Mailinglist Archive: opensuse-features (408 mails)

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[openFATE 305716] Disk partitioning under installation
  • From: fate_noreply@xxxxxxx
  • Date: Thu, 12 Nov 2009 12:09:35 +0100 (CET)
  • Message-id: <feature-305716-12@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Feature changed by: Robert Davies (robopensuse)
Feature #305716, revision 12
Title: Disk partitioning under installation

openSUSE-11.2: Rejected by Matthias Eckermann (mge1512)
reject date: 2009-08-21 13:41:17
reject reason: In focus for openSUSE 11.3
Priority
Requester: Important

openSUSE-11.3: Evaluation
Priority
Requester: Important

Requested by: Sebastian Furdal (resus)

Description:
We all know, that openSUSE as a default wants use on its own entire
disk. This is VERRY BAD setting.
On this website exist a pool:
http://suse.ehelp.pl/modules/xoopspoll/pollresults.php?poll_id=24
POLISH: Czy os11 powinien miec przy instalacji mozliwosc wyboru, na
ktorej partycji zainstalować system?
ENGLISH: Should os11 installation program have make a choice on what
partition install the system?
94% users sad YES (tak)
Try my proposal... "See the attachments"

Relations:
- [openSUSE 11.1] Disk partitioning under installation (Disk)
(novell/bugzilla/id: 383886)
https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=383886

Discussion:
#1: Sebastian Furdal (resus) (2008-04-25 12:36:23)
Created an attachment (id=210574) Disk (GIMP)

#2: Sebastian Furdal (resus) (2008-04-25 12:37:01)
Created an attachment (id=210575) Button "create"

#3: Arvin Schnell (aschnell) (2008-04-28 03:44:40)
Something for PM to decide.

#4: Stephan Kulow (coolo) (2008-04-28 04:10:30)
Actually this fits the feedback I got during fosdem - the _HUGE_
majority of (power) users has to change the proposal. But the "Create"
and "Edit" buttons are already more prominently as they were in
previous releases. This was on the behalf of this feedback.

#5: Sebastian Furdal (resus) (2008-04-28 07:47:26)
Created an attachment (id=210885) Version 2

#6: Matthias Eckermann (mge1512) (2008-04-29 04:06:15)
I do not completly understand the request, I fear:-( Is it (1) about
leaving space for windows or other OSes? (2) or about _how_ the Linux
partitioning should look like? (3) or about both?
I personally have a rather "sophisticated" partitioning (people say:
"crazy"), thus I am planning to propose a LVM based partitioning as one
(!) option (and default for our Enterprise Server product) with roughly
(!) this layout.
/dev/sda1 /boot /dev/sda2 /swap /dev/sda3 # system VG / /usr /opt /var
/dev/sda4 # data VG /tmp /home /srv
This more or less resembles the defaults of Unix/BSD systems.
As said: it is the "extended" variant of what I can imagine for
systems, where Linux is allowed to control the whole harddisk.
For systems with shared windows partitions the layout should be
different.
And suggestions? Comments? Ideas? Proposals?
Thanks in advance - so long - MgE

#8: Sebastian Furdal (resus) (2008-05-01 02:19:50)
(1)(1)does the idea of „automatic partitioning” is to make monopoly in
one OS on one computer? [sarcasm]
(2)(2)Yes, its only a proposal, more details I can make in some free
time.
(3)(3)Yap
(4)(4)but openSUSE is mostly installed by less advanced users, who
mostly do not know anything about Servers
(5)(5)Most people on the world have a Windows and they install
GNU/Linux with curiosity, and GNU/Linux should not propose to delete
their favorite system and all precious data that where collected for
years. This is something that makes openSUSE behind almost all major
GNU/Linux distributions. And even I do not use Windows, but GNU/Linux
(doesn't matter if its not openSUSE/SUSE) but I want check this distro
[...]
(6)(6)Propose:
1. After detecting disks and partitions Yast2 should propose mount
points for all existed partitions.
2. When it finds
completely free partition (doesn't matter with what file system -
sometimes users prepare before installation free partition under
different OS for a new system) OR/AND unallocated space with more size
than installation required
it should mark it with a green color – that on this partition/space You
can install openSUSE with options /boot, /swap, /, /usr, ... etc.
3. When it doesn't find good partition then it should ask “Create
automatic disk partitioning?”. a) YES - Automatically create partition
setup for home users (example only with “/” and “/home” and ”/boot” -
boot is very important for grub, because for example when a user delete
under windows Linux partition grub is still in the MBR but it cant find
config files - “OH MY GOD, LOOK LINUX DESTROYED MY SYSTEM – I WILL
NEVER USE LINIX AGAIN” and most people do not know anything about
windows installation “fixmbr”) - ALL DATA WILL BE LOST [red color] -
Automatically create partition setup for server - ALL DATA WILL BE LOST
[red color] b) NO - Edit partition setup (all proposed mount points in
step 1. should remain even without “/” but whit red warning “To install
openSUSE You have to create partition with minimal size
$MINIMAL_INSTALLATION_SIZE GB”).

#9: Matthias Eckermann (mge1512) (2008-05-06 20:56:51)
Hello and thanks for the answers. Please see my comments below.?
(In reply to comment #8 from Sebastian Furdal) > > (1) about leaving
space for windows or other OSes? > (1)(1)does the idea of „automatic
partitioning” is to make monopoly in one > OS on one computer?
[sarcasm]
I agree: I have at least 3 openSUSE/SLES systems on my systems, and
every fresh installation tries to kill my "vg_data". This is just
annoying and will be fixed. > > (2) or about _how_ the Linux
partitioning should look like? > (2)(2)Yes, its only a proposal, more
details I can make in some free time.
I also have some ideas there, ...
> (4)(4)but openSUSE is mostly installed by less advanced users, > who
mostly do not know anything about Servers
Well, that does not necessarily be true according to other requests I
see:-) But I agree that the "less advanced users" have to be covered in
the most save way.
> [...] This is something that makes openSUSE behind almost all major >
GNU/Linux distributions. [...]
Well, you might simply avoid those type of comments, please, as it
weakens your very valid points above and below ( because people might
become angry ).
> (6)(6)Propose: > [...]
Instead of your proposal let me post a proposal I wrote roughly 2 years
ago here in bugzilla (closed bug); in meta-programming-language (and
covering also datacenter use e.g. of SLES product):
if( SAN-storage-found ) { expert-partitioning(); } else if( num-of-
harddisks > 1 ) { expert-partitioning(); } else if( only-one-windows-
partition_on( first_harddisk ) ) { # case 2 below partitioning-with-
shrink( first_harddisk ) | expert-partitioning(); } else if( some-
partitions-but-free-space_on( first_harddisk ) ){ # case 3 below
partitioning-without-shrink-or-delete_on (first_harddisk ) | expert-
partitioning(); } else if( some-partitions-but-no-free-space_on(
first_harddisk ) ) { expert-partitioning(); } else if( multiple-
existing-OSes-found ){ expert-partitioning(); } else { # empty
harddisk, case 1 below default-partitioning(); }
I would like to see that a little bit less complex, but I hope it could
be a good start; I also hope we can agree that there are only three
relatively "safe" & easy cases: 1. one empty harddisk 2. one harddisk
full with another OS (most probably windows) 3. (at least) one (bigger)
empty primary partition on first harddisk Everything else needs
"knowledge" by the person in front of the computer, i.e. an "expert
partitioner" YaST module to support this person,
HTH - MgE

#10: Matthias Eckermann (mge1512) (2008-05-26 06:19:13)
What do you think?

#11: Sebastian Furdal (resus) (2008-07-20 03:40:24)
I think advanced partitioning should be rewritten, sometimes it is to
complicated ... Your proposal is good but openSUSE should automatically
propose simple and automatic solutions ... such as:
- propose partitions where oS could be installed - propose automatic
mount points - propose some profiles of partitioning
etc.
What You think?

#12: Andreas Jaeger (a_jaeger) (2008-10-24 05:24:05)
Information was provided.

#13: Matthias Eckermann (mge1512) (2009-01-21 11:57:03)
Moved to openFATE from bugzilla. Let's proceed for openSUSE 11.2 based
on what we have in openSUSE 11.1.

#14: Robert Davies (robopensuse) (2009-02-03 18:21:57)
On LVM it does not support barriers used by fs journals, which for ext3
in SuSE are enabled (but not by most distros). If a Windows type system
is detected, I suggest default to resize. If previous Linux, I would
offer to 'edit' the current setup, or use whole disk, as it is hard
(impossible?) to make good guesses on behalf experienced user.

#15: Martin Schmidkunz (mschmidkunz) (2009-02-06 14:41:43)
What about adopting the installation proposal layout to the
partitioning during installation?
See http://en.opensuse.org/Image:Partitioner_proposal.png for a mock
up

+ #18: Robert Davies (robopensuse) (2009-11-12 12:08:25) (reply to #15)
+ The Language used "Create" "Edit" Partitioning proposals is confusing
+ to those not regularly installiung systems.  A line saying "Create
+ Partition Based Proposal (change)" is exactly the type of option that
+ leaves reviewers scratching their heads.
+ Can't their be "simple directly expressed options" presented like
+ "Automatic Paritioning - Preserve Windows & Other Data", "Automatic -
+ Loose Existing Data", "Custom Partioning", "Custom Partition - Loose
+ Existing Data" (possibly a quick way to zero the partition table,
+ rather than delete them 1 by 1 would make this option redundant), "LVM
+ Automatic Paritioning - Preserving Data" & "LVM Automatic - Loose
+ Existing Data".
+ The language of creating & editting proposals, is clear if you know the
+ implementation of the installation partitioner, but not to the end
+ user.

#16: Andreas Jaeger (a_jaeger) (2009-08-11 15:56:41)
What exactly should be done in this feature?



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openSUSE Feature:
https://features.opensuse.org/305716

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