On Monday 09 May 2011 21:12:56 Per Jessen wrote:
Greg KH wrote:
On Mon, May 09, 2011 at 08:40:24PM +0200, Per Jessen wrote:
[sigh too]
Please don't tell me what to do. I shall pretend otherwise unless those definitions are culture- and language-neutral.
Is the posted list of "Harassment includes" not defined in such a manner? If not, how could it be made better?
The posted list includes the word "inappropriate", that's where it gets de-railed, because that is 100% culture- and language-specific (aka in the ear of the beholder). Jokes that are entirely appropriate in Scandinavia will be inappropriate in Germany, cause a pub-fight in Britain and imprisonment in Turkey. (just a theoretical example, no offence to anyone intended).
The key issue in what Jos wrote (presumably borrowed from elsewhere?) is that it way too long, which leads to people thinking it is or should be precise. Rather than trying to define everything in minute detail, I think we should accept that it's not possible and only have a short and concise statement or policy, preferably referring to our guiding principles as jdd and Jos have already mentioned.
Why not simply state that the openSUSE Guiding Principles also apply to the openSUSE conference? (as Jos did in the intro).
I wanted to add a bit more info and examples and build upon something that is defined and discussed by many people already instead of re-inventing the wheel. In any case, as the FAQ stated clearly, your comments on 'but it is not precise' are completely irrelevant. What is an offence IS in the ear/eye of the beholder. And that is how it is, period. We (including you) have to accept that - it's how people work. For each of us, our reality is how we see the world. Any underlying, 'more real' reality is essentially irrelevant. We can go into the deepest philosophy you want, but I'm a psychologist and for me - what people experience is real. Period. Nothing else is relevant. If someone experiences somebody elses joke as inappropriate, we ask the other person to refrain from making these jokes. In case the joke (or other action) is for everyone (including the person who made it) clearly inappropriate, we'll make a VERY strong warning or even kick him/her out right away. In case it is clearly a cultural issue, we talk about it and the person in question will (if he/she is reasonable) see the issue and try to not make the same mistake again. In both cases, problem solved. We won't be kicking out anyone on a whim, nor for things he/she could never have known to be wrong or something silly like that. This is just meant to: - make clear we care about this and will ensure the oSC is a safe place for EVERYONE including minorities - have something which was clear before the conference to point people to if they say "oh well you didn't tell me I can't be an ass and get away with it".