Mailinglist Archive: opensuse-project (930 mails)

[Stephan Kleine <bitdealer@xxxxxxxxx>]

On Friday June 25 2010 23:56:14 Jim Henderson wrote:
> On Fri, 25 Jun 2010 23:46:17 +0200, Cristian Morales Vega wrote:
> > 2010/6/25 Jim Henderson
> >
> > <hendersj@xxxxxxxxx>:
> > > But having an intermediary provide the information - bug duplication,
> > > validation, perhaps discussion with the devs before it even goes into
> > > bugzilla could raise the quality of the bugs entered and make the devs
> > > job easier.
> > >
> > > One might think "well, OK, but that's a forums thing and not something
> > > I need to be involved in" - but that kind of coordination does need
> > > buy-in from the devs, because they'll need to recognise that the
> > > reporter is reporting as a proxy.  There also needs to be that sense of
> > > the reports being respected.  We've had several examples in these
> > > strategy threads of just how negatively some of the participants feel
> > > about the forums.
> >
> > So you are proposing that some experienced forum users do a filter/proxy
> > and start sending bug reports from other forum users? And everything you
> > need is that we treat those bugs as we treat any other bug? OK, you have
> > it.
>
> My read of your reply here is that you're frustrated.  Is that a fair
> reading of what you wrote?

Probably, IMHO reporting bugs "as a proxy" simply makes no sense because "you" 
(the proxy) will never be able to answer any follow up questions.
 
> What I've proposed is just that - a proposal.
>
> I personally don't need everyone who answers bugs to say "yes, we'll
> accept bugs from forum users", but a general feeling that such bugs will
> be accepted and worked on - and that the devs will work *with* the users/
> reporters to identify and resolve bugs.

IMHO it is plain ridiculous that you suggest that bugs from "forum users" are 
treated differently from bugs reported by $otherPeople. The point simply being 
is that one has to be able to get answers to following questions, which wont 
happen it they get reported by proxies.
 
> Which means providing some feedback rather than just saying "WORKSFORME"
> and immediately closing the bug when there isn't enough information
> presented.

It will first get set on NEEDINFO and if the reporter can't be arsed to 
provide any information (answering some "How am I supposed to provide the 
answers you need?" will always get some "how to do it" as an answer which is 
sounds fair to me IMHO) but you can't really blame ppl for closing bugs if the 
reporter can't be arsed to provide any information.

> If a user takes the time to say "hey, something's broken here and not
> working properly for me" but an insufficient amount of information is
> presented, even if the bug is posted by an intermediary (because not
> everyone can know what a developer is going to need to fix a bug), the
> flow needs to be smooth enough that people feel it's worth their time to
> even report the bug.

1. It totally makes NO sense to me to report bugs as a proxy since you wont be 
able to answer any follow up questions.
2. If someone encounters anything "broken" and then files a bug he / she 
should also be willing to answer any following up questions. There is NO 
knowledge needed since ppl will ask for the information and normally will 
happily tell how to get the needed output so there is nothing required but 
being able to answer questions and providing the requested output.

OTOH if people aren't willing to do that it makes no sense reporting a bug in 
the first place.
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