Mailinglist Archive: opensuse-buildservice (162 mails)

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Re: [opensuse-buildservice] Re: openSUSE:Tools dropped 11.3 repo already?
  • From: Archie Cobbs <archie.cobbs@xxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Fri, 27 Jan 2012 09:13:00 -0600
  • Message-id: <CANSoFxuN=Y5+r33v7+1jCZNSoYcP+XCJPEvuQC5HYpoFKKBKeA@mail.gmail.com>
On Thu, Jan 26, 2012 at 7:41 PM, Jim Henderson <hendersj@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
On Thu, 26 Jan 2012 13:28:11 -0600, Archie Cobbs wrote:
On Thu, Jan 26, 2012 at 12:28 PM, Claudio Freire
<klaussfreire@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
To attempt a justification as to why older RHEL distros still exist,
non-opensuse repos get added with less frequency. Otherwise, it
wouldn't be possible to keep them all, just as it isn't possible with
opensuse ones. You have to draw a line somewhere.

I appreciate this attempted explanation, but it is completely
inadequate. Still waiting for a good one.

What exactly is inadequate about it?

1.  You're using a free distribution
2.  You're using services that are provided for free
3.  Those services require disk storage, bandwidth, and other resources
that aren't free.
4.  Since those resources aren't free, it's not possible to keep
everything for all versions going back forever.
5.  That means that when resources are constrained, something gets
clipped, and the logical starting place is to start with the oldest stuff.

If you want something that's got LTS, SUSE has some commercial options
with the resources necessary paid for by licensing fees paid by customers
so the support is retained for a longer period.

Free (as in beer) does have its limitations.

Understood. I don't take anything for granted and understand that when
it comes to service, you get what you pay for... and if you're paying
nothing, you have a right to demand nothing. In addition I would even
argue that OBS users have a moral responsibility to contribute back,
in the form of patches, bug reports, builds of new software, etc. (and
I try to do this).

I'm not demanding anything, just asking a fairly narrow question. I'm
simply seeking to better understand, because my previous assumptions
were obviously wrong.

Your #5 is:

"That means that when resources are constrained,
something gets clipped, and the logical starting
place is to start with the oldest stuff."

Sounds good to me! So let's look at the facts:

openSUSE 11.3: 1.5 years old, and is a SUSE distribution

RHEL 4: 7 years old, and is not a SUSE distribution

My simple question is: why openSUSE 11.3 before (for example) RHEL 4?
What are the underlying priorities that resulted in that choice?

If the answer is "because 11.3 is EOL" well then I guess what I don't
agree with is that equation. All openSUSE are (by definition)
supported by their owners. These owners need the OBS repos in order to
perform that support. If that support is unilaterally denied at the 18
month mark, then it dramatically reduces the usefulness of openSUSE
for a large swath of possible use cases (basically, everything other
than personal use).

OK, let's just admit the obvious: Novell is a business and it doesn't
want to allow business' "mission critical" software to run on openSUSE
because that represents lost revenue for SLES. Their enforcement
mechanism is to limit openSUSE support to 18 months. While this is
entirely in their right, this is a very blunt instrument. It is
similar to the airlines charging you a higher price if you don't stay
over a Saturday night: another blunt instrument targeted at business
travelers.

However there is a difference between the airlines' business and the
open source software business: the latter is a true ecosystem, where
you depend on the contributions of your customers. Food for thought.

Thanks,
-Archie

--
Archie L. Cobbs
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