[opensuse-buildservice] openSUSE:Tools suddenly missing its Tumbleweed Repo?
Hi guys, I updated my tumbleweed machine today (have not done so in a week or so?), and got an error, as the Tumbleweed repo for openSUSE:Tools was no longer existing. Apparently it is now called ".../openSUSE:/Tools/openSUSE_Factory/" and builds against openSUSE:Factory/snapshot. Any reason why this is no longer called Tumbleweed? When adding repos to my home project I always get a repo called Tumbleweed, that builds against openSUSE:Factory/snapshot. I know, technically it is the same, but it is not helping with the whole factory-or-tumbleweed naming confusion... Johannes
On Dienstag, 28. März 2017, 09:32:58 CEST wrote Johannes Kastl:
Hi guys,
I updated my tumbleweed machine today (have not done so in a week or so?), and got an error, as the Tumbleweed repo for openSUSE:Tools was no longer existing.
Apparently it is now called ".../openSUSE:/Tools/openSUSE_Factory/" and builds against openSUSE:Factory/snapshot.
it existed with that name since the beginning.
Any reason why this is no longer called Tumbleweed? When adding repos to my home project I always get a repo called Tumbleweed, that builds against openSUSE:Factory/snapshot.
someone created that for some time, but I did not want to have double builds, so I dropped the newer one again. -- Adrian Schroeter email: adrian@suse.de SUSE Linux GmbH, GF: Felix Imendörffer, Jane Smithard, Graham Norton, HRB 21284 (AG Nürnberg) Maxfeldstraße 5 90409 Nürnberg Germany -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice+owner@opensuse.org
On 28.03.17 09:34 Adrian Schröter wrote:
On Dienstag, 28. März 2017, 09:32:58 CEST wrote Johannes Kastl:
Any reason why this is no longer called Tumbleweed? When adding repos to my home project I always get a repo called Tumbleweed, that builds against openSUSE:Factory/snapshot.
someone created that for some time, but I did not want to have double builds, so I dropped the newer one again.
I would have preferred to have it named tumbleweed, to avoid the confusion, but I understand building twice is kind of superfluous... Thanks for clarifying. Johannes
On Tuesday 2017-03-28 09:36, Johannes Kastl wrote:
On 28.03.17 09:34 Adrian Schröter wrote:
On Dienstag, 28. März 2017, 09:32:58 CEST wrote Johannes Kastl:
Any reason why this is no longer called Tumbleweed? When adding repos to my home project I always get a repo called Tumbleweed, that builds against openSUSE:Factory/snapshot.
someone created that for some time, but I did not want to have double builds, so I dropped the newer one again.
I would have preferred to have it named tumbleweed, to avoid the confusion, but I understand building twice is kind of superfluous...
Can't you just use an _aggregate if you really want to have both "Tumbleweed" and "Factory"? Saves the rebuild.. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice+owner@opensuse.org
On Dienstag, 28. März 2017, 09:50:38 CEST wrote Jan Engelhardt:
On Tuesday 2017-03-28 09:36, Johannes Kastl wrote:
On 28.03.17 09:34 Adrian Schröter wrote:
On Dienstag, 28. März 2017, 09:32:58 CEST wrote Johannes Kastl:
Any reason why this is no longer called Tumbleweed? When adding repos to my home project I always get a repo called Tumbleweed, that builds against openSUSE:Factory/snapshot.
someone created that for some time, but I did not want to have double builds, so I dropped the newer one again.
I would have preferred to have it named tumbleweed, to avoid the confusion, but I understand building twice is kind of superfluous...
Can't you just use an _aggregate if you really want to have both "Tumbleweed" and "Factory"? Saves the rebuild..
aggregates are evil and leads just to more problems and the same disk waste. I would configure a redirection if we would really need a hack. But given that this repo is away since quite some time already without a big problem, I won't do hacks here... -- Adrian Schroeter email: adrian@suse.de SUSE Linux GmbH, GF: Felix Imendörffer, Jane Smithard, Graham Norton, HRB 21284 (AG Nürnberg) Maxfeldstraße 5 90409 Nürnberg Germany -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice+owner@opensuse.org
* Adrian Schröter
On Dienstag, 28. März 2017, 09:50:38 CEST wrote Jan Engelhardt:
On Tuesday 2017-03-28 09:36, Johannes Kastl wrote:
On 28.03.17 09:34 Adrian Schröter wrote:
On Dienstag, 28. März 2017, 09:32:58 CEST wrote Johannes Kastl:
Any reason why this is no longer called Tumbleweed? When adding repos to my home project I always get a repo called Tumbleweed, that builds against openSUSE:Factory/snapshot.
someone created that for some time, but I did not want to have double builds, so I dropped the newer one again.
I would have preferred to have it named tumbleweed, to avoid the confusion, but I understand building twice is kind of superfluous...
Can't you just use an _aggregate if you really want to have both "Tumbleweed" and "Factory"? Saves the rebuild..
aggregates are evil and leads just to more problems and the same disk waste.
I would configure a redirection if we would really need a hack.
But given that this repo is away since quite some time already without a big problem, I won't do hacks here...
re: "without a big problem", some or most of us silently dealt with the change. The problem is that factory is not always the same as Tw even though they are advertized as so. If.. a factory repo is supposed to equate to Tumbleweed, why not call it Tw and thost factory repos that are more testing/staging grounds remain with factory labels. The factory/Tw situation is confusing, in that *if* factory equals Tw, why not call it all factory or tw, or at least install redirection that defines Tw apart from factory? -- (paka)Patrick Shanahan Plainfield, Indiana, USA @ptilopteri http://en.opensuse.org openSUSE Community Member facebook/ptilopteri Photos: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/gallery2 Registered Linux User #207535 Photos: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/piwigo @ http://linuxcounter.net -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice+owner@opensuse.org
On 28.03.17 14:17 Patrick Shanahan wrote:
If.. a factory repo is supposed to equate to Tumbleweed, why not call it Tw and thost factory repos that are more testing/staging grounds remain with factory labels. The factory/Tw situation is confusing, in that *if* factory equals Tw, why not call it all factory or tw, or at least install redirection that defines Tw apart from factory?
Exactly what I was trying to point out. Johannes
On mardi, 28 mars 2017 21.25:41 h CEST Johannes Kastl wrote:
On 28.03.17 14:17 Patrick Shanahan wrote:
If.. a factory repo is supposed to equate to Tumbleweed, why not call it Tw and thost factory repos that are more testing/staging grounds remain with factory labels. The factory/Tw situation is confusing, in that *if* factory equals Tw, why not call it all factory or tw, or at least install redirection that defines Tw apart from factory?
Exactly what I was trying to point out.
Johannes
But then what kind of software are here which are not present in TW almost the week after ? Normally the repo should only serve as -devel things ... ;-) -- Bruno Friedmann Ioda-Net Sàrl www.ioda-net.ch Bareos Partner, openSUSE Member, fsfe fellowship GPG KEY : D5C9B751C4653227 irc: tigerfoot -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice+owner@opensuse.org
* Bruno Friedmann
On mardi, 28 mars 2017 21.25:41 h CEST Johannes Kastl wrote:
On 28.03.17 14:17 Patrick Shanahan wrote:
If.. a factory repo is supposed to equate to Tumbleweed, why not call it Tw and thost factory repos that are more testing/staging grounds remain with factory labels. The factory/Tw situation is confusing, in that *if* factory equals Tw, why not call it all factory or tw, or at least install redirection that defines Tw apart from factory?
Exactly what I was trying to point out.
Johannes
But then what kind of software are here which are not present in TW almost the week after ?
Normally the repo should only serve as -devel things ...
yes, the "factory" repo, but then factory != Tumbleweed Tw may be a bastard son but .... -- (paka)Patrick Shanahan Plainfield, Indiana, USA @ptilopteri http://en.opensuse.org openSUSE Community Member facebook/ptilopteri Photos: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/gallery2 Registered Linux User #207535 Photos: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/piwigo @ http://linuxcounter.net -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice+owner@opensuse.org
ti., 28.03.2017 kl. 16.19 -0400, skrev Patrick Shanahan:
yes, the "factory" repo, but then factory != Tumbleweed Tw may be a bastard son but ....
From: ---- https://build.opensuse.org/project/meta/openSUSE:Tools <repository name="openSUSE_Factory"> <path project="openSUSE:Factory" repository="snapshot"/> <arch>i586</arch> <arch>x86_64</arch> </repository> ---- Note the <path project="openSUSE:Factory" repository="snapshot"/> That means it IS Tumbleweed (or built against currently published "Tumbleweed" to be correct). Had it said --- <repository name="openSUSE_Factory"> <path project="openSUSE:Factory" repository="standard"/> <arch>i586</arch> <arch>x86_64</arch> </repository> ------ It would have been Factory. //Bjørn -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice+owner@opensuse.org
* Bjørn Lie
ti., 28.03.2017 kl. 16.19 -0400, skrev Patrick Shanahan:
yes, the "factory" repo, but then factory != Tumbleweed Tw may be a bastard son but ....
From: ---- https://build.opensuse.org/project/meta/openSUSE:Tools
<repository name="openSUSE_Factory"> <path project="openSUSE:Factory" repository="snapshot"/> <arch>i586</arch> <arch>x86_64</arch> </repository>
----
Note the <path project="openSUSE:Factory" repository="snapshot"/>
That means it IS Tumbleweed (or built against currently published "Tumbleweed" to be correct).
Had it said
---
<repository name="openSUSE_Factory"> <path project="openSUSE:Factory" repository="standard"/> <arch>i586</arch> <arch>x86_64</arch> </repository>
------
It would have been Factory.
In Other Words: tumbleweed is NOT factory, but may be. Clear as a bell. I do understand, but it is not clear to most. -- (paka)Patrick Shanahan Plainfield, Indiana, USA @ptilopteri http://en.opensuse.org openSUSE Community Member facebook/ptilopteri Photos: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/gallery2 Registered Linux User #207535 Photos: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/piwigo @ http://linuxcounter.net -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice+owner@opensuse.org
ti., 28.03.2017 kl. 16.48 -0400, skrev Patrick Shanahan:
In Other Words: tumbleweed is NOT factory, but may be. Clear as a bell.
I do understand, but it is not clear to most.
https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Factory_development_model No Tumbleweed IS Factory, but only after it has been through openQA and then published as a "snapshot". We do not publish Factory anymore for users to install from, but it available for devel repos to build against. //Bjørn -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice+owner@opensuse.org
* Bjørn Lie
ti., 28.03.2017 kl. 16.48 -0400, skrev Patrick Shanahan:
In Other Words: tumbleweed is NOT factory, but may be. Clear as a bell.
I do understand, but it is not clear to most.
https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Factory_development_model
No Tumbleweed IS Factory, but only after it has been through openQA and then published as a "snapshot".
We do not publish Factory anymore for users to install from, but it available for devel repos to build against.
this is becomming //bikeshed//, but to make it clear to everyone: tumbleweed == factory:snapshot tumbleweed != factory:standard but tumbleweed = factory is a *different* meaning. tw is a "qualified" factory. a tw user who does not understand the differenct will/can break his system using factory:standard packages -- (paka)Patrick Shanahan Plainfield, Indiana, USA @ptilopteri http://en.opensuse.org openSUSE Community Member facebook/ptilopteri Photos: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/gallery2 Registered Linux User #207535 Photos: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/piwigo @ http://linuxcounter.net -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice+owner@opensuse.org
ti., 28.03.2017 kl. 17.21 -0400, skrev Patrick Shanahan:
this is becomming //bikeshed//, but to make it clear to everyone: tumbleweed == factory:snapshot tumbleweed != factory:standard
Yes, a very nice short (and correct) explanation.
but tumbleweed = factory is a *different* meaning. tw is a "qualified" factory.
a tw user who does not understand the differenct will/can break his system using factory:standard packages
That might happen yes. However in the case of openSUSE:Tools it will not apply, since we know it builds against snapshot. The real issue is that users for whatever reason seem to think they need to add massive amounts of devel repos to their TW install, just because they can, and having repos named Tumbleweed seem to encourage them to do this even more. In my opinion discouraging this is a "good thing", but if users insists on making problems for themselves, there is not much we can do. Devel repos are (mainly) for development, and can and will break end- users systems at various times unless they are careful with what they install from them, no matter if they are named Factory, Tumbleweed or "Super stable repo". //Bjørn -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice+owner@opensuse.org
On 28.03.17 22:41 Bjørn Lie wrote:
Note the <path project="openSUSE:Factory" repository="snapshot"/>
That means it IS Tumbleweed (or built against currently published "Tumbleweed" to be correct).
For the sake of clarity to end users this repo should IMHO be called openSUSE_Tumbleweed. This is confusing even to regulars like Patrick, and it's even worse to less experienced users. Johannes
Am Wed, 29 Mar 2017 08:42:41 +0200
schrieb Johannes Kastl
On 28.03.17 22:41 Bjørn Lie wrote:
Note the <path project="openSUSE:Factory" repository="snapshot"/>
That means it IS Tumbleweed (or built against currently published "Tumbleweed" to be correct).
For the sake of clarity to end users this repo should IMHO be called openSUSE_Tumbleweed. This is confusing even to regulars like Patrick, and it's even worse to less experienced users.
So much agreed! +2 Detlef
Johannes
On mardi, 28 mars 2017 09.34:30 h CEST Adrian Schröter wrote:
On Dienstag, 28. März 2017, 09:32:58 CEST wrote Johannes Kastl:
Hi guys,
I updated my tumbleweed machine today (have not done so in a week or so?), and got an error, as the Tumbleweed repo for openSUSE:Tools was no longer existing.
Apparently it is now called ".../openSUSE:/Tools/openSUSE_Factory/" and builds against openSUSE:Factory/snapshot.
it existed with that name since the beginning.
Any reason why this is no longer called Tumbleweed? When adding repos to my home project I always get a repo called Tumbleweed, that builds against openSUSE:Factory/snapshot.
someone created that for some time, but I did not want to have double builds, so I dropped the newer one again.
About double build, perhaps, this repo should also cleanup obsolete distribution really openSUSE 11.4 to 13.1 SLE_11_SP3 :-) I guess also a number of oldies in the Xubuntu, Fedora, Debian world ... -- Bruno Friedmann Ioda-Net Sàrl www.ioda-net.ch Bareos Partner, openSUSE Member, fsfe fellowship GPG KEY : D5C9B751C4653227 irc: tigerfoot -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice+owner@opensuse.org
participants (7)
-
Adrian Schröter -
Bjørn Lie -
Bruno Friedmann -
Detlef Steuer -
Jan Engelhardt -
Johannes Kastl -
Patrick Shanahan