Thanks for reply but in respect to xfi not supported. Alsa clearly does support it due to what the pulse volume control settings shows to be available for it. The other aspect is that this didn't happen on 12.3 so something must have changed. I was late upgrading to leap as I expected a 13.3 and didn't know that there wasn't going to be one. What I don't know is what has changed. Maybe pulse didn't have an idle timer. Maybe kde has messed up the interface. I don't think phonon has ever offered full control of this style of card that can multiplex surround sound down a single output but have noticed that people who do this always mention pavucontrol. I don't do that but it does show this option. I haven't looked at sound for a long time ;-) as a result I thought pulse was the bottom end not alsa but pavucontrol must be getting it's info from some where and something has changed. One aspect that is factual is that the alsa desktop mixer doesn't function as it should. Maybe phonon is the culprit and has bypassed it some how. My alsa also doesn't seem to accept the command you suggested. I did have the volume level problem on 12.3 especially on youtube but thankfully that has gone. Thanks & Regards John -