Mailinglist Archive: opensuse (1451 mails)

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Re: [opensuse] 13.2 vs Leap vs Tumbleweed
  • From: Richard Brown <RBrownCCB@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Mon, 8 Feb 2016 18:58:35 +0100
  • Message-id: <>
On 8 February 2016 at 18:38, John Andersen <jsamyth@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

And what would that achieve? KDE eV, GNOME Foundation, etc, do not
hire developers.

And that's precisely the problem, as you pointed out in your longer posting

There are already ways to contribute to KDE complete with paypal button, and
I've done so at least
once a year.

But, if that money is not going to KDE developers (and I do not
believe it does), then it doesn't resolve the issues your suggesting
your money would solve if it was instead going to openSUSE

The Opensuse site accepts code and hardware. And believe me they wouldn't
want the hardware I cast

But no way to contribute to Opensuse for paying developers, or maintainers to
fix and maintain older
stuff, or even tackle bug reports. Opensuse has no "visible means of support"
which means its
existence is probably subject to the whim of the ownership of Suse, which
have seemed progressively
less and less likely to be interested with each change of hands.

Opensuse has historically been a testbed for SLES/SLED, but now, with Leap,
it seems less so, and
more like a Remora, hitching a ride on a shark, and as such dead-weight as
viewed by Suse ownership,
and the current ownership of Suse has proven themselves a pretty mercenary
bunch over the last 20
years that I have had dealings with them. I suspect if the comptroller of
catches a cold, Opensuse could find itself a fatality.

I really don't like responding to these conspiracy theories, because
it provides nonsense like this a credibility it doesn't deserve

But for the record, Leap has the full backing of SUSE.

It's origins started with an idea that originated within SUSE R&D
before being presented to the community, which evolved the concept
from that point, but (luckily for SUSE) kept the core concepts which
SUSE were hoping to see

There is a video recording where I presented this idea at oSC15 -

To boil the whole thing down to a very crude (and incomplete) picture

Leap is a distribution which helps SUSE develop their next service
packs (ie. SLE 12 SP2 will be learning lessons from Leap 42.1, while
we simultaneously develop SLE 12 SP2 and Leap 42.2 at the same time).

Leap is also a perfect platform for SUSE to target the development of
their new technologies on, it's shared heritage with SLE enabling it
to help their Enterprise orientated development while also
contributing directly to openSUSE

Tumbleweed is the distribution which helps SUSE develop their next SLE
releases (ie. SLE 13 will be based on a snapshot of Tumbleweed some
day in the future)

So there should be absolutely no question regarding the importance of
openSUSE to SUSE.

Side Issue:
Why does no one produce a derivative distro based on Opensuse? Yet Arch,
arguably a much smaller
organization, has dozens of derivatives, some of them rather impressive
Is Opensuse just so good that there is no room for improvement? Does someone
actively work to
prevent this?

There are openSUSE derivatives. Ignoring the thousands on SUSE Studio
the examples that spring to mind are:

GeckoLinux -
InvisServer -
Paragon OS -

No one actively works to prevent derivatives of openSUSE, but I can
share one funny story that I think goes some way to explain why
openSUSE doesn't have a huge pile of derivatives

There once was a distribution called Fuduntu, a fedora based distro
that tried to provide a very user focused experience (ala Ubuntu)

They decided to discontinue their distribution and instead rebase as a
derivative on openSUSE

They approached us, asked us a bunch of questions, met a bunch of
contributors, all of whom were very welcoming and friendly to this new
group of developers who had a very clear vision of what they wanted to

In fact, we were so welcoming, that the developers decided that it
wasn't worth the effort of having their own distribution, and they
became openSUSE contributors

And we're very happy to still have them :)

We're the kind of project that does our best to accept as many changes
as we can from as many different people as we can, without only a
sensible, common sense approach to shared standards, quality,
policies, procedures, etc.

If we had many derivatives, I'd be worrying that we were doing
something wrong - we should be the kind of project that people can
influence in the direction they want by contributing to, not by making
their own.

- Rich
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