Mailinglist Archive: opensuse-factory (673 mails)

["Rajko M." <rmatov101@xxxxxxxxxxx>]

On Saturday 06 September 2008 06:48:51 am Martin Schlander wrote:
> Fredag 05 september 2008 19:57:36 skrev Fred A. Miller:
> > Michael Loeffler wrote:
> > > We'll try to put again both KDEs on the media.
> >
> > Ok......thanks! I think all we need, ASSUMING KDE 4.2 is a FULL COMPLETE
> > release for KDE 3.5, is to have 3.5 included with the next release of
> > openSUSE.
> > It can be dropped after that.
>
> It's still unknown when 11.2 is released - it might even have KDE 4.3 - if
> it's released in the fall of 2009 - which I consider likely given that 2009
> is SLE year which will absorb much developer time.
>
> But I can tell you right now with 100% certainty that neither KDE 4.2 nor
> 4.3 will be identical with KDE 3.5. And it's still extremely vague what you
> guys define as "full complete", to say the least.

Full complete means "all functions that I use", which is not well defined even 
by very organized people. 

When I see "FULL, COMPLETE, FINISHED" after so many requests by KDE guys to 
name missing features and getting the same answer time and again, points to 
guys with to much time on their hands and wish to goof around with 
those "Linux zealots". 
 
Someone mentioned "can't hide taskbar". I used it once to check how it works, 
so, while I know what it is, I will not miss it a bit. 

On the other side, ability to size and position taskbar in any direction with 
all icons in it, is for me feature that was missing since ever, and now I 
have it. Cry for old good hide etc, seems to be just "I didn't tried to find 
what's new, but I don't like it". 

> Besides a couple of missing features and a few bugs, are only part of what
> people complain about regarding KDE4 - backwards compatibility of settings
> and simply being "different" are just as prominent complaints - and those
> "problems" are not exactly likely to diminish over time imho.

Differences will only grow. 
Once people realize that old settings were just the best approximation of 
graphical desktop, because computers at that time couldn't handle what they 
can today, requests for new type of features will multiply and number of 
differences will grow.  

> Furthermore, openSUSE 11.1 may attract hordes of these types of users from
> other distros, since it'll be the only major distro still shipping KDE3 on
> the media at that time (well, along with Debian Lenny). Therefore I think
> it's likely we'll still see a substantial segment of users demanding KDE3
> at 11.2 time, maybe even bigger than now ;-)
>
> So I think we should make an effort to communicate very clearly that 11.1
> will be the very last release officially supporting KDE3 - and that
> attaching yourself deeper into a legacy desktop with no future, is probably
> not a very good idea for most people in the long run. 

I agree. That would be a good reason to start limiting KDE3 support now, and 
make clear that there will be no KDE3 on 11.2 media, only in OBS for those 
that can't switch to KDE4 so fast. Although openSUSE is not a commercial 
version, by now it didn't left users in the cold, but it is time to move on. 

Other distributions force change because Linux can't stay with GUI developed 
for hardware capabilities from 2000. Presentations, or eyecandies, move from 
specialized applications to desktop, and if OS can't provide tools it will 
stay away from mainstream. Some use cases can live, even today, with a 
command line and everything between, but most of the users will appreciate 
smoother feeling of the new desktop once application developers get used to 
new tools and start using them more then now. Now is rush to move 
applications from 3 to 4, but then it will start time of GUI improvements. 

-- 
Regards, Rajko
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