Mailinglist Archive: opensuse (2425 mails)
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[SLE] Ad Blocking (was Alternative Web Browser)
- From: joshaugh@xxxxxxxxxxxxx (Jamie O'Shaughnessy)
- Date: Tue, 13 Jun 2000 10:26:49 +0100 (BST)
- Message-id: <Pine.LNX.4.21.0006130943530.28657-100000@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
On Mon, 12 Jun 2000, Timothy R. Butler wrote:
> > You detest software with ads in them, yet you complain if people view your
> > web pages but block your ads? So how do you differentiate between an app
> > and a web page? What if I make a web page for reading mail say, it's OK to
> > have ads in that? But if I write a stand alone email program, I shouldn't
> > put ads in that (like Eudora does I believe)?
> I detested programs with ads in 'em (because I don't like things that go
> behind my back like lots of adware does. However, I don't try to block them,
> I just plain don't use them (if I did, I wouldn't block the ads). Simply
> put, if you don't like ads on the internet, don't visit sites with them. It
> shouldn't be anyone's choice but the owner of the content on whether or not
> ads are displayed. If I choose to have ads on my site, and Joe Surfer
> doesn't like it - more power to him - go somewhere else.
> By my definition, a program is something running off you PC, a web site
> something running off the internet. When it's on my PC, I don't want it
> installing little "helper" apps to load at startup that eat up my system
> resources. But, if I choose to use that type of program, that is what I
> deserved to suffer through.
I seem to recall you originally said "application", but if you said
"program" then it makes little difference. Without being pedantic about
exact meanings of words, the concept that you differentiate between doing
"something" on a computer that is running locally as opposed to something
running on the network is interesting. What if the program is running on
another computer but is being displayed (via X) on the machine on your
desk? How does this differ to running the program locally?
Seriously, on this point I'm not wanting to get into a stupid flame war,
just think about it. It makes no difference where something is running. It
also makes no difference how the "application" runs, be it a local
program, remote X program, java program started via a web page, java
program embedded in a web page or just even a HTML based app.
> > I'm not against ads in neither web pages or apps - but I disagree with
> > your complaints when people block them.
> What do you propose then? If people block the ads that pay me the money to
> create the content they come for, what I am suppose to do? Shut down? Just
> imagine if all the PERL script sites, like my own, who were supported by ads
> shut down. You could say good bye to Matt's Script Archive &
> CGI-Resources.com, Stepweb.com, Selena Sol/Extropia, and many others
I'm sure these sites offer fine services. I don't actually propose
anything. What I expect to happen is the market for web advertising will
sort itself out anyway - and I wouldn't bet my commercial interests on
things staying how they are. If web ads become obtrusive then more people
will turn to ad blockers which will cause less web ads, pretty
simple. You're right, this could cause some sites to stop functioning. I'm
not saying this is a good thing. Hopefully web ads won't become too
intrusive and so this won't happen.
> The thing I emphasize, is it's one thing if it's my hobby (like many open
> source developers), it's another if it's my job. If it's my job, I have to
> make money somehow, and it surely doesn't help me to have people use up my
> bandwidth and give me absolutely nothing but more support requests in
> return. It costs money to produce software and maintain my site - first time
> somebody offers to give me enough money to take off my ads - they'd be gone.
> But no one does, so the ads stay.
As I said before, I'm not advocating an ad free web, I just believe people
should be allowed to run ad blockers. If you want to try to block ad
blockers (!) in some way, you're free to do that too.
If you think the open source movement is driven by money made from web
adverts, then I would disagree with you. There are a great many other ways
to be a professional open source developer, web ads is just one - and one
I think is probably the least successful.
> I could do like Oracle or any other proprietary software company and
> charge for software (no offense to Oracle), but instead I let visitors pay
> with ads. Would you rather pay with real cash?
Well, as you can see from the bottom of my mail, my views and any posts I
make are nothing at all to do with Oracle Corporation and my views are
not the views of Oracle. I restate this just to make things clear.
As to the paying for software, where do you think the money comes from
that you get from the ads? When a washing powder commercial is on TV, who
do you think pays for that? Directly or indirectly the consumer ends up
paying. The real people who make money in your case are the ad companies.
> Personally, I think that all of the major ad companies (i.e. DoubleClick,
> 24/7, Flycast, Burst! Media, etc.) should try blocking site access to all of
> those who block ads. In other words, don't make me pay for what you refuse
> to. I'm sorry if this sounds like a flame, it isn't intended to. However, as
Cool by me.
> My $0.02...
Which may have been better earned by writing some more scripts (or
sticking more ads on your site) ;)
Jamie O'Shaughnessy e-mail: joshaugh@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Oracle Interactive Television Division phone : +44 118 92 45052
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