On Wed, 2007-03-28 at 12:16 +0200, Verner Kjærsgaard wrote:

I've good experience with IBM ThinkPads, in particular the R50 line. I've got one with 1G RAM and a 1400x1050 screen. Works really fine with SuSE10.2.

I have a similar experience with TP X-40 works great I was running 10 10.1 and 10.2. All the buttons work. Wireless works in wpa. I removed windows and the windows recovery partition so all is suse. If I have to get a new one I would go for the x-60 now. -=terry(Denver)=- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

We, at the BLU, run Linux installfests every quarter, and the one brand of laptop that tends to be the easiest to install is the Lenovo Thinkpad. While I've had very good luck with HP laptops, I know that many people have had trouble. In contrast, just about every Dell we've encountered has had some difficulty. -- Jerry Feldman Boston Linux and Unix user group http://www.blu.org PGP key id:C5061EA9 PGP Key fingerprint:053C 73EC 3AC1 5C44 3E14 9245 FB00 3ED5 C506 1EA9

On Thursday 29 March 2007 19:08, David Brodbeck wrote:

Jerry Feldman wrote:

...

We, at the BLU, run Linux installfests every quarter, and the one brand of laptop that tends to be the easiest to install is the Lenovo Thinkpad.

I love Thinkpads. They're all I'll buy anymore. I do have occasional hardware issues with them (I have yet to get suspend/resume, or even automated shutdown, to work on my T22 since I installed SuSE 10.2) but they're the most durable and reliable laptops I've used. The build quality just seems to be a cut above. They're not cheap, though.

Personally I think they are the best on the market but as IBM found out they are not Linux compatible because it cost to much to make them Linux hardware compatible for the volume of boxes they will initially sell. So what happens is that they are designed for things like Winmodems which makes them more competitive in the MS world. If a manufacture could reasonable expect to get the same chip set in the Winmodems all the time then a manufacture could reasonable create a winmodem for that laptop but modem manufactures\s do not ship the same chipset in every modem. One could of course replace a winmodem with a real modem if it would physically fit in the box which it will not. That becomes a issue then of what does a hardware do. Redesign the physical internal layout of the laptop or write a software modem that will only be used in a very small number of boxes before it has to be changed? All of this bull as you would call it plus the $1800 US is why I have not bought a new laptop to replace the one I dropped. I just do not care about fighting about why Linux is not compatible, or about working 2 to 3 months to make it compatible if the new laptop's modem is not compatible with Linux and you can bet that the newest of the new will be incompatible. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Thursday 29 March 2007 14:42, SOTL wrote:

Personally I think they are the best on the market but as IBM found out they are not Linux compatible because it cost to much to make them Linux hardware compatible for the volume of boxes they will initially sell. So what happens is that they are designed for things like Winmodems which makes them more competitive in the MS world. If a manufacture could reasonable expect to get the same chip set in the Winmodems all the time then a manufacture could reasonable create a winmodem for that laptop but modem manufactures\s do not ship the same chipset in every modem. One could of course replace a winmodem with a real modem if it would physically fit in the box which it will not. That becomes a issue then of what does a hardware do. Redesign the physical internal layout of the laptop or write a software modem that will only be used in a very small number of boxes before it has to be changed?

All of this bull as you would call it plus the $1800 US is why I have not bought a new laptop to replace the one I dropped. I just do not care about fighting about why Linux is not compatible, or about working 2 to 3 months to make it compatible if the new laptop's modem is not compatible with Linux and you can  bet that the newest of the new will be incompatible.

I guess you have it all covered and that the end of the discussion.... <NOT> I just brought up my TP X30 modem under 10.2 for the first time. It took me all of 10 minutes to load the pieces. I needed the smartlink-softmodem-2.x.x.x. stuff and I also loaded minicom. That was it. The commands to start the modem are: modprobe snd-intel8x0m /usr/sbin/slmodemd  -alsa -c USA hw:1  & Granted, this is for my laptop but there are a lot of similar winmodems using an AC97 chip and there are also OTHER ALSA modem drivers. I think you are painting with a very broad brush without really checking your facts. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

...

I've good experience with IBM ThinkPads, in particular the R50 line. I've got one with 1G RAM and a 1400x1050 screen. Works really fine with SuSE10.2. I have a similar experience with TP X-40 works great I was running 10 10.1 and 10.2. All the buttons work. Wireless works in wpa. I removed windows and the windows recovery partition so all is suse. If I have to get a new one I would go for the x-60 now.

Agree, very good luck with the Thinkpad laptops in the past. I've set several up for other people and gotten no complaints about things not working. -- -- Adam Tauno Williams Network & Systems Administrator Consultant - http://www.whitemiceconsulting.com Developer - http://www.opengroupware.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

I am using a ThinkPad R60 at work and it was a real pain with 10.1 despite the fact it is certified for the enterprise desktop it was just a huge pain, until I switched distributions. As far as recommendations here is my .2 cents take everything you hear here into account and go and buy what you want/like. If you talk to enough people you will find that every single laptop/company out there has had some problem of sorts and will continue to do. For example I have a Toshiba at home and have been running linux on it for the last 4 years and do not have major complaints. A friend of mine works for a company a Toshiba shop at the time, all the mother boards burned out at the same time, pretty much, for many employees. So he things it is a bad machine. He is using Dell now with Windows. I remember when I was using Winblows on a Dell P IV workstation the fan would run almost all the time 'cause the blody OS seemed to run explorer.exe at 87-98% full time for no reason. No wonder a mother board would burn especially if cooling is not adequate for such demands. What I am trying to say is you got try the thing with what you use the way you use it and still your millage will vary from the next guy using seemingly the absolute same machine. Good luck and let us know how you made out. George -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Wednesday 28 March 2007 08:06, BRUCE STANLEY wrote:

--- Adam Tauno Williams wrote:

...

...

...

I've good experience with IBM ThinkPads, in particular the R50 line. I've got one with 1G RAM and a 1400x1050 screen. Works really fine with SuSE10.2.

I have a similar experience with TP X-40 works great I was running 10 10.1 and 10.2. All the buttons work. Wireless works in wpa. I removed windows and the windows recovery partition so all is suse. If I have to get a new one I would go for the x-60 now.

Agree, very good luck with the Thinkpad laptops in the past. I've set several up for other people and gotten no complaints about things not working.

--

Including the modem?

Yea right. The modem works in my Thinkpad when I place the HD with Mandrake 10.1 on it in the computer but when I place a different HD with a different OS such as OpenSuSE 10,2 on it in the same Thinkpad the modem does not work. This issue has been discussed here very dramatically several times here in the past. Personally I have given up on every getting to get another laptop to run linux with out either the manufacture installing linux in the laptop or spending weeks correcting all the problems with making all the functions work myself. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

If you really need a laptop with everything ready to go in linux another approach is to get it from http://www.emperorlinux.com/ Those guys do a great job. They have a very well written manual that if you are new to linux will save hours of work. They have a good support. So if you get a Lenovo X-60 with suse install you know it will work. The first I got from them I was new to linux, I need it for business, I had to give a lecture and 2 days before traveling came with all installed. I just loaded the presentation and I went. All went perfect. So getting a laptop with linux is not a problem. -=terry(Denver)=- On Wed, 2007-03-28 at 14:21 -0500, SOTL wrote:

On Wednesday 28 March 2007 06:43, Teruel de Campo MD wrote:

...

On Wed, 2007-03-28 at 12:16 +0200, Verner Kjærsgaard wrote:

...

I've good experience with IBM ThinkPads, in particular the R50 line. I've got one with 1G RAM and a 1400x1050 screen. Works really fine with SuSE10.2.

I have a similar experience with TP X-40 works great I was running 10 10.1 and 10.2. All the buttons work. Wireless works in wpa. I removed windows and the windows recovery partition so all is suse. If I have to get a new one I would go for the x-60 now.

-=terry(Denver)=-

And you would be very lucky pf it worked at all even if you bought the exact same manufacture with the same model number and the same features. Why? Bord manufactures have a bad habit of putting one set of chips on one board and another set on another and calling them the same thing and that applies to mother boards, video boards, sound boards, modems et.

-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

BRUCE STANLEY wrote:

--- Teruel de Campo MD wrote:

...

If you really need a laptop with everything ready to go in linux another approach is to get it from http://www.emperorlinux.com/ Those guys do a great job. They have a very well written manual that if you are new to linux will save hours of work. They have a good support. So if you get a Lenovo X-60 with suse install you know it will work. The first I got from them I was new to linux, I need it for business, I had to give a lecture and 2 days before traveling came with all installed. I just loaded the presentation and I went. All went perfect. So getting a laptop with linux is not a problem.

-=terry(Denver)=-

Do they have their people who can write device drivers? That is what would be needed to get a 56k modem to work.

I was under the impression that Emperor Linux was just an OEM type integrator.

People seed to forget that laptops are used on the road and sometimes you only have access to the Internet via dial-up.

Thus, a laptop without a modem is somewhat useless on the road.

I have even triead a fully hardware Zonet PCMCIA modem with various distros on my Thinkpad T-41 and can not get it to work.

Here's a bit of recent news. http://www.desktoplinux.com/news/NS8436091466.html -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Thu, March 29, 2007 15:43, BRUCE STANLEY wrote:

From the 'Dell' article:

For cases such as WinModems, for which there are neither open source nor proprietary drivers available, Dell will be encouraging users to substitute a hardware-based modem. "However, we can't substitute hardware-based modems in our notebooks without redesigning and significantly increasing the price of the system.

What nonsense. Exactly how much does it cost to manufacture a hardware modem these days? And why can the hardware bits not be on a daughterboard, like the wireless, bluetooth and other bits are? Hans -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Thu, March 29, 2007 16:48, James Knott wrote:

My ThinkPad R31 had a modem on a daughter board, shared with WiFi. It was a software modem that was supported in later versions of SUSE and worked well. Unfortunately, I lost that modem, when I upgraded the WiFi. However, there are single chip hardware modems available, but I don't know how the cost compares.

I have bought external (serial) hardware modems for as little as (the equivalent of) $25 USD. This was 6 years ago. Surely the manufacturing cost have come down by now? Agreed, still nowhere near as cheap as a winmodem, but would you be willing to pay $15 more for a notebook if it happens to have a hardware modem in? I've only had to use my modem once in the last year and a half, but it would have been worth the money for that one time. Hans -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Thursday 29 March 2007 10:48, James Knott wrote:

Hans du Plooy wrote:

...

On Thu, March 29, 2007 15:43, BRUCE STANLEY wrote:

...

From the 'Dell' article:

For cases such as WinModems, for which there are neither open source nor proprietary drivers available, Dell will be encouraging users to substitute a hardware-based modem. "However, we can't substitute hardware-based modems in our notebooks without redesigning and significantly increasing the price of the system.

What nonsense. Exactly how much does it cost to manufacture a hardware modem these days? And why can the hardware bits not be on a daughterboard, like the wireless, bluetooth and other bits are?

Hans

My ThinkPad R31 had a modem on a daughter board, shared with WiFi. It was a software modem that was supported in later versions of SUSE and worked well. Unfortunately, I lost that modem, when I upgraded the WiFi. However, there are single chip hardware modems available, but I don't know how the cost compares.

About $80 US at CompUSA. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Thursday 29 March 2007 10:43, BRUCE STANLEY wrote:

For cases such as WinModems, for which there are neither open source nor proprietary drivers available, Dell will be encouraging users to substitute a hardware-based modem. "However, we can't substitute hardware-based modems in our notebooks without redesigning and significantly increasing the price of the system. If it's important to you to have a hardware-based modem, you would add one into your PC Card or ExpressCard slot."

Huh??? *Many* winmodems are supported in the Linux world. http://www.linmodems.org/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Thursday 29 March 2007 10:24, Bruce Marshall wrote:

On Thursday 29 March 2007 10:43, BRUCE STANLEY wrote:

...

For cases such as WinModems, for which there are neither open source nor proprietary drivers available, Dell will be encouraging users to substitute a hardware-based modem. "However, we can't substitute hardware-based modems in our notebooks without redesigning and significantly increasing the price of the system. If it's important to you to have a hardware-based modem, you would add one into your PC Card or ExpressCard slot."

Huh??? *Many* winmodems are supported in the Linux world.

http://www.linmodems.org/

If you want to have a modem in a Think[ad work with OpenSuSE you will have to buy a real modem and plug it into one of the slots. Or You could buy Mandrive and have it work out of box. The issue is there is no open source driver for Thinkpads that works. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

BRUCE STANLEY wrote:

What PC Card modems are they talking about?

AS I posted last time, I have tried the 'True Hardware' Zonet PC Card modem and can't get it to work. On the box it came in, it even says that it is compatible with Linux that have later kernals, but does not specify which kernal(s) it is talking about.

I have a US Robotics Megahertz 28.8 kbps XJACK PC Card modem that I upgraded (via a firmware update) to 33.6 kbps. Linux sees it as a serial port. It's worked fine in every machine I've used it in. These can be picked up very cheaply on eBay, and computer surplus stores often have buckets full of them they're dying to unload. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

...

What PC Card modems are they talking about? AS I posted last time, I have tried the 'True Hardware' Zonet PC Card modem and can't get it to work. On the box it came in, it even says that it is compatible with Linux that have later kernals, but does not specify which kernal(s) it is talking about. I have a US Robotics Megahertz 28.8 kbps XJACK PC Card modem that I upgraded (via a firmware update) to 33.6 kbps. Linux sees it as a serial port. It's worked fine in every machine I've used it in. These can be picked up very cheaply on eBay, and computer surplus stores often have buckets full of them they're dying to unload.

Yep, I got a Dell PCMCIA modem at a junk sale for $12. Has worked perfectly for years whenever I have [rarely] actually needed to use an analog line. Don't forget the most often overlooked solution - your cell phone. Most cell pones can attach via a USB port, emulate a serial port, and support the Hayes command set. Every cell phone I've had I've been able to make a terminal call with (using nothing but the USB cable and minicom). -- -- Adam Tauno Williams Network & Systems Administrator Consultant - http://www.whitemiceconsulting.com Developer - http://www.opengroupware.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

--- James Knott wrote:

Adam Tauno Williams wrote:

...

...

...

What PC Card modems are they talking about? AS I posted last time, I have tried the 'True Hardware' Zonet PC Card modem and can't get it to work. On the box it came in, it even says that it is compatible with Linux that have later kernals, but does not specify which kernal(s) it is talking about.

I have a US Robotics Megahertz 28.8 kbps XJACK PC Card modem that I upgraded (via a firmware update) to 33.6 kbps. Linux sees it as a serial port. It's worked fine in every machine I've used it in. These can be picked up very cheaply on eBay, and computer surplus stores often have buckets full of them they're dying to unload.

Yep, I got a Dell PCMCIA modem at a junk sale for $12. Has worked perfectly for years whenever I have [rarely] actually needed to use an analog line.

Don't forget the most often overlooked solution - your cell phone. Most cell pones can attach via a USB port, emulate a serial port, and support the Hayes command set. Every cell phone I've had I've been able to make a terminal call with (using nothing but the USB cable and minicom).

While my cell phone includes such a "modem", it uses GPRS, which is an extra cost service. --

Follou up: I found a version of Linux that will work with my Thinkpad T41 and my ZONET PCMCIA 56k modem. It is the Live CD version of Simply MEPIS 3.4.3. I uses a version of the smartlinke modem software. Now I must decide if I want to install it on the hard drive as a permintate multi-boot opition. It is an older version of Mepis and I would like to use a more current version of Linux. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Friday 30 March 2007 11:24, BRUCE STANLEY wrote:

--- James Knott wrote:

...

Adam Tauno Williams wrote:

...

...

...

What PC Card modems are they talking about? AS I posted last time, I have tried the 'True Hardware' Zonet PC Card modem and can't get it to work. On the box it came in, it even says that it is compatible with Linux that have later kernals, but does not specify which kernal(s) it is talking about.

I have a US Robotics Megahertz 28.8 kbps XJACK PC Card modem that I upgraded (via a firmware update) to 33.6 kbps. Linux sees it as a serial port. It's worked fine in every machine I've used it in. These can be picked up very cheaply on eBay, and computer surplus stores often have buckets full of them they're dying to unload.

Yep, I got a Dell PCMCIA modem at a junk sale for $12. Has worked perfectly for years whenever I have [rarely] actually needed to use an analog line.

Don't forget the most often overlooked solution - your cell phone. Most cell pones can attach via a USB port, emulate a serial port, and support the Hayes command set. Every cell phone I've had I've been able to make a terminal call with (using nothing but the USB cable and minicom).

While my cell phone includes such a "modem", it uses GPRS, which is an extra cost service. --

Follou up:

I found a version of Linux that will work with my Thinkpad T41 and my ZONET PCMCIA 56k modem. It is the Live CD version of Simply MEPIS 3.4.3.

Get on the Thinkpad list and check out your hardware with the IBM experts. They can advise you best on which distribution works best with which hardware.

I uses a version of the smartlinke modem software.

Now I must decide if I want to install it on the hard drive as a permintate multi-boot opition. It is an older version of Mepis and I would like to use a more current version of Linux.

-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

David Brodbeck wrote:

James Knott wrote:

...

While my cell phone includes such a "modem", it uses GPRS, which is an extra cost service.

That's definitely a concern. Although the way hotels keep jacking up their phone charges it might be cheaper to pay for GPRS. ;)

It always amazes me that the more you pay for a hotel room, the more little charges they tack on. If you stay in a $40/night hotel you get local calls for free. If you stay in a $100/night hotel they charge you a buck fifty just to connect you.

I know exactly what you mean. Last fall, I stayed at a motel in the middle of nowhere (Wawa Ontario), which included free WiFi. But in February I was at a very nice hotel in a Quebec ski resort town, where the rooms were over $200/night and WiFi was another $14/day. However, I found that I could bypass their paid access, by using OpenVPN to connect to my home network and reach the internet from there! They apparently didn't block UDP port 1194. Yesterday, my manager said he was being charged $16/day for access at the Marriott Hotel in Toronto. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Friday 30 March 2007 18:02, John Andersen wrote:

We recently took a driving trip thru the south western US with nothing but google maps on a couple cell phones. No reservations, No fixed Destinations, no maps.

Note this is not a pda I'm talking about, just a cell phone.

So what was your phone bill that month?? (me, thinking there are nice GPS pda's out there but I use a full laptop with GPS and DeLorme) -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Thursday 29 March 2007 10:04, BRUCE STANLEY wrote:

I have even triead a fully hardware Zonet PCMCIA modem with various distros on my Thinkpad T-41 and can not get it to work.

What is the chipset in the T41? I have always been able to get the modem in my TP X30 to work. It's probably the same modem chipset. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Thursday 29 March 2007 09:04, BRUCE STANLEY wrote:

--- Teruel de Campo MD wrote:

...

If you really need a laptop with everything ready to go in linux another approach is to get it from http://www.emperorlinux.com/ Those guys do a great job. They have a very well written manual that if you are new to linux will save hours of work. They have a good support. So if you get a Lenovo X-60 with suse install you know it will work. The first I got from them I was new to linux, I need it for business, I had to give a lecture and 2 days before traveling came with all installed. I just loaded the presentation and I went. All went perfect. So getting a laptop with linux is not a problem.

-=terry(Denver)=-

Do they have their people who can write device drivers? That is what would be needed to get a 56k modem to work.That is not the issue.

Notebooks now because of cost are using WinModems. Unfortunately they seem to redesign WinModems with the wind each one using a different chip set. Developers who are capable of writing WinModems which of course are software all have T1 of T2 lines and are not interested in antiquated ISP connection systems like 56k modem connections. This leaves a void in WindModems with some working and some not. Here is were it really gets screwey as you can take two different laptops each with the same features manufactured by the same manufacture under the same part number and get two different Winmodems one of which will work and one which will not since of course they have different chipsets in them requiring different Winmodems. The only safe course is to replace thew Winmodem with a real modem which means of course that you will have to plug it into a expansion slot. Best thing is get on the BB for the particular laptop and ascertain there what hardware will and will not work. The one for Thinkpads was posted in a previous posting today in this thread and since it is difficult to find I would suggest you look there to subscribe.

I was under the impression that Emperor Linux was just an OEM type integrator.

People seed to forget that laptops are used on the road and sometimes you only have access to the Internet via dial-up.

Thus, a laptop without a modem is somewhat useless on the road.

I have even triead a fully hardware Zonet PCMCIA modem with various distros on my Thinkpad T-41 and can not get it to work.

-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Friday 30 March 2007 08:49, Aschwin Marsman wrote:

On Thu, 29 Mar 2007, SOTL wrote:

Thanks for all your replies, this helps a lot.

...

Best thing is get on the BB for the particular laptop and ascertain there what hardware will and will not work. The one for Thinkpads was posted in a previous posting today in this thread and since it is difficult to find I would suggest you look there to subscribe.

I will look into the archives first before I will post my question ;-)

Problem with e.g. Emperor Linux is that I don't get the next day service that I need here in the Netherlands. That's why I choose TransTec: SUSE certified hardware, excellent technical support (they know what they are talking about) and for a reasonable price next day service for three years. I earn my money using the laptop and I need it to work. I would prefer to spent some extra cash to get that kind of support. Buying two laptops in case one breaks is a little bit two expensive. I hope the TransTec engineers are getting the laptop working soon, that would be my first choice.

Q: How good is the service with the different manufacturers? I want everything working again within 24 hours. If HP or Lenovo can give the same service level as TransTec that would be fine too.

Greeting from the Netherlands,

Aschwin Marsman

p.s.: Anyone going to the Accu Conference in Oxford after easter?

-- aYniK Software Solutions all You need is Knowledge P.O. box 134 NL-7600 AC Almelo - the Netherlands a.marsman@aYniK.com http://www.aYniK.com

I am clueless as to what you are babling about here which I guess is because of my age, an old fart. Each major manafactor of equipment has what we usta call a builtine board BB like this one we are now on which I guess you new wipper snappers call a list or some new damn fangled name which I don't know. Anyway the one for Thinkpads is sponsered by IBM and is at http://mailman.linux-thinkpad.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-thinkpad which is opensuse@opensuse.org for posting messages. As far as cost the only cost is the same as the cost for this BB. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Adam Tauno Williams wrote:

Personally, I'd never by a Dell to use with Linux. I've seen components change even within the same model#, you never really know what you are ordering.

I would not recommend Dell's laptops in general. My experience with them is that the construction is shoddy and they're unreliable if you actually use them as laptops. The flexing seems to work internal connections loose. If you just let them sit on a desk and use them as miniature desktop systems they're OK. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Wednesday 28 March 2007 20:33, David Brodbeck wrote:

Adam Tauno Williams wrote:

...

Personally, I'd never by a Dell to use with Linux. I've seen components change even within the same model#, you never really know what you are ordering.

I would not recommend Dell's laptops in general. My experience with them is that the construction is shoddy and they're unreliable if you actually use them as laptops. The flexing seems to work internal connections loose. If you just let them sit on a desk and use them as miniature desktop systems they're OK.

If you want quality and rugged get a Thinkpad. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Am Mittwoch, den 28.03.2007, 12:00 +0200 schrieb Gaël Lams:

Hi

...

I'm currently thinking about buying a HP, e.g. NC6320 with intel processor, NC6325 with AMD processor. Both are SuSE Linux Enterprise Desktop 10 certified, according to HP.

Anybody experience with one of those laptops?

have you checked http://en.opensuse.org/HCL/Laptops/HP ? -- einen schönen Tag noch, & bitte kein TOFU (http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/TOFU) DI Rainer Klier Abteilung IT - Entwicklung ECOLOG Logistiksysteme GmbH Bauernstraße 11, A-4600 Wels Tel. ++43/7242/66200 Fax ++43/7242/66200-200 mailto:kra@ecolog.at http://www.ecolog.at -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Onsdag 28 marts 2007 12:32 skrev Hans du Plooy:

On Wed, March 28, 2007 10:46, Aschwin Marsman wrote:

...

I'm currently thinking about buying a HP, e.g. NC6320 with intel processor, NC6325 with AMD processor.

The 6325 has the buggiest ACPI you're likely to encounter - it has exactly the same bugs as the 6125. There are several ACPI bugs that don't yet have kernel workarounds.

Don't buy this! My experience with HP notebooks over the last three years (even in Windows) with clients has been consistently bad enough that I feel I need to tell people to avoid it. Rather get an Acer - they cost about the same and seem to be far better quality hardware and more Linux friendly.

Hans

I know that my comment below may be considered bad netiquette..., but I couldn't have said it any better! hear, hear... -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Med venlig hilsen/Best regards Verner Kjærsgaard -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

...

Don't buy this! My experience with HP notebooks over the last three years (even in Windows) with clients has been consistently bad enough that I feel I need to tell people to avoid it. Rather get an Acer - they cost about the same and seem to be far better quality hardware and more Linux friendly. I know that my comment below may be considered bad netiquette..., but I couldn't have said it any better! hear, hear...

Here Here; have half a dozen HP laptops, various models... I'd never buy an HP. And these run XP. Toshiba or Thinkpad, the only two I can recommend. I've never met an Acer, so I can't comment on previous recommendations (I hope they are good since they are so tantelizingly inexpensive). -- -- Adam Tauno Williams Network & Systems Administrator Consultant - http://www.whitemiceconsulting.com Developer - http://www.opengroupware.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Thursday 29 March 2007 12:31, Jerry Feldman wrote:

On Wed, 28 Mar 2007 11:32:03 +0100 (BST)

"Hans du Plooy" wrote:

...

The 6325 has the buggiest ACPI you're likely to encounter - it has exactly the same bugs as the 6125. There are several ACPI bugs that don't yet have kernel workarounds.

Don't buy this! My experience with HP notebooks over the last three years (even in Windows) with clients has been consistently bad enough that I feel I need to tell people to avoid it. Rather get an Acer - they cost about the same and seem to be far better quality hardware and more Linux friendly.

On the other hand, my experience with HP and Compaq notebooks and Linux has been very good. My previous Presario has been used at work, teaching at a local university, Linux meetings and installfests, and the only thing that ever went wrong was the power connector was loose, and I needed a rubber band to make it work. The reason for this was that the notebook fell off a table a couple of times. I have an NX6125 that has also worked well. The only issue I had with it was the wireless (broadcom). 10.2 comes with bcm43xx.ko as the driver, and you need the firmware. The versions of the bcmwl5.sys that I had were incompatible with fwcutter (also part of 10.2). Solution, read the fwcutter docs, download a bcmwl5.sys, run fwcutter to extract the firmware into /lib/firmware, and bcm43xx.ko works fine. I did have some initial growing pains with ndiswrapper when I first got the laptop where I had to run ndiswrapper with the -d option, but after that the wireless was flawless. I have no complaints about Acer, but I do know that HP is a very strong supporter of Linux and has been setting up regional Linux Expertise Centers.

My thinkpad worked great until I dropped it off a table fortunately in its gadget bag at which time the Linux side screen works while the Windows side works great. It is dual boot. Mandrake 10.1 and Xp. 10.1 Because SuSE has consistently refused to support the modem. The issue of the screen surprised me and everybody on the Thinkpad list and comes about because the Linus GUI produces a better quality picture than the MS one does but this of course has a cost of being slightly unusable once the computer was dropped. Worked great before that. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Thursday 29 March 2007 18:59, Bruce Marshall wrote:

On Thursday 29 March 2007 13:15, SOTL wrote:

...

Because SuSE has consistently refused to support the modem.

It's not SUSE's job to support the modem.... Search the archives for my post of about a year ago in how I solved the Thinkpad modem problem. You have to use one of the ALSA modem drivers. Works just fine.

Some do some don't it all depends on the modem. We went through all this on the Thinkpad list. It all depends on the chip set. Some sets are supported some not. You got lucky. Lots don't.

Please stop throwing all this crap around!

I am going to be polite. Reference this same issue back about 2 years, OpenSuSE 10.0 and 10.1 era. Same equipment same issue. This is 4 years of the same issue same response. Very bluntly the people at SuSE do not understand how people use laptops or that modems are required. They are not going to understand the issues until they have real pissed off customers because and real law suits because equipment will not work. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org