Mailinglist Archive: opensuse (1355 mails)

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Re: [opensuse] zypper dup very busy defragging btrfs, when there is nobtrfs partition...
On 2018-06-08 17:38, Rodney Baker wrote:
On Saturday, 9 June 2018 0:23:29 ACST Richard Brown wrote:
[...]

If you start using another file system then I would expect that in order
to
administer it you would bring in the necessary toolbox to support it, and
that includes what GParted would see the wrenches now needed.

Surely the RPM system has this capability? Surely dependencies aren't an
all or nothing matter?

I do see your point about not always being online, but then again, wearing
my sysadmin hat, I can't see starting to use a new type of FS without the
supporting tools to manage it. And I don't see why things I'm never
going to use are forced upon me.

What scares me is that logical consequence of mandating stuff like this,
even if it is never going to be used, is that it is going to be simpler
to just load everything in all the repositories that you have configured,
regardless.
gparted requires a whole bunch of tools regardless of whether or not
they're used by a system
e2fsprogs
xfsprogs
jfsutils
hfsutils
nilfs-utils
ntfsprogs
btrfsprogs

If you removed all of them gparted would be rather useless..

And there is no magic RPM dependency flag that lets RPM psychically
know all the filesystems that you have (or more importantly, going to
have) on your system

Especially in the era of NAS', SANs' and software defined storage
where block devices (with whatever filesystems contained within) could
be dissapearing and reappearing at a whim

Your 'sysadmin hat' sounds old and moth eaten - we're in more and more
of a devops world where a single sysadmin is unlikely to be in total
control of what their developers & users are connecting to your
servers, VMs, cloud guests, or containers.

I think in that case it most certainly makes good sensible engineering
sense to have a system that could handle all supported filesystems

And in the case of btrfs, it's the default and the recommended for the
root filesystem for openSUSE, so it would be insane to make it an
optional dependency even if there was magic RPM filesystems-in-use &
filesystems-in-future flags

I think you missed the point. When you **install** btrfs it should bring in
the tools i.e. btrfsprogs should be dependency of btrfs, not gparted (and the
same applies to other fs's), and it should be possible to install a system
without it (i.e. to choose what filesystems and associated tools are
installed
or not).

But you don't "install" btrfs. You partition a disk as btrfs, or as
something else. At the time of formatting, the tools must be available -
so you need btrfs tools before.


What you ask is rather more complex to implement. It could be the YaST
partitioner module that somehow ASKS the package management module to
install the rpm for the filesystems it created, later during the
installation. I doubt this hook exist, and it would be complext to do.

But the packager module would also have to scan all the existing disks
in the computer to find out what filesystems are there already, plus
those that are going to be created, and then decide what modules to install.

I'll put my old, moth eaten dev hat on for a while, and I'll say, I'm
not coding that. Little gain and a lot of effort :-P

But surely they'll be happy to accept your contributed code to do it ;-)


And mind, like you I'm not going to use btrfs anytime soon. But removing
those tools automatically is far from easy. Maybe it would be possible
to delete them after installation, if they are not flagged hard deps. I
understand that nobody so far has come with a way of doing that - see
<https://bugzilla.opensuse.org/show_bug.cgi?id=953131> for instance.



--
Cheers / Saludos,

Carlos E. R.
(from 42.3 x86_64 "Malachite" at Telcontar)

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