4. If there's room, put on Base Development, C/C++ Development and Linux kernel development patterns. Yeah, right. Did you read my mail at all?

5. All of the gvim - vim-enhanced - vim-data and emacs. For what reason?

Greetings, Stephan -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Am Donnerstag 16 April 2009 schrieb jdd:

Stephan Kulow a écrit :

...

...

5. All of the gvim - vim-enhanced - vim-data and emacs.

For what reason?

vim is good (but isn't it already there?) because the live cd is often used for debugging a crashed system

That doesn't answer the question though. He claims "all of gvim and emacs" Greetings, Stephan -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Stephan Kulow a écrit :

That doesn't answer the question though. He claims "all of gvim

gvim is better, but I can live without and emacs" emacs is much bigger, I don't see the use here jdd -- http://www.dodin.net http://valerie.dodin.org http://news.opensuse.org/2009/04/13/people-of-opensuse-jean-daniel-dodin/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Carlos E. R. a écrit :

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vim is good (but isn't it already there?) because the live cd is often used for debugging a crashed system

Which is why I propose a specialized set of cds instead. I have use for a rescue cd more than for the normal cd :-)

well, there are. in fact there should be an answer if studio images are available for all, because specialized CD's are not worth mirrorring. elsewhere, we can have DSL, puppy linux or partition magic (all small or rescue live cd's). We could also use these as template to create openSUSE ones (let only to have YaST, the usual init structure.... all the things we are used to in openSUSE) I beg in studio such images could be maintained quite easily (after the first run), but I don't know exactly what studio is able to do (and I have no time to try) jdd -- http://www.dodin.net http://valerie.dodin.org http://news.opensuse.org/2009/04/13/people-of-opensuse-jean-daniel-dodin/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Le lundi 20 avril 2009, à 19:04 -0500, Kevin Yeaux Dupuy a écrit :

Other than those comments, I *do* want to see The GIMP - also, is Cheese included in the GNOME Live CD? If not, that'd be interesting to have in the live CD.

Oh, cheese totally makes sense. It's one of the apps that we always show on all GNOME booths, since that's something people really enjoy. Vincent -- Les gens heureux ne sont pas pressés. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Am Mittwoch 15 April 2009 schrieb Larry Stotler:

On Wed, Apr 15, 2009 at 10:06 AM, Stephan Kulow wrote:

...

So I ask: what do you think I should add. Open requests are basically everything installed by the DVD and is not from the CD.

How about the ability to only install select packages instead of having to install the default selection and then remove after. Like being able to remove openoffice?

Use the NET ISOs. There are no packages on the livecd! It's a live system. If you want single package selection, use the NET ISOs. Greetings, Stephan -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

...

...

On 4/16/2009 at 04:29 PM, in message <78a1326c0904160359u7372005fqa9f142582fe57649@mail.gmail.com>, Andrew Wafaa wrote: 2009/4/15 Stephan Kulow : So I ask: what do you think I should add.

Personally I would vote for the following: 1. More languages 2. Printer stack 3. Java 4. GIMP

The most common thing that my friends do is watch youtube videos. So to make live cd experience enjoyable, it may be good to package flash plugins by default (gnash - free flash player ?) . -- Sankar -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

On Thursday 16 April 2009 15:36:41 Carlos E. R. wrote:

I'm interested in that "doenerfs". Google finds nothing of interest (just "Hermes - Notification Client" and "git.opensuse.org Git"). Perhaps it might be of use for creating backups on CD/DVD :-? Just use xz for backups? doenerfs is not a generic file system. But it lives on git.opensuse.org, so google isn't that wrong :)

...

So I ask: what do you think I should add.

Wish? Specialized CD images... ;-) Why does anyone make this a "what I always wanted to say about CDs" thread?

Like one for rescue and net install (could even install itself on HD). Partitioning, data recovery, network diagnosis, whatever. Small X (not kde nor gnome). YaST. Boot another installed system on HD. Midnight commander, iptraf, ethereal. Wifi utils.

For the standard CD, I'd vote for languages first, then perhaps java and flash for full browsing. Beagle certainly not (what for? it is a R/O filesystem)

Well, the live cd is r/o, but it's installable Greetings, Stephan -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Le vendredi 17 avril 2009, à 00:56 +0200, Carlos E. R. a écrit :

On Thursday, 2009-04-16 at 21:09 +0200, Stephan Kulow wrote:

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On Thursday 16 April 2009 15:36:41 Carlos E. R. wrote:

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Wish? Specialized CD images... ;-) Why does anyone make this a "what I always wanted to say about CDs" thread?

You asked what we would like on the cd... O:-)

You forgot the context... Stephan pointed out we have a bit more space on livecd now, so he proposed specific things we could add to the current livecd. He didn't ask "what kind of livecd should we have?" (not saying your idea is bad -- it's just off-topic for the original question) [...]

...

...

For the standard CD, I'd vote for languages first, then perhaps java and flash for full browsing. Beagle certainly not (what for? it is a R/O filesystem)

Well, the live cd is r/o, but it's installable

Yes, but probably a small install, or for evaluation: beagle is not really needed there; and it can be installed from internet, as many other interesting packages

Other distributions are making their livecd the primary way for installation, so there'll be users who think it's the same for openSUSE. (again, not saying beagle should be on the livecd, just disagreeing with your argument; my argument is that languages are more important than beagle) Vincent -- Les gens heureux ne sont pas pressés. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

On Fri, 2009-04-17 at 00:56 +0200, Carlos E. R. wrote:

On Thursday, 2009-04-16 at 21:09 +0200, Stephan Kulow wrote:

...

Well, the live cd is r/o, but it's installable

Yes, but probably a small install, or for evaluation: beagle is not really needed there; and it can be installed from internet, as many other interesting packages

Anyway, remember that beagle is conflictive, better leave it out ;-)

Although I do install with the DVD, and not the Live CD, most new users coming to Linux are probably going to want to use Live CDs (the only exceptions might be openSUSE Retail Edition users), since it gives them a chance to test the system and use it. And I wouldn't say that we should leave Beagle out at all. Perhaps turn it off be default (so upon first time doing a search in the Computer or Kickoff menu, it asks you if you'd like to turn on Desktop Search) as to calm the "Beagle... it's killing my computer!" crowd that seem to have problems with it. It's already in the current Live CD install, so why take it out? -- Kevin "Yeaux" Dupuy openSUSE Member www.twitter.com/KevinDupuy -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Rajko M. a écrit :

Many mistakes that are done in previous releases was attempt to read a crystal ball

or same than for install config: choice between "automated" and "guided" jdd -- http://www.dodin.net http://valerie.dodin.org http://news.opensuse.org/2009/04/13/people-of-opensuse-jean-daniel-dodin/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

On Saturday 18 April 2009 09:23:31 Stephan Binner wrote:

2. OpenOffice.org/KDE (for KDE Live-CD) if Fate#304879 is not happening

That should read "independ if" - without it would be bigger of course. Bye, Steve -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Stephan Kulow a écrit :

Mozilla sounds like a good idea, OOo I would like to push into an online update.

as of ozilla, I noticed Puppy Linux (<100Mb live) used seamonkey, that is much smaller for same result just an idea. and digikam is good (it was, hope it will stay), because there is no replacement for it and now only live dvd have it (on other distros) jdd -- http://www.dodin.net http://valerie.dodin.org http://news.opensuse.org/2009/04/13/people-of-opensuse-jean-daniel-dodin/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Wolfgang Rosenauer a écrit :

Some details. SeaMonkey 2.0 has mail completely packaged

yes, and html editor, so only once the library jdd -- http://www.dodin.net http://valerie.dodin.org http://news.opensuse.org/2009/04/13/people-of-opensuse-jean-daniel-dodin/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Stephan Kulow napsal(a):

On Monday 20 April 2009 17:27:07 Ladislav Slezak wrote:

...

Stephan Kulow wrote:

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So I ask: what do you think I should add. Please, add

alsa-firmware

it is required by some sound cards to work properly. See bnc#396109 for more details.

That's a 11.0 bug and the bug is open because alsa-firmware is supposed to be split.

The split was planned because of the lack of space on live CDs, but if 11.2 will be compressed much better we could add full alsa-firmware package without split. It's quite small, about 7MB unpacked and the RPM has about 2MB. Thank you. -- Best Regards Ladislav Slezák Yast Developer ------------------------------------------------------------------------ SUSE LINUX, s.r.o. e-mail: lslezak@suse.cz Lihovarská 1060/12 tel: +420 284 028 960 190 00 Prague 9 fax: +420 284 028 951 Czech Republic http://www.suse.cz/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Ladislav Slezak wrote:

Stephan Kulow wrote:

...

So I ask: what do you think I should add.

Please, add

alsa-firmware

it is required by some sound cards to work properly. See bnc#396109 for more details.

--

Best Regards

Ladislav Slezák Yast Developer ------------------------------------------------------------------------ SUSE LINUX, s.r.o. e-mail: lslezak@suse.cz Lihovarská 1060/12 tel: +420 284 028 960 190 00 Prague 9 fax: +420 284 028 951 Czech Republic http://www.suse.cz/

Strangely, I hit this problem this evening with a EMU-0404 PCI card added in after a new x86_64 11.1 install and update to factory. I didn't see the problem with another box on 11.2 Alpha0 x86_64 when I added it. dmesg said:- ALSA sound/pci/emu10k1/emu10k1_main.c:874: emu1010: Loading Firmware file emu/emu0404.fw failed Went googling for emu0404.fw and found http://www.novell.com/products/linuxpackages/desktop11/i386/alsa-firmware.ht... Just chanced my arm with "zypper in alsa-firmware" and success. # rmmod snd-emu10k1 # modprobe snd-emu10k1 EMU10K1_Audigy 0000:01:08.0: PCI INT A -> Link[APC1] -> GSI 16 (level, low) -> IRQ 16 ALSA sound/pci/emu10k1/emu10k1_main.c:811: emu1010: Special config. ALSA sound/pci/emu10k1/emu10k1_main.c:850: emu1010: EMU_HANA_ID = 0x3f ALSA sound/pci/emu10k1/emu10k1_main.c:869: emu1010: filename emu/emu0404.fw testing EMU10K1_Audigy 0000:01:08.0: firmware: requesting emu/emu0404.fw ALSA sound/pci/emu10k1/emu10k1_main.c:674: firmware size = 0xd67c ALSA sound/pci/emu10k1/emu10k1_main.c:886: emu1010: Hana Firmware loaded ALSA sound/pci/emu10k1/emu10k1_main.c:889: emu1010: Hana version: 1.1 ALSA sound/pci/emu10k1/emu10k1_main.c:894: emu1010: Card options = 0x1 ALSA sound/pci/emu10k1/emu10k1_main.c:896: emu1010: Card options = 0x1 ALSA sound/pci/emu10k1/emu10k1_main.c:935: emu1010: Card options3 = 0x1 ALSA sound/pci/emu10k1/emu10k1_main.c:219: Audigy2 value: Special config. ALSA sound/pci/emu10k1/emufx.c:1522: EMU outputs on ALSA sound/pci/emu10k1/emufx.c:1570: EMU2 inputs on Regards Sid. -- Sid Boyce ... Hamradio License G3VBV, Licensed Private Pilot Emeritus IBM/Amdahl Mainframes and Sun/Fujitsu Servers Tech Support Specialist, Cricket Coach Microsoft Windows Free Zone - Linux used for all Computing Tasks -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org