Mailinglist Archive: opensuse (2268 mails)
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Re: [opensuse] Re: Suse 10.3 install - oh dear (rant only)
- From: "Rajko M." <rmatov101@xxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Wed, 21 May 2008 22:38:07 -0500
- Message-id: <200805212238.07261.rmatov101@xxxxxxxxxxx>
On Wednesday 21 May 2008 11:03:28 am Jim Henderson wrote:
It wouldn't be bad, but that is so right now. In 30+ days it will be
different.
Stephan Kulow is KDE developer and the good one. He knows better than most of
us what can be expected at the time of openSUSE release. If he thinks it
should be as is, why me, or anyone else with marginal insight should question
his decision.
I have good memory in this respect, and that is why I wrote:
But even that is valid for very few brave that will try installation on their
own.
It is to you and me, but it is not strict alphabetic order when is first KDE4
and than KDE3. For the new user will be "I have no idea what is this, let me
see the first one", or throw the dice and see.
Highly publicized for Linux fans.
I haven't seen any comment on TV ;-)
People that I convinced to try Linux, knew that Linux exist. I never got
chance to discus KDE vs. GNOME, they even had no idea that openSUSE is Linux
until it was installed.
Their choice was mine, as later on I have to deal with questions.
Just as whole this thread.
Now is important what will new user pick, while in reality you have to push
that down the throat, gently, and every choice is yours, not new user's.
In my experience, we old users make the impression, not 4/3 or 3/4 of
something they have no idea that exists.
They are happy if that works for browsing, mail, photo, and maybe
some 'essential' windows application via Wine, and that is all they want to
know. Average computer user is not interested in computer as computer, but
what he/she can do with it. That is what most of old users fail to
understand. I was in that train all too often, starting talk with thousands
of available applications, free of charge, while they want very few of them
and they are not that badly concerned if they have to pay to have job done.
...
Coolo is KDE insider and openSUSE manager.
He probably has much better insight where it will be by openSUSE release ;-)
--
Regards, Rajko
http://en.opensuse.org/Portal needs helpful hands.
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On Tue, 20 May 2008 23:16:53 -0500, Rajko M. wrote:
Thanks, Anders. What about the idea of somehow flagging KDE4 as beta?
Basil does bring up a good point, I think.
The point is good, but skips GNOME that is on position one.
True, but I can't see that it would hurt to label the KDE4 item
"Preview", "Beta", or in some other way.
It wouldn't be bad, but that is so right now. In 30+ days it will be
different.
Stephan Kulow is KDE developer and the good one. He knows better than most of
us what can be expected at the time of openSUSE release. If he thinks it
should be as is, why me, or anyone else with marginal insight should question
his decision.
I'm trying to think like a new
user to Linux here (not an easy task since I've been using Linux since
RedHat 5.2 - and that's probably "new" compared to many others here).
I have good memory in this respect, and that is why I wrote:
I'm pretty sure if I would have to choose from few listed options that I
have no idea what they are, I would would assume that listed items are
sorted in that way for some reason and that would be that software
vendor will put first items that will present them in the best way, and
then down the list choices that are not so good.
But even that is valid for very few brave that will try installation on their
own.
I think it would be fairly obvious that the sort order is alphabetic ...
It is to you and me, but it is not strict alphabetic order when is first KDE4
and than KDE3. For the new user will be "I have no idea what is this, let me
see the first one", or throw the dice and see.
Those that will skip GNOME already have preference and know what is the
difference between KDE3 and 4.
I don't know that that's a safe assumption unless the new user has been
in a complete Linux vacuum and heard nothing at all about Linux before
trying it. They may have heard friends talk about GNOME vs. KDE - or
they may have read news articles about Linus' highly-publicized comments
about his preference for KDE.
Highly publicized for Linux fans.
I haven't seen any comment on TV ;-)
Those comments, as quoted, didn't...
reference a version AFAICR, so we do get back to the rather valid point
that 4>3, so 4 must be better than 3.
People that I convinced to try Linux, knew that Linux exist. I never got
chance to discus KDE vs. GNOME, they even had no idea that openSUSE is Linux
until it was installed.
Their choice was mine, as later on I have to deal with questions.
BTW, this means that fair approach would be to rotate desktops in the
list on each new openSUSE version. Current alphabetic gives advantage to
GNOME and it is far from fair.
Well, that's getting pretty nit-picky IMHO.
Just as whole this thread.
Now is important what will new user pick, while in reality you have to push
that down the throat, gently, and every choice is yours, not new user's.
..., but rather in representing the KDE4 release
appropriately so people's first impression of Linux is a good one.
In my experience, we old users make the impression, not 4/3 or 3/4 of
something they have no idea that exists.
They are happy if that works for browsing, mail, photo, and maybe
some 'essential' windows application via Wine, and that is all they want to
know. Average computer user is not interested in computer as computer, but
what he/she can do with it. That is what most of old users fail to
understand. I was in that train all too often, starting talk with thousands
of available applications, free of charge, while they want very few of them
and they are not that badly concerned if they have to pay to have job done.
...
Also, the KDE4 development resembles on express train. The status is
changing so fast that while we will be half way chewing question is it
ready or not, they will make it ready.
But relative to the release of 11.0 final, AFAIK the developers of KDE4
are saying it won't be finished by that time. ...
Coolo is KDE insider and openSUSE manager.
He probably has much better insight where it will be by openSUSE release ;-)
--
Regards, Rajko
http://en.opensuse.org/Portal needs helpful hands.
--
To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxx
For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@xxxxxxxxxxxx
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