*The original goal of the module, as described by jdsn (and as documented on the wiki at http://en.opensuse.org/YaST_Education), was to: * Create/edit/delete users and assign them to "edu-groups". "what groups are handled as edu-groups is defined in the edu-users sysconfig file. Only these groups will be displayed, only users of these groups can be created, edited and deleted." As noted in my last post, I believe that one should also be able to create custom edu-groups from within the Education module. ----JT: Works for me! * Assign Sabayon/Kiosk tool templates to these edu-groups. The module does not handle the creation/editing of said templates, but only allows existing templates to be assigned to edu-groups. ----JT: I have tried to get the OS team to keep the Sabayon module working. However, it may be that we need to adopt the module as a EDU component, if we want it do so, even though this is clearly a Gnome component. With this module running we could install all the desktop software and just manage the menus according to age group. Zonker? * Configure a transparent proxy and Internet filter, if desired. As James pointed out, this should not be forced on the user (since they might already be doing site-wide filtering), but should be an option. My plan is to develop another module for configuring Dansguardian/Squidguard that the parent/teacher could then later use to configure filtering. ----JT: I would further point out that this whole "build a proxy server and filter it" thing should be the domain of the OS team (YaST: Network Services > Internet Proxy\Cache and Filtering) not our subproject. But since we need it to help schools protect children..... Zonker? * Configure firewall settings for each group, if desired. I envision this as a list of well-known applications where the user can check/uncheck entire groups (e.g. Chat programs) or specific applications (e.g. Pidgin). The module would then handle blocking the appropriate ports in the SuSE firewall. -----JT: This should be dealt with as an enhancement request to the OS team for the YaST Firewall module. Zonker? * Doug Glenn suggested the ability to import a list of students from a CSV file, for example. The module would then create these students, saving the administrator from the menial task of having to create them one by one. I like this idea, and it's simple to implement. ----JT: This is an extremely nice idea, Thanks Doug * Doug also suggested the ability to allow non-root users to use the module. For instance, if I'm a school administrator, I might want to give a teacher the ability to control the computers in his/her classroom, but I might not necessarily want to give him/her root. This is certainly a nice to have, but gets a little hairy when we have to deal with configuring firewall rules as a non-root user, etc. Nevertheless, there could be a "root" mode to the module, as well as a "teacher" mode. ----JT: Again, Thanks Doug * Lars suggested the ability to assign schedules to various groups, allowing hours of usage to be restricted, and ensure that kids can't use the computer past their bedtime. :) I think this is extremely useful, at least in the home domain. ----JT: This should be dealt with as an enhancement to the YaST user module as a logon restriction. Business's would use this to keep workers from one shift being logged on during another. Zonker? * Lars also mentioned the ability to send a report to the parent/teacher stating the web sites that were blocked. I think this falls under the Dansguardian module that I would be developing, and would certainly add that functionality to that module. -----JT: should be part of the proxy server module , Novell's Bordermanager and Astaro both do this as "rule hitting" logs. I believe Novell is working on a Bordermanager replacement for Linux, maybe they intend to have an open source base module with a closed source enhancement. Someone should ask, no sense duplicating efforts, Zonker? * James has suggested that the module should actually install specific software applications according to pre-defined groups, and should allow the configuration of desktop software vs. server software. My feeling on this is mixed. On the one hand, I see what Lars is saying. By having the module install software, we're infringing on the domain of sw_single and the software patterns that have been created for the Education CD. Furthermore, if sw_single is run in the installation workflow, and the user selects packages and patterns to install, is it not then confusing to have the Education module ask again about software patterns that should be installed? I would be sitting there thinking, "I just selected my patterns a few minutes ago, why are you asking me again about what software should be installed?" *On the other hand, sw_single is not necessarily very user friendly for users with limited openSUSE knowledge and it would be good to have a simple wizard that would allow someone to specify, "I want to install applications appropriate to elementary school students" and those applications would be automatically installed. *My feeling here is that this is important to have as a separate module in the installation workflow, as Lars suggested, but I don't think it fits with the vision of the Education module (perhaps Education module is the wrong name?). I view the module as a "I've installed my system, made my software choices, and now I want to lock it down" type of module -- one that runs late in the installation workflow (e.g. after reboot). I realize this is going to be a point of contention, but let's discuss this further. ----JT: Since the conception of the Education project, I have been trying to further the idea that non-technical people in education, aka Teachers, need our assistance. They are constantly FORCED to build computer labs and support technology without budgets to hire professionals. Overriding sw_single with a module that introduces less choices yet presents choices based on the target location \ user group is indeed the core idea and reason I worked so hard to get this project started. In concept this would go one step further than Edubuntu, which provides almost no installation choices at all. If someone wants a machine based on the choices available in the default OS and they have enough knowledge to make advanced choices from sw_single while in the default OS, then they can set up a proxy server/firewall/Dan's Guardian/etc. and add the software for their curriculum from the internet without our help. * Lastly, James, you indicate your interest in focusing on the school first, and home second. Lars, you feel it should be the other way around. I think we're just arguing semantics here. My feeling is that we can satisfy both domains with the features I have laid out above. These domains are, by no means, mutually exclusive. The same basic needs are there: controlling what applications can be run, what protocols can be used, and what sites we want our kids to be visiting. ----JT: if the schools need to target the 3 teaching groups (Elementary,Middle,High school) are met, we will have already met the parents needs. Parents are another group that don't have a lot of technical expertise, yet, need to help a child. If while presenting the choices for the group the child\target machine belongs to, we also present a choice to "use internet filtering" we succeed in supporting the school and the parent. My overarching goal here is to present an education system on a disk. A soup to nuts approach to technology for educators. We already have the tools "in the wild" to do this, I just wanted to bring it all to one spot and simplify the installation. AKA "Education Technology for Dummies" like the books. After reading this over and over again, I'm beginning to think maybe you should build a new YaST Module to replace Sabayon and the Kiosk tool with some enhancements for group creation. The rest is beginning to sound like reasonable requests of the OS team. Eternally Grateful, James -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-edu+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-edu+help@opensuse.org