Marc Chamberlin said the following on 02/11/2011 02:43 PM:
As for using a "programmer's" text editor v.s a word processor? If a tool purports to handle a plain text file, I expect that tool to honor the syntax conventions associate with plain text files. "Purports to handle" could mean anything. Word processors can READ IN plain text files. That could be shoe-horned into "handle", but the resulting file when the word processor has finished with it is a word processor file.
It is, after all, a word processing tool.
There are plenty of tools for editing pain text files. Some "programmers editors" for pain text files like Kate and GVIM have facilities for "syntax directed editing" and can make smart guesses at the 'language' in the file: C/C++, perl, php, as well as various types of config file.
Kate also has a terminal emulator built in, so you could view it as a development environment. But I am not editing a file that requires syntax directed editing. Why is Kate and GVIM relevant? If I had chosen them instead, to use as a text editor because they claim they can do so, I would expect exactly
On 2/11/2011 12:37 PM, Anton Aylward wrote: the same behavior as if I had chosen any other tool that claims to be able to edit text files and write said files back out as a plain text file.
I see nothing wrong with using any tool that will edit text files, conceptually, as a simple text file. Indeed, but I'd rather have one that will edit text files ACTUALLY.
By not displaying or warning about non-printable characters, other than CR or LF, kwrite has a bug in it. That makes no sense. Kwrite is a WORD PROCESSOR. It writes out word processing files. It is not a text editor any more than Quanta+, Inkscape or GIMP is a text editor. All those can manipulate text, but what they write out isn't a text file
Funny that the menu item for KDE/openSuSE applications labels Kwrite as a Text Editor! I am suppose to have groked this distinction how? Oh I see, guess I am suppose to go read another man page first... Hmmm funny, no man pages for Kwrite! Aww guess what! KWrite has a Help button, that leads me to a built in document!!! Oh now this is interesting - Right at the very top of this help document it says - "KWrite is a text editor for KDE allowing you to edit one file at the time per window." What part of "text editor" am I suppose to have interpreted as - not really! KWrite is really a "word processor"?
Because I had approached these configuration files via Dolphin, kwrite was handy, so I used it instead. It bit me, and I learned of it's limitation. Won't make that mistake again... This is where Patrick would step in and say that your mistake was using a GUI -- Dolphin -- and let it make decisions for you. I would add that GUIs in general let other people make decisions for you and limit what you can see and do to what they think you should be doing and seeing. You have illustrated this point exceedingly well.
Dolphin offered me a choice, it did not force me to chose KWrite, but it did make it a little easier... That is called guidance...
I also pointed out, that there are a number of issues with various different tools, that aligned to make the process of setting up an nfs server and an autofs client extremely difficult. You might want to focus on those instead of attacking me. You might want to use the right tools and in the right way and gain an understanding of how the tools and facilities work and interact BEFORE hacking away. I kept saying "It works for me" and looking back I'm of the opinion that it worked without problems such as you encountered because I chose the right tools and read up and planned
I was taught "The seven Ps", but it seems one of the Ps is considered a rude word by many Nanny Filters, so its "The Six Ps" you'll find discussed most on the 'Net http://jbdcolley.com/?p=184
Marc, I see from other people and some out-of-band that you are coming across as attacking Linux, previous version of UNIX, their designers and developers and in many ways the OpenSource movement. This is not appreciated. There's a saying by the old Roman poet Horace that sums things up well:
If a better system is thine, impart it freely; If not, make use of mine. Anton, I grow tired of fencing with you. You are so blinded by your
Yeah!? I guess I had better go off to some mountain top somewhere, spend a few years groking ALL the documentation, and ALL the tools in Linux, before I use ANY of them, so I will know up front what ALL the possibilities are, and ALL of the interactions between ALL of the tools. HUMP!! prejudices against GUI's that you cannot see their potential. You are so blinded by your love of Linux that you cannot see that there is room for improvement. Your comments such as "It works for me" or "RTFM" shows that you are incapable of learning from others and have no tolerance for newcomers and people struggling to learn. Instead you launch personal attacks against me repeatably, which is called bullying. NO I am NOT a Linux hater in any way shape or form, but you want to establish and live by such doctrines of "It's my way or the highway.", or "Either you are with Linux, or you are against Linux." Such elitist attitudes do no allow you to see the middle grounds, the gray areas, just black and white simplistic answers. You are incapable of being a good teacher Anton, or a guide, and I suggest you should not try. You lack empathy for those who are struggling, a necessary quality of a good leader, and instead mock, and laugh at them. I thank you for trying though, you did help although it has turned into a rocky road that we traveled. I pointed out some faults of Linux, and you then choose to label me antagonistic against Linux. Not as someone who is trying to be helpful by sharing the difficulties he was having, offering suggestions on how to make improvements, and hoping to open a pathway towards those improvements. In all of our diatribes, you have not once offered suggestions of your own, on how Linux might be improved, for newcomers. Instead you complain, attack and imply that you wish beginners would go away and leave Linux to the elite few gurus who like it the way it is.. I suspect you will continue you attacks against me for awhile. I will reply no further to you in this thread. This has gone far enough. Regards... Marc Chamberlin -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org