On 8/29/2011 2:44 PM, Sven Burmeister wrote:
Am Montag, 29. August 2011, 14:14:39 schrieb Brian K. White:
On 8/29/2011 1:41 AM, Basil Chupin wrote:
I have all the features in KDE 4.7 which I had in KDE3 - and then some.
Wrong. You have all the features you personally happen to notice or care about.
Wrong because he wrote "I" instead of "I personally"? Is there a non-personal I? Maybe if one has multiple… :)
But I guess you refer to the features he does not miss because he did not use them. Well, that's true of course but true as well is, that since he is using KDE4 it is likely that there are features he notices and cares about that KDE3 lacks.
So whose feature is now more important? And if one blames KDE4 for not having a feature KDE3 had why is it not as valid to blame KDE3 for not having some KDE4 feature – after all one can still add features to KDE3? Are new features worth less than old ones. Who decides which feature is more valuable.
Or is it simply a matter of claiming that no feature must vanish? If one takes that point of view I can understand all the fuss about KDE4 not having all the features of KDE3 – but then again, KDE4 is not KDE3 + additions but mainly a rewrite and IMHO it is a bit narrow minded to demand a "rebuild all features of previous versions if you do a rewrite" given that KDE is quite a large project and as everything an object within time that reflects changing demands and approaches.
You personally might not need any of the new features in KDE4, while some other person might not need any of the features KDE3 had and KDE4 does not anymore but he does need some features KDE4 provides while KDE3 lacks them. So who is right? IMO both – one person is a KDE3 user, the other a KDE4 user. Some KDE3 users become KDE4 users, others not. Some KDE4 users become Gnome users and the other way around. That's how it works.
One can take the point of view that devs should care more about old users that want all their features included rather than new or current users who adopt the new features and do not miss any old ones to the degree that makes them claim that it is impossible to work with KDE4 – but again – who decides on that in a project that mainly builds on people doing what they enjoy and not what they are told.
Sven
Absolutely it is a developers right to develop whatever they want with little or no regard for a users wishes. A developers right to develop whatever they want for their own amusement in no way removes a users right to dislike the result. Also, the number of users who happily adopt something, or reject it, is _itself_ not a valid datum except when dealing with sales. Many millions of people eat at McDonalds and McDonalds surely makes a lot more money than even the finest proper restaurant, but it's still unmitigated garbage by any objective standard you want to consider (except sales). Personally I don't much like any kde or gnome, old or new, and I use lxde where possible (lately). My reasons are not too different from what these people are saying about kde4 vs kde3. They're full of crap I don't want and don't have enough, or good enough, things I might want to compensate. So I vote with my feet. The conflict here comes from the fact that the developers are telling the world "this new thing is better". Maybe the world is technically wrong for interpreting the developers actions that way but it's an inarguable fact that that's the way the world interprets: * halting all development on the existing product, * only working on the new product, * giving the new product the same name but with a higher version number. By putting the product out there and declaring it's ready for use, they cause distributions and individuals to switch to it. Everyone technically has a choice to decline, but it's not that simple of course. When you say "We developed the old Foo, and we are no longer going to work on or support the old Foo" you are in fact exerting a pressure that almost qualifies as force, for everyone else to stop using the old Foo and use the new Foo, whether they like it or not. It's in no way wrong for anyone who perceives a problem with the new product, or an unfavorable comparison with with the old product, to say so. Especially to people might never have known any better because the new product was made the default. Especially to people who have some say in what is placed in front of all users by default. -- bkw -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org