14 Feb
2011
14 Feb
'11
14:44
Am 14/02/11 12:17, schrieb jdd: > Le 14/02/2011 11:41, pistazienfresser (see profile) a écrit : > >> authors and users and so probably *able to protect the authors* from >> claims of stupid users that had misunderstood a how-to and claims to be >> aggrieved. > > AFAIK a provision of no responsability is included in GPL. This clause is just not legal in my system of law. A clause that should be valid my system has to be made for my system. According to German law a valid clause for exclusion of liability has to make *explicit* exceptions for vorsätzliches (en: intentional) and grob fahrlässiges (en: grossly negligent) behavior. If there is no just the hole clause is not valid and not legal (so called: 'Red-Pencil-Test' in my personal opinion a bit of a punishment for trying to use to harsh terms in ). But this is just an obvious example. > >> probably be rated valid by a French judge it a French user would clam to >> be not able to understand or even read the text of the >> en:licence=>? > > no, this nis not valid. there are translation everywhere, but in final > only the original text is valid. judges have translators. No. That most probably depends on the user. Why should you write a wiki for a user in Fresh or German if you think she or he would even be able to understand not only normal or technical English but also legal English. I think literally in every paper for jurisprudence I read on CC-licenses referred on this problem of the GFDL in difference to the adapted versions of the CC-licences.[1] > >> Compare at least the graphic on: > > thid is not a thing we can solve here. Why not just use licenses adapted to the different systems? Do not know if this would be the perfect solution but at least avoiding some obvious problems (and probably some more hidden, too.). > >> For other obvious problems compare: >> http://lists.opensuse.org/opensuse-wiki/2010-08/msg00042.html and following > > I dont see it beeing a new problem. international relations are due > for thousands of years :-) and everybody knows, like italian say > "traduttore tradittore" (the translator is a traitor). translations > are not a problem. The Problem are more the differences of the systems of law. Your are arguing like a openSUSE user who is telling a Microsoft user to use a program only made for a linux based system on the Microsoft system - and telling him also that I would be easy to translate it from French to German. > >> Please do not forget to at least try to >> have a lot of fun! > > sure. I'm perfectly fine with GFDL (in this context). > > I repeat the problem is more of a philosophical one. I rate it just as a very practical decision: Change the probably valid license instead of just stay with the buggy one. Transfer the (conditioned) right to use in a valid way to the community/all people instead just leave it by the (amateurish) user. Like staying in a obviously buggy system without at least trying to patch it. Or like surfing with root privileges cause your laptop is not so expensive. > for such > "amateur" text, It is exactly the dealing with amateurs as authors and readers/consumers I was writing about all the time. I would - if anything - expect from professionals to understand legal contracts in an other language and of an other legal system - or at least to be be aware that they do not understand the text and that there may be risks that a legal professional may be able to understand better. > copyleft is probably best. As in German law there is not full equivalent to the Anglo-American concept of "Copyright" but more something like a 'droit d’auteur' (Urheberrecht). But this seems to me really a philosophical question of not much practical use -> in all the decisions I have read about the relations between professionals the courts just rate the "Copyleft" of the (GPL) as a condition for the usage and left the right of the author by the author. And making the openSUSE wiki (legally and technical) comparable to the big Wikipedias (in both ways) is in my opinion just also a very practical issue. Regards pistazienfresser [1] An easy but in my opinion not fully correct explanation in German is just on this section of the GFDL article in the de.wikipedia: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/GFDL#Kritik -- - openSUSE profile: https://users.opensuse.org/show/pistazienfresser -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org