Mailinglist Archive: opensuse-factory (904 mails)
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Re: [opensuse-factory] [Fwd: [opensuse-offtopic] Some things forthe SUSE team to pay attention to!]
- From: Clayton <smaug42@xxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Tue, 8 Apr 2008 12:01:41 +0200
- Message-id: <e29967880804080301j67544c2ej48c98e73fc60f7e5@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > dependencies).(in terms of how it informs the user of
I only agree in that exact point, the wording on the error messages> still seems to come from hell looking from a joe user perspective,
> hopefully they will improve in the future.
Can you give an example where the alternatives are making a better job?
Assuming you mean with the YAST package manager?
I haven't spent enough time with 11.0Alphas to speak for changes
there, but in 10.3 and older.... when you open YAST (using all default
settings, no after-install tweaks, so as a new user would use it), and
select a few packages to be installed, the dependency and conflict
resolution does not happen until you either click the Check
Dependencies button, or you click Apply... then a window is popped
open which basically says, oh by the way I have all these other
packages that need to be installed... no clear indication of what
extra bits belong to which applicaton.
In conflict resolution, the window used to display the conflict errors
is confusing even to experienced users... and you never feel you
really have a handle on what is going on, or what you just did was
what you hoped you wanted.
Sticking with software currently available on openSUSE, compare that
to Smart (which despite the Smart GUI deficiencies is often the
preferred "replacement" for YAST.. just ask on the mailing list how
many people use it in place of YAST, and then ask why). If you click
on an application in Smart to do an update or new install, you are
immediately presented with information about what the consequences
are... what packages will be removed, and what will be added/updated.
Granted, conflict resolution is handled badly in Smart too... ie it
just says there is a conflict and gives no help at all with resolving,
but YAST's conflict resolution solution is more confusing to a new
user (based on what people are telling me).
Looking at software outside of openSUSE... take Synaptic... again from
a new user perspective... Synaptic, like Smart, also presents
information about the app you are installing/updating... you know when
you click on something what the impact is likely to be.
This immediate feedback is a major issue with people when they use
YAST... or at least that is what they tell me when I ask why they
prefer either to drop YAST in favor of Smart, or if they drop openSUSE
1-Click is a major improvement for installing new apps, but does
cannot be used for managing installed apps (updating/removing etc).
All new users who are trying out openSUSE for the first time have told
me they really like the 1-Click thing.
The simplest way to install Ubuntu... and install/update/remove some
software using Synaptic. Compare that to YAST. There are bits where
YAST does a better job.. mostly behind the scenes... but try to think
of it as a new to Linux user... which is simpler to understand, and
easier to use... YAST is likely not the answer....
It is worth noting that the rest of YAST... nothing beats it... so
far, other than for software management, it is so far ahead of other
tools that there is no comparison...
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