On Friday 21 November 2008 15:23:39 Martin Schmidkunz wrote:

Hi everybody,

as might have noticed I am going through the modules and try to apply the YaST style guide to them. First of all I want to thank all of you who are willing to apply the proposals. Especially as it is Beta/RC time for openSUSE 11.1 and SLE 11 , so many of you are busy with things that have more priority than button labeling :-)

The next issue I want to raise is the really abort library (http://forgeftp.novell.com/yast/doc/SL11.1/modules/Popup.html#ReallyAbort) which according to my information is used when the user made changes in a module and closes the module.

Currently there are the following usability issues with this library: * inconsistent use * inconsistent text * yes/no as button labels might confuse the user and should be avoided

So, my proposal would be * use ReallyAbort only when the user made some changes in the module and clicks on cancel * redesign the pop up into: http://en.opensuse.org/Image:Ysg_discarding_changes_notbold.png

What do you think of the proposal? Is it understandable?

For the redesign in general: should I make a bug entry or a FATE entry or can be adjusted without any of those two mechanisms?

The popup redesign can be simply done (for openSUSE 11.2) ;-) Thanks a lot for looking into this!

Thanks and have a nice weekend,

Same to you! Stano -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: yast-devel+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: yast-devel+help@opensuse.org

What do you think of the proposal? Is it understandable?

Not quite :-) Especially when it comes to the function of buttons 'Discard' stands for 'Really abort? Yes' - exits the module without saving the changes made by user. But what about 'Apply' ? Does it write the changes and come back to the module so the user can make further changes? (that was fairly non-standard behaviour & terminology yast2-storage had used until recently). Or does it save the changes AND exit the module, just as if user clicked 'Ok' or 'Finish' button? If the latter is the case, what about using 'Save' label instead, and changing the text to "Do you want to save the changes or discard them?" I'm sorry, I'm maybe too influenced by y2-storage, but 'Apply' evokes 'Save and come back' action to me, while 'Save' really stands for 'Save and exit' ... B. -- \\\\\ Katarina Machalkova \\\\\\\__o YaST developer __\\\\\\\'/_ & hedgehog painter -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: yast-devel+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: yast-devel+help@opensuse.org

Hello, On Nov 21 15:23 Martin Schmidkunz wrote (shortened):

as might have noticed I am going through the modules and try to apply the YaST style guide to them. ... The next issue I want to raise is the really abort library (http://forgeftp.novell.com/yast/doc/SL11.1/modules/Popup.html#ReallyAbort) which according to my information is used when the user made changes in a module and closes the module.

What does "closes the module" mean? According to my understanding of http://en.opensuse.org/YaST/Style_Guide the only way to abort a module is via the window decoration ------------------------------------------------------------------------- If the user presses "Cancel" or "Close" in the window decoration the module is closed. If the user made some changes, a warning pop up appears, which asks the user, if he really wants to discard his changes. The pop up is handled by http://forgeftp.novell.com/yast/doc/SL11.1/modules/Popup.html#ReallyAbort ------------------------------------------------------------------------- I do not find any other place in http://en.opensuse.org/YaST/Style_Guide which mentions "abort". According to http://en.opensuse.org/YaST/Style_Guide#Single_Configuration.2FOverview.2FEd... there is no longer a "abort" functionality which exits the whole module. Instead this button is now named "Cancel" and its functionality is to go back to the Overview dialog (i.e. what the "back" button would do) because it reads "Cancel - Closes the window and returns to the overview." The same for http://en.opensuse.org/YaST/Style_Guide#Configuration_Wizard there is also no longer a "abort" functionality which exits the current wizard or even the whole module. The only way out is the "Cancel" butten and its functionality is also to go back to the Overview dialog because it reads "Cancel - Closes the window and returns to the overview." On the other hand this is in contradiction to http://en.opensuse.org/YaST/Style_Guide/Why_Use_Cancel which reads ----------------------------------------------------------- The controversy about the label of the "Cancel" button is a very, very old one. Up to now (August 2008) "Abort" is used as label ----------------------------------------------------------- which implies that the button with the label "Cancel" has "abort" functionality.

Is it understandable?

No. It is confusing as long as you do not describe very pedantic the exact meaning (i.e. the exact functionality) of a button or whatever else dialog element (i.e. widget). I suggest that you make some kind of "glossary" about the exact meaning of the words which you use to describe the functionality of a dialog element and of the words which you use to label a dialog element (e.g. a button). For example what exactly is meant with an "abort" functionality? At least for me "abort" means "emergency exit immediately here regardless of the consequences" i.e. something like "kill" the process or even "kill -9" it. Kind Regards Johannes Meixner -- SUSE LINUX Products GmbH, Maxfeldstrasse 5, 90409 Nuernberg, Germany AG Nuernberg, HRB 16746, GF: Markus Rex -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: yast-devel+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: yast-devel+help@opensuse.org