Mailinglist Archive: opensuse-features (365 mails)

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[openFATE 308762] Remove Hal by default on opensuse 11.3
  • From: fate_noreply@xxxxxxx
  • Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2010 07:37:08 +0100 (CET)
  • Message-id: <feature-308762-27@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Feature changed by: Rastislav Krupansky (ra100)
Feature #308762, revision 27
Title: Remove Hal by default on opensuse 11.3

openSUSE-11.3: Rejected by (michl19)
reject date: 2010-02-10 18:32:11
reject reason: As upstream project remove hal more and more it will
evolutionary get removed from openSUSE as well.
Priority
Requester: Important

Requested by: Luis Medinas (lmedinas)

Description:
Hal is deprecated and now most applications now use udev and devicekit-
* (will be udisks). Now it's important to remove HAL because it will
speed boot process and of course because it's not moving upstream.
This pages show packages status from Fedora and Ubuntu.
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/HalRemoval
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Halsectomy

Discussion:
#1: Andreas Jaeger (a_jaeger) (2010-01-18 09:43:33)
Let's first evaluate which packages need hal and change the openSUSE
packages. I'm aware of "hwinfo".

#18: Will Stephenson (wstephenson) (2010-02-18 11:17:22) (reply to #1)
KDE4 would need a backend for Solid that uses whatever replaces hal:
Devicekit-*, udev, afaik.

#19: Andreas Jaeger (a_jaeger) (2010-02-18 13:22:35) (reply to #18)
Will, could you talk with the Solid developers so that this gets fixed
in KDE, please?

#2: Steffen Winterfeldt (snwint) (2010-01-18 12:02:40)
hwinfo works fine without hal. I think.
But libzypp relies on hal.

#13: Kay Sievers (kay_sievers) (2010-02-17 19:01:47) (reply to #2)
hwinfo has hal code in it, and "Requires:" it at the moment. It should
be dropped, if it works without it. Steffen, care to check?

#3: Luis Medinas (lmedinas) (2010-01-18 14:36:26)
According to the Yast team it still needs hal for automounting[1]. I
think this shouldn't be hard to replace.
Xorg git master doesn't depend of hal anymore i guess it should be an
easy task for the Xorg team to provide X without Hal. Gnome has already
removed Hal on 2.29 but i don't have any idea how KDE goes.
Firefox 3.6 still depends of gnome-vfs (which is deprecated) but i
asked Wolfgang to see if he can patch firefox to now depend of it. I
guess Openoffice.org doesn't depend anymore on gnome-vfs.
[1] - http://lists.opensuse.org/opensuse-factory/2010-01/msg00101.html

#4: Kay Sievers (kay_sievers) (2010-01-18 14:47:34) (reply to #3)
Yast uses HAL to _prevent_ automounting by the running desktop. If
needed, it should be replaced by a call to:
   devkit-disks --inhibit

#5: Luis Medinas (lmedinas) (2010-02-02 18:46:11) (reply to #4)
YaST bug report is
here  http://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=576190
(http://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=576190)

#6: Andreas Jaeger (a_jaeger) (2010-02-11 11:18:56) (reply to #5)
Add feature 308980 for the Yast/libzypp case

#7: Luis Medinas (lmedinas) (2010-02-11 23:01:49)
If Yast, firefox and Xorg removes HAL i think the GNOME livecd could be
shipped without HAL. This is at least my main goal for this feature and
it shouldn't be hard to accomplish it.

#8: Andreas Jaeger (a_jaeger) (2010-02-12 10:01:08) (reply to #7)
Firefox and Xorg changes have to come from upstream and get
integrated.

#9: Luis Medinas (lmedinas) (2010-02-14 21:53:49) (reply to #8)
Xorg is done on git master (xorg-server 1.7.x i guess), Firefox 3.7 is
using GIO/gvfs instead of gnome-vfs but i guess it won't make into
11.3. 

#10: Wolfgang Rosenauer (wrosenauer) (2010-02-15 11:22:45) (reply to
#9)
I can confirm that Firefox 3.7 (or how it's numbered in the end) already
should support GIO instead of gnome-vfs. Likely it's not finished in
11.3 timeframe though. Backporting the feature to 3.6 should be
possible but it's a pain and I don't want to waste my time if it's not
really necessary.

#11: Luis Medinas (lmedinas) (2010-02-15 16:28:29) (reply to #10)
Wolfgang i did a research in ubuntu and looks like they won't add that
patch to firefox. So i guess they are running firefox with hal at
runtime (hal isn't started on boot but only when firefox is running).

#12: Kay Sievers (kay_sievers) (2010-02-17 18:58:57) (reply to #11)
On Ubuntu, the systemwide hald process is activated by D-Bus only when
it is accessed. This will only slow down applications which request HAL
information at the first start, but not the bootup process.

#14: Vincent Untz (vuntz) (2010-02-17 19:33:43)
I saw that Debian disabled the PolicyKit and ConsoleKit integration in
hal because GNOME doesn't use it anymore, and KDE never used it. Maybe
we want to do it too (to help remove the old PolicyKit :-))

#16: Kay Sievers (kay_sievers) (2010-02-17 20:42:22) (reply to #14)
Here is a version of HAL that disables PolicyKit, and locks-down all
access to the "at_console" user:
  home:kay_sievers:branches:Base:System / hal
I'm able to de-install all of the old PolicyKit now.

#15: Luis Medinas (lmedinas) (2010-02-17 20:04:08)
Can someone confirm if the xorg-server on o:F is still using HAL ? Xorg-
server got rid of HAL on git master but i'm not sure if it's for xorg-
server 1.7 or 1.8

#17: Kay Sievers (kay_sievers) (2010-02-17 20:42:51) (reply to #15)
That version of X is not in Factory right now, it still requires HAL.

#20: Luis Medinas (lmedinas) (2010-02-19 14:06:51) (reply to #17)
You're right xorg-server 1.7 still uses HAL. On 1.8 git master they
moved to this patch, no idea what's the Xorg team plans for 11.3.
 
[1] -
http://cgit.freedesktop.org/xorg/xserver/commit/?id=435f27667f84269768efecde34de4af2b2d43376

+ #21: Rastislav Krupansky (ra100) (2010-03-01 07:36:59)
+ Just a note regarding to speed boot process. I tried Ubuntu Lucid Lynx
+ Alpha3, which doesn´t use hal. I don´t know whether it caused by hal
+ removal, or plymouth also, but Alpha3 has significantly faster boot
+ than Milestone2. Result is more than 30 sec. I just tried livecd boot
+ without installation.



--
openSUSE Feature:
https://features.opensuse.org/308762

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