[opensuse] Why everyone should learn to use the command line
https://xkcd.com/1168/ This Rob guy probably used Ubuntu -- Our society won't be truly free until "None of the Above" is always an option. -- Eric S. Raymond -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On Wednesday 06 March 2013 07:54:32 Anton Aylward wrote:
This Rob guy probably used Ubuntu
It didn't say which version of tar. Solaris tar doesn't accept the same flags as GNU tar (e.g. it doesn't come with builtin support for zip and bzip2, or at least it didn't last time I looked at it) ...but it works on my machine at home!! boom Anders -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
Anders Johansson wrote:
It didn't say which version of tar. Solaris tar doesn't accept the same flags as GNU tar (e.g. it doesn't come with builtin support for zip and bzip2, or at least it didn't last time I looked at it)
...but it works on my machine at home!!
And it's great for backing up to your mag tape stands. ;-) -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
James Knott said the following on 03/06/2013 08:26 AM:
Anders Johansson wrote:
It didn't say which version of tar. Solaris tar doesn't accept the same flags as GNU tar (e.g. it doesn't come with builtin support for zip and bzip2, or at least it didn't last time I looked at it)
...but it works on my machine at home!!
And it's great for backing up to your mag tape stands. ;-)
That's what the 'mt' command is for and that's why opensuse (as of 12.2) has it, and that's why its included with the CPIO package and not the TAR package. Makes perfect sense, doens't it? That's why you lug the mag tape stand around along with your laptop. Do recall that the cpio package is needed by, lets see ... cpio is needed by (installed) gfxboot-4.5.0-2.1.2.i586 cpio is needed by (installed) file-roller-3.4.2-2.2.1.i586 cpio is needed by (installed) aaa_base-12.2-2.14.1.i586 cpio is needed by (installed) plymouth-scripts-0.8.6.1-1.19.1.i586 cpio is needed by (installed) mkinitrd-2.7.1-62.9.1.i586 so lets take those out since we don't need 'mt'. Taking TAR out is easy, after all it is *only* needed by yast2-installation-2.22.10-1.1.4.noarch -- If a better system is thine, impart it; if not, make use of mine. - Horace -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
Anton Aylward wrote:
James Knott said the following on 03/06/2013 08:26 AM:
Anders Johansson wrote:
It didn't say which version of tar. Solaris tar doesn't accept the same flags as GNU tar (e.g. it doesn't come with builtin support for zip and bzip2, or at least it didn't last time I looked at it)
...but it works on my machine at home!!
And it's great for backing up to your mag tape stands. ;-)
That's what the 'mt' command is for and that's why opensuse (as of 12.2) has it, and that's why its included with the CPIO package and not the TAR package.
I think 'mt_st' preferred over 'mt', but I can't remember why. -- Per Jessen, Zürich (6.8°C) http://www.dns24.ch/ - free DNS hosting, made in Switzerland. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
Per Jessen wrote:
That's what the 'mt' command is for and that's why opensuse (as of
12.2) has it, and that's why its included with the CPIO package and not the TAR package. I think 'mt_st' preferred over 'mt', but I can't remember why.
Let's not forget, "tar" stands for tape archive. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
James Knott said the following on 03/06/2013 10:33 AM:
Per Jessen wrote:
That's what the 'mt' command is for and that's why opensuse (as of
12.2) has it, and that's why its included with the CPIO package and not the TAR package. I think 'mt_st' preferred over 'mt', but I can't remember why.
Let's not forget, "tar" stands for tape archive.
Right. And that's why, as I said, the command for manipulating tapes is packaged with CPIO and not TAR. Windows has DLL Hell. We have packaging hell. -- Definitions are temporary verbalizations of concepts, and concepts -- particularly difficult concepts -- are usually revised repeatedly as our knowledge and understanding grows. -- Ernst Mayr -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
Anton Aylward wrote:
James Knott said the following on 03/06/2013 10:33 AM:
Per Jessen wrote:
That's what the 'mt' command is for and that's why opensuse (as of
12.2) has it, and that's why its included with the CPIO package and not the TAR package. I think 'mt_st' preferred over 'mt', but I can't remember why.
Let's not forget, "tar" stands for tape archive.
Right. And that's why, as I said, the command for manipulating tapes is packaged with CPIO and not TAR.
mt_st is a separate package. Anyway, cpio is also an archiver, to tape or otherwise. -- Per Jessen, Zürich (6.8°C) http://www.dns24.ch/ - free DNS hosting, made in Switzerland. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
Per Jessen said the following on 03/06/2013 10:53 AM:
mt_st is a separate package.
OK, I'll drop the sarcasm: Why isn't 'mt' in a separate package then? Both CPIO and TAR can be used without a mag tape. In fact CPIO is used, as I pointed out, in packaging a lot of stuff very intimately concerned with the kernel and booting. If 'mt' has to be packaged with something, then putting it with TAR makes more sense than putting it with CPIO. if 'mt_st' is packaged separately, why can't 'mt' be packaged separately? I know the answer to that; it *CAN*. On my Mageia system it is. When I get to it I'll check my Fedora system. So: why, why why? I'm sure we can find other packaging and dependency inanities -- When one find's oneself in a hole of one's own making, it is a good time to examine the quality of the workmanship. --John Renmerde -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
Anton Aylward wrote:
Per Jessen said the following on 03/06/2013 10:53 AM:
mt_st is a separate package.
OK, I'll drop the sarcasm: Why isn't 'mt' in a separate package then?
Possibly because 'mt_st' is? I mean, if nobody uses the 'mt' supplied with cpio, but always use the one from 'mt_st" instead, why bother changing the packaging? I don't know - I'm pretty certain I have only ever used mt_st, and I actually use quite a few tapes. I have an elderly StorageTek L180 with six drives downstairs.
Both CPIO and TAR can be used without a mag tape. In fact CPIO is used, as I pointed out, in packaging a lot of stuff very intimately concerned with the kernel and booting.
The initrd for instance. Sure. It's very versatile.
If 'mt' has to be packaged with something, then putting it with TAR makes more sense than putting it with CPIO.
if 'mt_st' is packaged separately, why can't 'mt' be packaged separately?
Nobody has claimed it can't.
I know the answer to that; it *CAN*. On my Mageia system it is. When I get to it I'll check my Fedora system.
So: why, why why?
I'm sure we can find other packaging and dependency inanities
I'm sure we can, but why bother? I mean, do you see any significant issue in 'mt' not being packaged by itself? -- Per Jessen, Zürich (6.8°C) http://www.dns24.ch/ - free DNS hosting, made in Switzerland. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On Wednesday 06 March 2013 16:25:13 Per Jessen wrote:
Anton Aylward wrote:
James Knott said the following on 03/06/2013 08:26 AM:
Anders Johansson wrote:
It didn't say which version of tar. Solaris tar doesn't accept the same flags as GNU tar (e.g. it doesn't come with builtin support for zip and bzip2, or at least it didn't last time I looked at it)
...but it works on my machine at home!!
And it's great for backing up to your mag tape stands. ;-)
That's what the 'mt' command is for and that's why opensuse (as of 12.2) has it, and that's why its included with the CPIO package and not the TAR package.
I think 'mt_st' preferred over 'mt', but I can't remember why.
st stands for scsi tape, if your tape drive isn't scsi, you should probably be using mt Anders -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
Anders Johansson wrote:
On Wednesday 06 March 2013 16:25:13 Per Jessen wrote:
Anton Aylward wrote:
James Knott said the following on 03/06/2013 08:26 AM:
Anders Johansson wrote:
It didn't say which version of tar. Solaris tar doesn't accept the same flags as GNU tar (e.g. it doesn't come with builtin support for zip and bzip2, or at least it didn't last time I looked at it)
...but it works on my machine at home!!
And it's great for backing up to your mag tape stands. ;-)
That's what the 'mt' command is for and that's why opensuse (as of 12.2) has it, and that's why its included with the CPIO package and not the TAR package.
I think 'mt_st' preferred over 'mt', but I can't remember why.
st stands for scsi tape, if your tape drive isn't scsi, you should probably be using mt
Ah, that's right, thanks. (are there really any non-SCSI tape drives out there?) -- Per Jessen, Zürich (10.2°C) http://www.dns24.ch/ - free DNS hosting, made in Switzerland. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
Per Jessen wrote:
Ah, that's right, thanks. (are there really any non-SCSI tape drives out there?)
Back when I was working with tape drives, there wasn't even an SCSI to connect with. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 03/06/2013 09:54 AM, Anton Aylward wrote:
This Rob guy probably used Ubuntu
I interpret it quite differently, namely http://www.linfo.org/tarbomb.html -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
Cristian Rodríguez wrote:
I interpret it quite differently, namely
I have long had the habit of untarring files into a new director, after doing similar back in the days of zip and arc files in DOS. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
James Knott said the following on 03/06/2013 10:23 AM:
Cristian Rodríguez wrote:
I interpret it quite differently, namely
I have long had the habit of untarring files into a new director, after doing similar back in the days of zip and arc files in DOS.
+1 Even so, I always do a 'tar .. -t ...' -- The use of COBOL cripples the mind; its teaching should, therefore,be regarded as a criminal offence. -- E.W. Dijkstra -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 06.03.2013 13:54, Anton Aylward wrote:
This Rob guy probably used Ubuntu
tar --help *bomb defused* -- Ibrahim "Arastirmacilar" Yurtseven The web is what you make of it -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On Thursday 07 March 2013, Ibrahim Yurtseven wrote:
On 06.03.2013 13:54, Anton Aylward wrote:
This Rob guy probably used Ubuntu
tar --help *bomb defused*
Don't think so. rudi@gcc70:~$ uname -sr NetBSD 5.1 rudi@gcc70:~$ tar --help tar: unknown option -- help [...] rudi@gcc70:~$ echo $? 1 cu, Rudi -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
El 07/03/13 09:36, Ruediger Meier escribió:
On Thursday 07 March 2013, Ibrahim Yurtseven wrote:
On 06.03.2013 13:54, Anton Aylward wrote:
This Rob guy probably used Ubuntu
tar --help *bomb defused*
Don't think so.
rudi@gcc70:~$ uname -sr NetBSD 5.1 rudi@gcc70:~$ tar --help tar: unknown option -- help [...] rudi@gcc70:~$ echo $? 1
heh :-) that's probably the whole point of the comic. This is probably because Netbsd tar does not use getopt_long as it is a GNU extension. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
participants (7)
-
Anders Johansson -
Anton Aylward -
Cristian Rodríguez -
Ibrahim Yurtseven -
James Knott -
Per Jessen -
Ruediger Meier