[opensuse-wiki] ATTENTION: please keep organization in mind

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[opensuse-wiki] 11.2 Step-by-step...

Rupert Horstkötter

13 Nov 2009 13 Nov '09

13:19

Team, I'm pretty much satisfied with the progress we make with the Usability Concept, no question, but there's one thing we constantly need to take care of - not losing organization and having the big picture in mind. That said, I'd like provide an attempt to structure the tasks we need to achieve at first glance and especially order them appropriately: We need to... 1. agree on the QA process - Rajko is currently reviewing FlaggedRevs and approx. ETA is end of this week (this is important for the creation of the new instance) 1a. not urgent (during transition) but related to 1: creation of the Wiki Forum at forums.o.o as part of QA - my task 2. come up with article-templates (to ensure consistent design) and sort wiki-templates (like: tested with openSUSE 11.2) - Shayon? John? 3. create the Guidelines (at least that part we need for our Transition Guidelines - that is 1 and 2) - cannot be done prior completion of 1 and 2 - my task (helping hands appreciated) 4. agree on a transition plan and come up with those Transition Guidelines (almost done, I like Petr's approach and afaik we're all in sync to prefer henne's 3rd option) 5. Go through http://en.opensuse.org/Wiki_Team/Checked_Pages and begin to migrate in conformity with 2 and 4 I write this email to raise the attention on the following (while I hope this is anyway obvious): We cannot get started with tasks 4 and 5 before we completed tasks 1, 2, 3. Other things like the establishment of the front portal (Federico, Petr, Rajko and Shayon), the project-portals and wiki-projects (Federico and Petr) and so on are not mission-critical for the success of the actual transition though. Best, R -- Rupert Horstkötter openSUSE Community Assistant http://en.opensuse.org/User:Rhorstkoetter Email: rhorstkoetter@opensuse.org Jabber: ruperthorstkoetter@googlemail.com -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+help@opensuse.org

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Shayon Mukherjee

13 Nov 13 Nov

15:19

Hello, Rupert Horstkötter wrote:

...

Team,

I'm pretty much satisfied with the progress we make with the Usability Concept, no question, but there's one thing we constantly need to take care of - not losing organization and having the big picture in mind. That said, I'd like provide an attempt to structure the tasks we need to achieve at first glance and especially order them appropriately:

We need to...

1. agree on the QA process - Rajko is currently reviewing FlaggedRevs and approx. ETA is end of this week (this is important for the creation of the new instance) 1a. not urgent (during transition) but related to 1: creation of the Wiki Forum at forums.o.o as part of QA - my task 2. come up with article-templates (to ensure consistent design) and sort wiki-templates (like: tested with openSUSE 11.2) - Shayon? John?

Well i listed maximum number of templates which needs review(few are still left) by Rajko and other senior members of openSUSE Wiki .As Rajko is busy now a days with experimenting and other stuffs.So it would take a bit time , but will be completed soon :) . And now Remi (Spyhawk) is actively taking care of the templates at the same time .!

...

3. create the Guidelines (at least that part we need for our Transition Guidelines - that is 1 and 2) - cannot be done prior completion of 1 and 2 - my task (helping hands appreciated) 4. agree on a transition plan and come up with those Transition Guidelines (almost done, I like Petr's approach and afaik we're all in sync to prefer henne's 3rd option) 5. Go through http://en.opensuse.org/Wiki_Team/Checked_Pages and begin to migrate in conformity with 2 and 4

I write this email to raise the attention on the following (while I hope this is anyway obvious): We cannot get started with tasks 4 and 5 before we completed tasks 1, 2, 3. Other things like the establishment of the front portal (Federico, Petr, Rajko and Shayon), the project-portals and wiki-projects (Federico and Petr) and so on are not mission-critical for the success of the actual transition though.

Aha , !

...

Best, R

Best, Shayon -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+help@opensuse.org

Rupert Horstkötter

16 Nov 16 Nov

15:55

Shayon, 2009/11/13 Shayon Mukherjee :

...

Well i listed maximum number of templates which needs review(few are still left) by Rajko and other senior members of openSUSE Wiki .As Rajko is busy now a days with experimenting and other stuffs.So it would take a bit time , but will be completed soon :) . And now Remi (Spyhawk) is actively taking care of the templates at the same time .!

Thanks for the update. I talked to Spyhawk by myself on IRC and I'm really looking forward to the results. Is there an approx. ETA? May you please notify the team when finished with this effort? Rajko, 2009/11/16 Rajko M. :

...

I created wiki page about FlaggedRevs, that is just illustration of few functions. As I use the latest of both Mediawiki and FlaggedRevs, there seems to be a bug that under circumstances doesn't show any mark, for any user, but that part I didn't investigate further. The issue appear when page is edited, not changed. but saved. The history of the article will show information about stable revision correctly, just public mark in a top right corner is not present.

http://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Extension_FlaggedRevs

I'm definitely for this extension, as it solves few problems at once: - marking quality of the article public so that every viewer can see it - everybody can see any revision, as stable is just presented by default, but users can look at draft using top line of links or link within mark - preventing inexperienced users to mess the article without anyone noticing, because users with editor and reviewer status are notified when they log in that there are pending reviews.

The extension is very configurable, so above is just few words about default configuration that seems to fit very well our needs.

For real wiki with applied extension that may have different configuration ( I didn't check that one) you can see: http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Main_Page

I'll have a precise look on what you provided tomorrow. I have a meeting in 5 Minutes and I certainly don't want to do this in just a few minutes. Thanks a lot for your work in advance. Best, R -- Rupert Horstkötter openSUSE Community Assistant http://en.opensuse.org/User:Rhorstkoetter Email: rhorstkoetter@opensuse.org Jabber: ruperthorstkoetter@googlemail.com -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+help@opensuse.org

Shayon Mukherjee

16:40

Rupert Horstkötter wrote:

...

Shayon,

2009/11/13 Shayon Mukherjee :

...
Well i listed maximum number of templates which needs review(few are still left) by Rajko and other senior members of openSUSE Wiki .As Rajko is busy now a days with experimenting and other stuffs.So it would take a bit time , but will be completed soon :) . And now Remi (Spyhawk) is actively taking care of the templates at the same time .!

Thanks for the update. I talked to Spyhawk by myself on IRC and I'm really looking forward to the results. Is there an approx. ETA? May you please notify the team when finished with this effort?

Well i am not sure about an approx ETA (most probably a week or so, though not sure).As it is constant process .And requires very much of reviewing work and all similar stuffs.So it would take time. But will surely notify when its done (any one of the concerned one can do this) :)

...

Best, R

Best, Shayon -- openSUSE Wiki Team Member http://en.opensuse.org/User:Wwarlock Website: http://www.shay0n.hpage.com Email: hkwarlock@gmail.com Twitter: wwarl0ck -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+help@opensuse.org

Remy Marquis

17 Nov 17 Nov

05:40

...

...
...
Well i listed maximum number of templates which needs review(few are still left) by Rajko and other senior members of openSUSE Wiki .As Rajko is busy now a days with experimenting and other stuffs.So it would take a bit time , but will be completed soon :) . And now Remi (Spyhawk) is actively taking care of the templates at the same time .!

Thanks for the update. I talked to Spyhawk by myself on IRC and I'm really looking forward to the results. Is there an approx. ETA? May you please notify the team when finished with this effort?

Well i am not sure about an approx ETA (most probably a week or so, though not sure).As it is constant process .And requires very much of reviewing work and all similar stuffs.So it would take time. But will surely notify when its done (any one of the concerned one can do this) :)

Hi, About the Flaggrev : It seems to be the way to go :) About the Templates : It a total mess :) With Rajko and Shayon, we had a look at the 200+ different templates available, cleaned bunch of articles and marked dozen of useless or duplicate templates for deletion. There is more work to come, but at the present state, the following wiki pages - [[Template]] regroups the templates that are really useful and that shouldn't be deleted - [[Daily_templates]] regroups the main tags that will be used for article review/writing style policy and (more to come here) I believe it is impossible to entirely clean the actual wiki on a short term (as this implies to rewrite/change tags on hundreds of pages), but we can start the new wiki with the already "checked" templates. We will need to rewrite some pages to assure a consistent visual style, but hopefully we won't need to change the irrelevant pages that won't be transferred in the new wiki anyway. Also, if a template reveals itself to be essential when we proofread the new wiki, we can add it on the "checked template" list. To summarize, it's difficult to clean the actual wiki, but we'll be able to start the new wiki with selected template in a few days at the latest. We still need to work a bit on the visual appearance of some templates thus. Regards, R. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+help@opensuse.org

Shayon

06:23

Hello, On Nov 17, 2009, at 11:10 AM, Remy Marquis wrote:

...

...
...
Well i am not sure about an approx ETA (most probably a week or so, though not sure).As it is constant process .And requires very much of reviewing work and all similar stuffs.So it would take time. But will surely notify when its done (any one of the concerned one can do this) :)

Hi,

About the Flaggrev : It seems to be the way to go :)

About the Templates : It a total mess :) With Rajko and Shayon, we had a look at the 200+ different templates available, cleaned bunch of articles and marked dozen of useless or duplicate templates for deletion. There is more work to come, but at the present state, the following wiki pages

- [[Template]] regroups the templates that are really useful and that shouldn't be deleted - [[Daily_templates]] regroups the main tags that will be used for article review/writing style policy and (more to come here)

Also [[Template messages to review]] -this contains the templates which needs the review by the senior wiki team members, so as to how to deal with them

...

I believe it is impossible to entirely clean the actual wiki on a short term (as this implies to rewrite/change tags on hundreds of pages), but we can start the new wiki with the already "checked" templates. We will need to rewrite some pages to assure a consistent visual style, but hopefully we won't need to change the irrelevant pages that won't be transferred in the new wiki anyway. Also, if a template reveals itself to be essential when we proofread the new wiki, we can add it on the "checked template" list.

To summarize, it's difficult to clean the actual wiki, but we'll be able to start the new wiki with selected template in a few days at the latest. We still need to work a bit on the visual appearance of some templates thus.

I am on the same page here Remu :)

...

Regards,

R.

Best, Shayon Sent from my iPhone -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+help@opensuse.org

Remy Marquis

07:14

...

...
[...] There is more work to come, but at the present state, the following wiki pages

- [[Template]] regroups the templates that are really useful and that shouldn't be deleted - [[Daily_templates]] regroups the main tags that will be used for article review/writing style policy and (more to come here)

Also [[Template messages to review]] -this contains the templates which needs the review by the senior wiki team members, so as to how to deal with them

I had a look at the listed templates, and marked for deletion those that are unused/irrelevant. But I am too lazy to update the status of each of them in the table. Table should be avoided as much as possible in a wiki, it's hard to maintain/modify without having a headache :) On Tue, Nov 17, 2009 at 5:56 PM, Jon Rocker wrote:

...

On a short term, anything of this magnitude is impossible. We need to come up with a plan in smaller bites (no pun intended). Cleaning and maintaining the wiki is one thing that should be continually done. Not something that is done once in a while.

I was obviously referring about Templates cleaning , not entire wiki cleaning :) Regards, R. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+help@opensuse.org

Shayon

08:02

Hello,

...

...
...
Also [[Template messages to review]] -this contains the templates which needs the review by the senior wiki team members, so as to how to deal with them

I had a look at the listed templates, and marked for deletion those that are unused/irrelevant. But I am too lazy to update the status of each of them in the table. Table should be avoided as much as possible in a wiki, it's hard to maintain/modify without having a headache :)

Well dont worry about the status I'll surely update it as soon as I reach home. ;) till then I feel let us have the table for the review part and other such stuff , which is generally maintined by the regular wiki maintainers.As it easily readable what's exactly been done. :) .

...

Regards, R.

Best, Shayon Sent from my iPhone -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+help@opensuse.org

Rajko M.

16 Nov 16 Nov

06:39

On Friday 13 November 2009 07:19:24 Rupert Horstkötter wrote:

...

1. agree on the QA process - Rajko is currently reviewing FlaggedRevs and approx. ETA is end of this week (this is important for the creation of the new instance)

I created wiki page about FlaggedRevs, that is just illustration of few functions. As I use the latest of both Mediawiki and FlaggedRevs, there seems to be a bug that under circumstances doesn't show any mark, for any user, but that part I didn't investigate further. The issue appear when page is edited, not changed. but saved. The history of the article will show information about stable revision correctly, just public mark in a top right corner is not present. http://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Extension_FlaggedRevs I'm definitely for this extension, as it solves few problems at once: - marking quality of the article public so that every viewer can see it - everybody can see any revision, as stable is just presented by default, but users can look at draft using top line of links or link within mark - preventing inexperienced users to mess the article without anyone noticing, because users with editor and reviewer status are notified when they log in that there are pending reviews. The extension is very configurable, so above is just few words about default configuration that seems to fit very well our needs. For real wiki with applied extension that may have different configuration ( I didn't check that one) you can see: http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Main_Page -- Regards, Rajko openSUSE Wiki Team: http://en.opensuse.org/Wiki_Team People of openSUSE: http://en.opensuse.org/People_of_openSUSE/About -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+help@opensuse.org

Rupert Horstkötter

17 Nov 17 Nov

11:22

Rajko, first of all, thanks a lot for all your efforts in reviewing FlaggedRevs and providing the showcase page at http://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Extension_FlaggedRevs In the meantime I'm all for it (the extension) and think we should go forward with this when implementing the new instance. While the functionality of the extension is clear to me in general I have a question (just to be 100% sure - this is important for the Wiki Forum I currently take care of by discussing it with the forums team): Let's assume we have a "Quality page" in place. Is it right that an edit to that page will automatically result in a new "Draft page" that exists side-by-side with the "Quality page" while the "Quality Page" is still shown to the user and the new "Draft page" is accessible via link? I mean that way the author of the new "Draft page" that got automatically created by doing an edit to the "Quality page" may link his draft at forums.o.o to get feedback once he thinks that his draft is ready for the reviewing/approving process (candidate to replace the sighted version, i.e. the "Quality page") Thanks, R 2009/11/16 Rajko M. :

...

On Friday 13 November 2009 07:19:24 Rupert Horstkötter wrote:

...
1. agree on the QA process - Rajko is currently reviewing FlaggedRevs and approx. ETA is end of this week (this is important for the creation of the new instance)

I created wiki page about FlaggedRevs, that is just illustration of few functions. As I use the latest of both Mediawiki and FlaggedRevs, there seems to be a bug that under circumstances doesn't show any mark, for any user, but that part I didn't investigate further. The issue appear when page is edited, not changed. but saved. The history of the article will show information about stable revision correctly, just public mark in a top right corner is not present.

http://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Extension_FlaggedRevs

I'm definitely for this extension, as it solves few problems at once: - marking quality of the article public so that every viewer can see it - everybody can see any revision, as stable is just presented by default, but users can look at draft using top line of links or link within mark - preventing inexperienced users to mess the article without anyone noticing, because users with editor and reviewer status are notified when they log in that there are pending reviews.

The extension is very configurable, so above is just few words about default configuration that seems to fit very well our needs.

For real wiki with applied extension that may have different configuration ( I didn't check that one) you can see: http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Main_Page

-- Regards, Rajko

openSUSE Wiki Team: http://en.opensuse.org/Wiki_Team People of openSUSE: http://en.opensuse.org/People_of_openSUSE/About -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+help@opensuse.org

-- Rupert Horstkötter openSUSE Community Assistant http://en.opensuse.org/User:Rhorstkoetter Email: rhorstkoetter@opensuse.org Jabber: ruperthorstkoetter@googlemail.com -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+help@opensuse.org

Rajko M.

18 Nov 18 Nov

00:48

On Tuesday 17 November 2009 05:22:49 Rupert Horstkötter wrote:

...

Let's assume we have a "Quality page" in place. Is it right that an edit to that page will automatically result in a new "Draft page" that exists side-by-side with the "Quality page" while the "Quality Page" is still shown to the user and the new "Draft page" is accessible via link? I mean that way the author of the new "Draft page" that got automatically created by doing an edit to the "Quality page" may link his draft at forums.o.o to get feedback once he thinks that his draft is ready for the reviewing/approving process (candidate to replace the sighted version, i.e. the "Quality page")

It is exactly how it works with default settings. Page that is marked as sighted or quality will be shown to visitors as default page, but anyone can see the draft version, using one of 2 links, one is in top line with other links to see article, history, edit, and the other is on mark in top right corner of the article grouped with Sighted/Quality. -- Regards, Rajko openSUSE Wiki Team: http://en.opensuse.org/Wiki_Team People of openSUSE: http://en.opensuse.org/People_of_openSUSE/About -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+help@opensuse.org

Rupert Horstkötter

09:54

Rajko, 2009/11/18 Rajko M. :

...

On Tuesday 17 November 2009 05:22:49 Rupert Horstkötter wrote:

...
Let's assume we have a "Quality page" in place. Is it right that an edit to that page will automatically result in a new "Draft page" that exists side-by-side with the "Quality page" while the "Quality Page" is still shown to the user and the new "Draft page" is accessible via link? I mean that way the author of the new "Draft page" that got automatically created by doing an edit to the "Quality page" may link his draft at forums.o.o to get feedback once he thinks that his draft is ready for the reviewing/approving process (candidate to replace the sighted version, i.e. the "Quality page")

It is exactly how it works with default settings. Page that is marked as sighted or quality will be shown to visitors as default page, but anyone can see the draft version, using one of 2 links, one is in top line with other links to see article, history, edit, and the other is on mark in top right corner of the article grouped with Sighted/Quality.

Great! So, is there actually any remaining issue with FlaggedRevs then or can we finally decide to use it? Did you get help with the CSS for the openSUSE skin? Best, R

...

-- Regards, Rajko

openSUSE Wiki Team: http://en.opensuse.org/Wiki_Team People of openSUSE: http://en.opensuse.org/People_of_openSUSE/About -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+help@opensuse.org

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Rajko M.
Remy Marquis
Rupert Horstkötter
Shayon
Shayon Mukherjee