[SLE] Apt permanently broken? Inferior packages from now on?
To summarize the previous discussion about apt and suse's package management: 1. The rpm packages for KDE updates have been removed from the apt repository at ftp.gwdg.de, with more packages to be removed in the near future. 2. Apt will not work with the opensuse build service. 3. The opensuse build service is *ALPHA* software. 4. An as-yet-unreleased future version of apt4suse might work with the opensuse build service. 5. Using packages from the opensuse build service will will tie you to the bugs and features of the version of KDE initially released with the version of suse (i.e. 10.1 users will be stuck with KDE 3.5.1, even though three additional bugfix, translation and new feature releases will have been released by this August--3.5.4 gets tagged at the end of July). 6. There is no equal or superior package-management program available for SuSE that could replace apt. Yast most certainly isn't, and from my research, neither smart nor yum are as capable as apt (though they might become so if missing features are added in future releases). So not only has the best package management system been effectively killed without a suitable replacement, but future (and current SuSE KDE packages) SuSE packages will be a far lower quality (missing recent bugfixes, translations, etc). These are two core defects that are the core of what a distribution is supposed to do: provide software. Note that I'm not placing blame for this situation on anybody; I'm just laying out the current situation. Please do correct any errors I made above. Meanwhile, I'm going to take Kubuntu for a spin around the block as a potential replacement. Regards, Mark -- Check the headers for your unsubscription address For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the archives at http://lists.suse.com Please read the FAQs: suse-linux-e-faq@suse.com
On Friday 02 June 2006 01:59, Mark A. Taff wrote:
To summarize the previous discussion about apt and suse's package management:
1. The rpm packages for KDE updates have been removed from the apt repository at ftp.gwdg.de, with more packages to be removed in the near future.
No. The packages were never in the apt repository. Other people made an apt repository that *pointed* to those packages. They can do it again. They don't need a new release of apt for that, all that's needed is to set their mirrors to point somewhere else. They used to download the packages from ftp.suse.com, now they're at opensuse.org
2. Apt will not work with the opensuse build service.
huh? bash will not work with MS Office makes just as much sense. One is a build service, the other is a package management tool. If you mean apt will not work with the repositories on opensuse where packages built in the build service end up, then you are wrong. All someone has to do is create an apt repository that mirrors, indexes and references them - just like they did before
3. The opensuse build service is *ALPHA* software. 4. An as-yet-unreleased future version of apt4suse might work with the opensuse build service.
see above
5. Using packages from the opensuse build service will will tie you to the bugs and features of the version of KDE initially released with the version of suse (i.e. 10.1 users will be stuck with KDE 3.5.1, even though three additional bugfix, translation and new feature releases will have been released by this August--3.5.4 gets tagged at the end of July).
huh? 3.5.3 is already there. -- Check the headers for your unsubscription address For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the archives at http://lists.suse.com Please read the FAQs: suse-linux-e-faq@suse.com
On Thursday 01 June 2006 17:13, Anders Johansson wrote:
No. The packages were never in the apt repository. Other people made an apt repository that *pointed* to those packages. They can do it again. They don't need a new release of apt for that, all that's needed is to set their mirrors to point somewhere else. They used to download the packages from ftp.suse.com, now they're at opensuse.org
The packages for KDE prior the the deployment of the *ALPHA* opensuse build service and repository were indeed in the apt repository. It makes no difference to my point #1 whether the package was initially hosted at ftp.suse.com before it was copied into the apt repository. The fact is that packages used to be there, and they either aren't now or they won't be in the future. Makes no difference to point #1 *why* the packages aren't there; the fact is that the *aren't there*. Note I'm not saying this is your fault Anders, or even SuSE's fault. I'm merely stating that it is a *fact* that the packages aren't there anymore.
huh?
bash will not work with MS Office
makes just as much sense. One is a build service, the other is a package management tool.
If you mean apt will not work with the repositories on opensuse where packages built in the build service end up, then you are wrong. All someone has to do is create an apt repository that mirrors, indexes and references them - just like they did before
I should have been more specific. Forgive me. I meant that apt will not work with the repositories on opensuse where packages built in the build service end up. That fact that someone *may* create an apt repository based on those packages at some unknown time and place in the universe is immaterial. The fact is as of right now, *apt will not work with the repositories on opensuse where packages built in the build service end up* (which is what I meant originally, even if I said it poorly)!
4. An as-yet-unreleased future version of apt4suse might work with the opensuse build service.
see above
Indeed, see above.
5. Using packages from the opensuse build service will will tie you to the bugs and features of the version of KDE initially released with the version of suse (i.e. 10.1 users will be stuck with KDE 3.5.1, even though three additional bugfix, translation and new feature releases will have been released by this August--3.5.4 gets tagged at the end of July).
huh? 3.5.3 is already there.
The opensuse build service doesn't build packages against 3.5.3. It builds them against 3.5.1 (for suse 10.1). So all the packages it makes are subject to all the bugs in kdelibs 3.5.1, even though those bugs may be fixed in kdelibs from 3.5[.2|.3|.4|.n]. So you might upgrade KDE to 3.5.3, but your non-kde-core applications will be compiled for kdelibs 3.5.1, as that is what was released originally with 10.1. Regards, Mark -- Check the headers for your unsubscription address For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the archives at http://lists.suse.com Please read the FAQs: suse-linux-e-faq@suse.com
On Friday 02 June 2006 02:41, Mark A. Taff wrote:
The packages for KDE prior the the deployment of the *ALPHA* opensuse build service and repository were indeed in the apt repository. It makes no difference to my point #1 whether the package was initially hosted at ftp.suse.com before it was copied into the apt repository. The fact is that packages used to be there, and they either aren't now or they won't be in the future. Makes no difference to point #1 *why* the packages aren't there; the fact is that the *aren't there*. Note I'm not saying this is your fault Anders, or even SuSE's fault. I'm merely stating that it is a *fact* that the packages aren't there anymore.
That is a simple, observable fact indeed. It is not one that can't be overcome, nor does it (as you previously stated) require a new release of apt4rpm.
5. Using packages from the opensuse build service will will tie you to the bugs and features of the version of KDE initially released with the version of suse (i.e. 10.1 users will be stuck with KDE 3.5.1, even though three additional bugfix, translation and new feature releases will have been released by this August--3.5.4 gets tagged at the end of July).
huh? 3.5.3 is already there.
The opensuse build service doesn't build packages against 3.5.3. It builds them against 3.5.1 (for suse 10.1). So all the packages it makes are subject to all the bugs in kdelibs 3.5.1, even though those bugs may be fixed in kdelibs from 3.5[.2|.3|.4|.n]. So you might upgrade KDE to 3.5.3, but your non-kde-core applications will be compiled for kdelibs 3.5.1, as that is what was released originally with 10.1.
No, no, no. That's not how compiling works. If you were linking things statically then yes, packages would get the 3.5.1 libraries, but they don't. They are linked dynamically. Which means you get whatever version of the libraries you currently have installed. There is absolutely zero difference between an amarok compiled against 3.5.1 and one compiled against 3.5.3. This is called binary compatibility and is very important to the KDE project. If you install the 3.5.3 libraries you get the 3.5.3 bug fixes, totally and utterly regardless of what was used to compile the applications you have installed As a for instance, in the past when suse have released critical bug fix releases of kdebase or kdelibs through YOU, you don't see all the other 2^51 KDe packages in there as well, right? -- Check the headers for your unsubscription address For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the archives at http://lists.suse.com Please read the FAQs: suse-linux-e-faq@suse.com
On Thursday 01 June 2006 17:50, Anders Johansson wrote:
No, no, no. That's not how compiling works.
If you were linking things statically then yes, packages would get the 3.5.1 libraries, but they don't. They are linked dynamically. Which means you get whatever version of the libraries you currently have installed. There is absolutely zero difference between an amarok compiled against 3.5.1 and one compiled against 3.5.3. This is called binary compatibility and is very important to the KDE project. If you install the 3.5.3 libraries you get the 3.5.3 bug fixes, totally and utterly regardless of what was used to compile the applications you have installed
Thanks for clearing that up. That is good news.
As a for instance, in the past when suse have released critical bug fix releases of kdebase or kdelibs through YOU, you don't see all the other 2^51 KDe packages in there as well, right?
I don't use YOU or Yast for package management or patches, as they have harmed my system too many times. That, in fact, is one of the main reasons why I switched to apt in the first place. Mark -- Check the headers for your unsubscription address For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the archives at http://lists.suse.com Please read the FAQs: suse-linux-e-faq@suse.com
On Friday 02 June 2006 01:41, Mark A. Taff wrote:
The opensuse build service doesn't build packages against 3.5.3. It builds them against 3.5.1 (for suse 10.1). So all the packages it makes are subject to all the bugs in kdelibs 3.5.1, even though those bugs may be fixed in kdelibs from 3.5[.2|.3|.4|.n]. So you might upgrade KDE to 3.5.3, but your non-kde-core applications will be compiled for kdelibs 3.5.1, as that is what was released originally with 10.1.
Huh? "* KDE:Backports (contains updated KDE apps without the need to update also the complete KDE (big advantage compared to supplementarry))" There's a clue out there somewhere just waiting for you to go and find it. Graham -- Check the headers for your unsubscription address For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the archives at http://lists.suse.com Please read the FAQs: suse-linux-e-faq@suse.com
Op vrijdag 2 juni 2006 02:13, schreef Anders Johansson:
1. The rpm packages for KDE updates have been removed from the apt repository at ftp.gwdg.de, with more packages to be removed in the near future.
No. The packages were never in the apt repository. Other people made an apt repository that *pointed* to those packages. They can do it again. They don't need a new release of apt for that, all that's needed is to set their mirrors to point somewhere else. They used to download the packages from ftp.suse.com, now they're at opensuse.org
The mirroring continues, but no apt repository will be out of it. That's for 2 reasons: 1) it is too much unorganized. It's very hard to determine which directory is for suse-10.1, suse-10.0, FC4, FC5, etc. For suse-10.1 there are many different names, where some of them differ only in capital - or lower case. 2) The repository provides for each build environment repodata formatted metadata. The standard repository format that is to used by all package manager out there. This makes indexing according the apt repository redundant.
2. Apt will not work with the opensuse build service.
huh?
It could work, but it requires a lot of work and it is not needed anymore, see above. -- Richard Bos Without a home the journey is endless -- Check the headers for your unsubscription address For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the archives at http://lists.suse.com Please read the FAQs: suse-linux-e-faq@suse.com
On Friday 02 June 2006 00:59, Mark A. Taff wrote:
To summarize the previous discussion about apt and suse's package management:
1. The rpm packages for KDE updates have been removed from the apt repository at ftp.gwdg.de, with more packages to be removed in the near future. 2. Apt will not work with the opensuse build service.
This is getting tiresome. Go and pester whoever keeps the Apt repository, as has been said countless times on this list Novell/SUSE do not maintain Apt repositories.
3. The opensuse build service is *ALPHA* software. Your point being what? Unless I was somehow sleeping for a few years SUSE binaries are still compiled with gcc and packaged as RPM's.
5. Using packages from the opensuse build service will will tie you to the bugs and features of the version of KDE initially released with the version of suse (i.e. 10.1 users will be stuck with KDE 3.5.1, even though three additional bugfix, translation and new feature releases will have been released by this August--3.5.4 gets tagged at the end of July).
FUD, I just upgraded to KDE 3.5.3 this afternoon using build service repositories and rug. Please get a clue.
6. There is no equal or superior package-management program available for SuSE that could replace apt. Yast most certainly isn't, and from my research, neither smart nor yum are as capable as apt (though they might become so if missing features are added in future releases).
In your opinion. My opinion, and the opinion of many others, is that your opinion is wrong.
So not only has the best package management system been effectively killed without a suitable replacement, but future (and current SuSE KDE packages) SuSE packages will be a far lower quality (missing recent bugfixes, translations, etc). These are two core defects that are the core of what a distribution is supposed to do: provide software.
Like I said before, go pester whoever maintains the Apt repos you were using and get a clue before spreading such FUD about 'quality' of packaging. Graham -- Check the headers for your unsubscription address For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the archives at http://lists.suse.com Please read the FAQs: suse-linux-e-faq@suse.com
On 01/06/06 18:26, Graham Anderson wrote:
On Friday 02 June 2006 00:59, Mark A. Taff wrote:
To summarize the previous discussion about apt and suse's package management:
1. The rpm packages for KDE updates have been removed from the apt repository at ftp.gwdg.de, with more packages to be removed in the near future. 2. Apt will not work with the opensuse build service.
This is getting tiresome. Go and pester whoever keeps the Apt repository, as has been said countless times on this list Novell/SUSE do not maintain Apt repositories.
<snip>
translations, etc). These are two core defects that are the core of what a distribution is supposed to do: provide software.
Like I said before, go pester whoever maintains the Apt repos you were using and get a clue before spreading such FUD about 'quality' of packaging.
Guess what I just found at ftp://ftp.gwdg.de/pub/opensuse/repositories/KDE:/ Dated just today.. amazing, isn't it? ;-) -- Check the headers for your unsubscription address For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the archives at http://lists.suse.com Please read the FAQs: suse-linux-e-faq@suse.com
On Thursday 01 June 2006 17:45, Darryl Gregorash wrote:
Guess what I just found at
ftp://ftp.gwdg.de/pub/opensuse/repositories/KDE:/
Dated just today.. amazing, isn't it? ;-)
That is a mirror of the repository at opensuse, not an apt repository. Apt cannot use it. Mark -- Check the headers for your unsubscription address For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the archives at http://lists.suse.com Please read the FAQs: suse-linux-e-faq@suse.com
On Thursday 01 June 2006 17:26, Graham Anderson wrote:
This is getting tiresome. Go and pester whoever keeps the Apt repository, as has been said countless times on this list Novell/SUSE do not maintain Apt repositories.
Tiresome indeed. I never once said that SuSE or Novell maintained the apt repositories. I simply stated that the packages are not present there/put there anymore. I also never blamed SuSE or Novell for the situation with the apt repository.
3. The opensuse build service is *ALPHA* software.
Your point being what? Unless I was somehow sleeping for a few years SUSE binaries are still compiled with gcc and packaged as RPM's.
My point is that SuSE would use *ALPHA* software for a *production* build system and part of the chain of the package distro system (packages have to be built first, right?). Doesn't strike me as very prudent.
5. Using packages from the opensuse build service will will tie you to the bugs and features of the version of KDE initially released with the version of suse (i.e. 10.1 users will be stuck with KDE 3.5.1, even though three additional bugfix, translation and new feature releases will have been released by this August--3.5.4 gets tagged at the end of July).
FUD, I just upgraded to KDE 3.5.3 this afternoon using build service repositories and rug. Please get a clue.
It isn't FUD. Your non-core-KDE applications will be compiled against kdelibs 3.5.1 instead of the 3.5.3 you now have on your computer, so they will be missing all the bugfixes in kdelibs since 3.5.1.
6. There is no equal or superior package-management program available for SuSE that could replace apt. Yast most certainly isn't, and from my research, neither smart nor yum are as capable as apt (though they might become so if missing features are added in future releases).
In your opinion. My opinion, and the opinion of many others, is that your opinion is wrong.
The superior part is certainly opinion. The equal part is fact. Will smart or yum on the cli show me a list of package versions it wants to upgrade from and to? Reportedly, it won't. That demonstrates the unequal part, and is part of the basis for my opinion that apt is superior.
Like I said before, go pester whoever maintains the Apt repos you were using and get a clue before spreading such FUD about 'quality' of packaging.
Again, it isn't FUD. Regards, Mark -- Check the headers for your unsubscription address For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the archives at http://lists.suse.com Please read the FAQs: suse-linux-e-faq@suse.com
Mark A. Taff wrote:
3. The opensuse build service is *ALPHA* software. Your point being what? Unless I was somehow sleeping for a few years SUSE binaries are still compiled with gcc and packaged as RPM's.
My point is that SuSE would use *ALPHA* software for a *production* build system and part of the chain of the package distro system (packages have to be built first, right?). Doesn't strike me as very prudent.
This is a rather important point. They go out of their way to say that the build system is Alpha software, yet they're utilizing it for a production system. This is rather odd thinking. Are SuSE releases meant for production servers or has it become unstable fedora? -- Check the headers for your unsubscription address For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the archives at http://lists.suse.com Please read the FAQs: suse-linux-e-faq@suse.com
On Fri, Jun 02, 2006 at 10:37:39AM -0400, suse@rio.vg wrote:
Mark A. Taff wrote:
3. The opensuse build service is *ALPHA* software. Your point being what? Unless I was somehow sleeping for a few years SUSE binaries are still compiled with gcc and packaged as RPM's.
My point is that SuSE would use *ALPHA* software for a *production* build system and part of the chain of the package distro system (packages have to be built first, right?). Doesn't strike me as very prudent.
This is a rather important point. They go out of their way to say that the build system is Alpha software, yet they're utilizing it for a production system. This is rather odd thinking.
Are SuSE releases meant for production servers or has it become unstable fedora?
Supplementary updates were never meant for production systems, are unofficial and fully unsupported. Ciao, Marcus -- Check the headers for your unsubscription address For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the archives at http://lists.suse.com Please read the FAQs: suse-linux-e-faq@suse.com
On Fri, 2006-06-02 at 10:37 -0400, suse@rio.vg wrote:
Mark A. Taff wrote:
3. The opensuse build service is *ALPHA* software. Your point being what? Unless I was somehow sleeping for a few years SUSE binaries are still compiled with gcc and packaged as RPM's.
My point is that SuSE would use *ALPHA* software for a *production* build system and part of the chain of the package distro system (packages have to be built first, right?). Doesn't strike me as very prudent.
This is a rather important point. They go out of their way to say that the build system is Alpha software, yet they're utilizing it for a production system. This is rather odd thinking.
Are SuSE releases meant for production servers or has it become unstable fedora? SLES is meant for servers, SUSE linux (SLD) is meant for the desktop.
-- Ken Schneider UNIX since 1989, linux since 1994, SuSE since 1998 -- Check the headers for your unsubscription address For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the archives at http://lists.suse.com Please read the FAQs: suse-linux-e-faq@suse.com
On Thursday 01 June 2006 19:59, Mark A. Taff wrote:
To summarize the previous discussion about apt and suse's package management:
1. The rpm packages for KDE updates have been removed from the apt repository at ftp.gwdg.de, with more packages to be removed in the near future. 2. Apt will not work with the opensuse build service. 3. The opensuse build service is *ALPHA* software. 4. An as-yet-unreleased future version of apt4suse might work with the opensuse build service. 5. Using packages from the opensuse build service will will tie you to the bugs and features of the version of KDE initially released with the version of suse (i.e. 10.1 users will be stuck with KDE 3.5.1, even though three additional bugfix, translation and new feature releases will have been released by this August--3.5.4 gets tagged at the end of July). 6. There is no equal or superior package-management program available for SuSE that could replace apt. Yast most certainly isn't, and from my research, neither smart nor yum are as capable as apt (though they might become so if missing features are added in future releases).
So not only has the best package management system been effectively killed without a suitable replacement, but future (and current SuSE KDE packages) SuSE packages will be a far lower quality (missing recent bugfixes, translations, etc). These are two core defects that are the core of what a distribution is supposed to do: provide software.
Here here !!! Right on! Just don't know why SuSE can't take apt and adopt/adapt this superior package handler that has been proven for many years now. Bob S. -- Check the headers for your unsubscription address For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the archives at http://lists.suse.com Please read the FAQs: suse-linux-e-faq@suse.com
On Fri, 2006-06-02 at 02:20 -0400, Bob S wrote:
On Thursday 01 June 2006 19:59, Mark A. Taff wrote:
To summarize the previous discussion about apt and suse's package management:
1. The rpm packages for KDE updates have been removed from the apt repository at ftp.gwdg.de, with more packages to be removed in the near future. 2. Apt will not work with the opensuse build service. 3. The opensuse build service is *ALPHA* software. 4. An as-yet-unreleased future version of apt4suse might work with the opensuse build service. 5. Using packages from the opensuse build service will will tie you to the bugs and features of the version of KDE initially released with the version of suse (i.e. 10.1 users will be stuck with KDE 3.5.1, even though three additional bugfix, translation and new feature releases will have been released by this August--3.5.4 gets tagged at the end of July). 6. There is no equal or superior package-management program available for SuSE that could replace apt. Yast most certainly isn't, and from my research, neither smart nor yum are as capable as apt (though they might become so if missing features are added in future releases).
So not only has the best package management system been effectively killed without a suitable replacement, but future (and current SuSE KDE packages) SuSE packages will be a far lower quality (missing recent bugfixes, translations, etc). These are two core defects that are the core of what a distribution is supposed to do: provide software.
Here here !!! Right on! Just don't know why SuSE can't take apt and adopt/adapt this superior package handler that has been proven for many years now.
Am I missing something? I thought the SUSE build server was a place to build applications. Hence the rather obvious name - oddly not called the package server. You know: unpack;configure;make. Resolving whatever dependencies are needed. Eliminating duplicated effort since dependent packages built by others are available on the same server. Leaving the compiled application for others to use as they see fit. Isn't that the case? Packaging, on the other hand, is a different, later activity. Having built your favorite package on the build server, kind souls (if not the application builder) can then package them for apt, YOU, YASY, YUM, SMART, ISOTW, whatever. And, by having the same compiled package publicly available on the build server, all these different package formats can really contain the exact same binaries. And, they can even begin to have similar dependencies. It is a real PITA when an, say, an APT packaging by one person has a dependency that conflicts with some other person's package. That is where I thought the build server came in. But I do wonder why the SUSE 10.0 repositories are gone before they are completely replaced with the new ones. Unless I am blind, I do not see all the 10.0 SUSE repositories that were on ftp.suse.com on OpenSuse. At least not in a way that a new installed 10.0 recognizes. Please correct me if I am wrong. These things are changing faster than I have time to keep checking. -- Roger Oberholtzer OPQ Systems AB Ramböll Sverige AB Kapellgränd 7 P.O. Box 4205 SE-102 65 Stockholm, Sweden Tel: Int +46 8-615 60 20 Fax: Int +46 8-31 42 23 -- Check the headers for your unsubscription address For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the archives at http://lists.suse.com Please read the FAQs: suse-linux-e-faq@suse.com
Op vrijdag 2 juni 2006 08:20, schreef Bob S:
So not only has the best package management system been effectively killed without a suitable replacement, but future (and current SuSE KDE packages) SuSE packages will be a far lower quality (missing recent bugfixes, translations, etc). These are two core defects that are the core of what a distribution is supposed to do: provide software.
Here here !!! Right on! Just don't know why SuSE can't take apt and adopt/adapt this superior package handler that has been proven for many years now.
Hi Bob :) I have uploaded a new apt (client) to the apt repository (suser-rbos). It may be available in a couple of hours via the apt repository. This apt client is able to process the repodata that is provided by the buildserver. It is not the latest apt version, there is a newer one, but it is a start.... ;) Configuration example: repomd ftp://ftp4.gwdg.de/pub/linux/misc/kolab suse-10.1 For the build-service this will be (all on 1 line): repomd http://software.opensuse.org/download/repositories/Kolab SUSE_Linux_10.1 For kde it should be: repomd http://software.opensuse.org/download/repositories/KDE:/KDE3 SUSE_Linux_10.1 1 caveat the repomd lines may take some processing time, I believe that this is improved in the last version. Happy apt'ing :)) -- Richard Bos Without a home the journey is endless -- Check the headers for your unsubscription address For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the archives at http://lists.suse.com Please read the FAQs: suse-linux-e-faq@suse.com
On Friday 02 June 2006 14:26, Richard Bos wrote:
I have uploaded a new apt (client) to the apt repository (suser-rbos). It may be available in a couple of hours via the apt repository. This apt client is able to process the repodata that is provided by the buildserver. It is not the latest apt version, there is a newer one, but it is a start.... ;)
I notice you only have a repository for i386. When the rpm's appear in the repository, will the rpms themselves work on x86_64, or only on i386 (for both 10.0 & 10.1)? Thanks, Mark -- Check the headers for your unsubscription address For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the archives at http://lists.suse.com Please read the FAQs: suse-linux-e-faq@suse.com
On 6/2/06, Richard Bos wrote:
I have uploaded a new apt (client) to the apt repository (suser-rbos). It may be available in a couple of hours via the apt repository. This apt client is able to process the repodata that is provided by the buildserver. It is not the latest apt version, there is a newer one, but it is a start.... ;)
I seems that suser-rbos repo was removed from 10.0 x64 tree. So, how do I get the new apt client? And can synaptic deal with that addition? Thanks -- -- Svetoslav Milenov (Sunny) Windows is a 32-bit extension to a 16-bit graphical shell for an 8-bit operating system originally coded for a 4-bit microprocessor by a 2-bit company that can't stand 1 bit of competition. -- Check the headers for your unsubscription address For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the archives at http://lists.suse.com Please read the FAQs: suse-linux-e-faq@suse.com
Op maandag 5 juni 2006 20:54, schreef Sunny:
I have uploaded a new apt (client) to the apt repository (suser-rbos). It may be available in a couple of hours via the apt repository. This apt client is able to process the repodata that is provided by the buildserver. It is not the latest apt version, there is a newer one, but it is a start.... ;)
I seems that suser-rbos repo was removed from 10.0 x64 tree. So, how do I get the new apt client? And can synaptic deal with that addition?
Sorry for the slow response, I was busy (re)organizing my buildserver repository. The rpms are now available at: http://ftp-1.gwdg.de/pub/opensuse/repositories/home:/rbos/ Forget the directories without architecture. The ones with architecture will remain and are the ones that can be included in the sources.list file. Please, let me know if there are any issue with the rpms. -- Richard Bos Without a home the journey is endless -- Check the headers for your unsubscription address For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the archives at http://lists.suse.com Please read the FAQs: suse-linux-e-faq@suse.com
On Friday 02 June 2006 00:59, Mark A. Taff wrote:
To summarize the previous discussion about apt and suse's package management:
1. The rpm packages for KDE updates have been removed from the apt repository at ftp.gwdg.de, with more packages to be removed in the near future. 2. Apt will not work with the opensuse build service. 3. The opensuse build service is *ALPHA* software. 4. An as-yet-unreleased future version of apt4suse might work with the opensuse build service. 5. Using packages from the opensuse build service will will tie you to the bugs and features of the version of KDE initially released with the version of suse (i.e. 10.1 users will be stuck with KDE 3.5.1, even though three additional bugfix, translation and new feature releases will have been released by this August--3.5.4 gets tagged at the end of July). 6. There is no equal or superior package-management program available for SuSE that could replace apt. Yast most certainly isn't, and from my research, neither smart nor yum are as capable as apt (though they might become so if missing features are added in future releases).
So not only has the best package management system been effectively killed without a suitable replacement, but future (and current SuSE KDE packages) SuSE packages will be a far lower quality (missing recent bugfixes, translations, etc). These are two core defects that are the core of what a distribution is supposed to do: provide software.
Note that I'm not placing blame for this situation on anybody; I'm just laying out the current situation. Please do correct any errors I made above. Meanwhile, I'm going to take Kubuntu for a spin around the block as a potential replacement.
Regards,
Mark
I know 10.1 is a big pile of trousers in reality but do you actually need all those darn package updaters that just cause hassle misery and most of all problems . The CLI is a very powerfull interface the "rpm" system is very useable IF you read the man pages and the builtin help system , You can save yourself a lot of heartache by learning and using the "cli" and "rpm" fully . The first thing i do on any Linux install once it is up fully is make certain i have access to "xterm" and "joe" (cant stand konsole and kedit) a little bit of reading saves a lot of bother . This is an Suse 9.2 machine once it becomes unusable i shall be looking for another distro to replace it with UNLESS ther have been some Major changes with the way Novell/Suse are heading it will not be a suse distro there is a mojor reverse in direction needed PRONTO Novell are already feeling the pinch keep this up and it will become terminal .. Pete . -- The Labour party has changed their emblem from a rose to a condom as it more accurately reflects the government's political stance. A condom allows for inflation, halts production, destroys the next generation, protects a bunch of pricks, and gives you a sense of security while you are actually being fucked. from GSM -- Check the headers for your unsubscription address For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the archives at http://lists.suse.com Please read the FAQs: suse-linux-e-faq@suse.com
Peter Nikolic wrote:
I know 10.1 is a big pile of trousers in reality but do you actually need all those darn package updaters that just cause hassle misery and most of all problems .
The CLI is a very powerfull interface the "rpm" system is very useable IF you read the man pages and the builtin help system , You can save yourself a lot of heartache by learning and using the "cli" and "rpm" fully .
The first thing i do on any Linux install once it is up fully is make certain i have access to "xterm" and "joe" (cant stand konsole and kedit) a little bit of reading saves a lot of bother .
This is an Suse 9.2 machine once it becomes unusable i shall be looking for another distro to replace it with UNLESS ther have been some Major changes with the way Novell/Suse are heading it will not be a suse distro there is a mojor reverse in direction needed PRONTO Novell are already feeling the pinch keep this up and it will become terminal ..
For one machine you're personally using, that's fine. When you're running two dozen servers, update systems and package management become a bit more critical. True, we don't need all of them. We need one that works. This discussion wouldn't have been such an issue if SuSE had shipped with a working package management / update system. -- Check the headers for your unsubscription address For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the archives at http://lists.suse.com Please read the FAQs: suse-linux-e-faq@suse.com
On Friday 02 June 2006 01:59, Mark A. Taff wrote:
4. An as-yet-unreleased future version of apt4suse might work with the opensuse build service.
Where did you get that information from? AFAIK, an as-yet-unreleased future version of apt might work with the repo-data system as smart does. Cheers, Leen -- Check the headers for your unsubscription address For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the archives at http://lists.suse.com Please read the FAQs: suse-linux-e-faq@suse.com
participants (13)
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Anders Johansson -
Bob S -
Darryl Gregorash -
Graham Anderson -
Ken Schneider -
Leendert Meyer -
Marcus Meissner -
Mark A. Taff -
Peter Nikolic -
Richard Bos -
Roger Oberholtzer -
Sunny -
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