On 2018-02-20 10:38, Ludwig Nussel wrote:
Stefan Seyfried wrote:
On 20.02.2018 00:32, Simon Lees wrote:
The problem is if we are treating all desktops equally (well equally within 2 tiers) which we are trying to why should LXDE go on the dvd over LXQt? why should xfce go in over Cinnamon, Mate or enlightenment?
This is a valid argument, however, let's look at the technical aspects.
LXDE: 20MB on the DVD (hard to count since its recommends from the patterns are not named in a consistent way for easy grepping) XFCE: 30MB on the DVD MATE: around 120MB on the dvd (already not counting ubuntu-matte-*) Cinnamon: hard to tell because there is not even a pattern, but it looks like it's about the same size as XFCE or LXDE LXQT: about 15MB Enlightenment: you can tell this better than my rough guess would be able to
Note that all but MATE use some XFCE tools to do stuff, so XFCE is even cheaper if we decide to include the others ;-)
Ok, interesting math. At the same time that defeats the argument of the slow internet connection somehow, doesn't it? Rather cheap to pull those alternatives from the online repos since all the shared components are already on the DVD.
No, it doesn't defeat the argument of the slow internet, on the contrary. I had a slow, 1 Mbit/s internet for a long time, so I do know. We installed with the full DVD, downloaded across several days, so that the installation itself would complete without Internet. Then, after booting the new system we downloaded the updates and the extras; slowly, but with a system already up and running. The primary duty of the DVD is to be able to install without internet a working system. Not to have it complete. Thus, sound fonts are not needed in that role, nor is texlive. Neither are needed parts of the desktop and system. They may be very important part for some people, of course, but they are not required to run the desktop, and then download the rest. Arguably, LibreOffice is also not needed, but there are many more people using it than texlive. Ditto for games. :-P
So again the question remains, who exactly are we targeting with the DVD? If "people with slow internet connection" why of all the options would they care about desktop environments?
Of course we do. Why would anybody not want to run with a desktop, thus using text mode just because there is no Internet? It doesn't follow.
Chromium for example is bigger than most of the desktops you listed. Having it initially may reduce download size for online updates as deltas would be based on the original package.
I didn't know that Chromium was included in the DVD. I'd say the same: there is FF, not a must have, can be downloaded later, with time and patience. But some people may prefer it. The criteria for removal should be remove all large packages that are not required to have any desktop up and running without Internet. Having all desktops should be the priority; having them complete secondary. Alternatively, bigger image or two images; probably the later. -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 42.2 x86_64 "Malachite" at Telcontar)