Hi! I was going to write about my first impressions... but since you started it. On 12/8/06, Michael Schueller wrote:

Am Freitag, 8. Dezember 2006 18:21 schrieb John Meyer:

...

I'm kinda digging it, just for the compactness of the menus.

No!

Klick right on the menue to change back to old style...

Thanks! This is just what I was looking for - I had been looking for it a long time. I just could not figure what selection to make where. Until you confirmed that it must be one of those and then I just tried. Why I hate it? Those of you that designed it, please read through - you still have done quite good job in trying change the menu. Please read and do not hate me for saying this. Good points: - It looks good! - It tries reduce the clutter by showing only parts of it at a time. The bad: - Usability The bad things that affect the usability are size, mouse usage and confusing split of items together with large number of items. The limited size means that you have a scroll bar in the menu! That's makes selecting programs very frustrating. Also the fact that the sub-menus do not open if you hover over them with the mouse - you actually have to click on it to open. Just try to "surf" around the menu for some time (for instance to get the feel what you have there, or to find some particular program). Just count the mouse clicks (and compare to the traditional menu) while you are waiting for the cool animation on a slow computer. The tabs open with hovering, so why can't the sub menus? Actually, in "Configure - KDE Panel - Menus" it is selected that "Open (K) menu on mouse hover". Not sure what it means, but what happens is that I used to get the cool hover effects from the icons but the menu didn't open. And the sub menus do not open. But the tabs do open. Confusing. (Somewhere during this, I lost the hover effects from the icons - I thought it is the check box on "Configure - KDE Panel - Appearance" ... but that is checked.) Favorites and history. These are both dynamic sub views to the applications menu. So, in effect you have same programs in the same menu in 3 different places. I do understand what the difference between these is... favourites removes the need to manually group the favourite programs, from history you'll find the obscure program you just started and everything is in the Applications. But 3 places - that's a bit too much. And still, why are these separated with the computer-tab... which actually seems to have some programs there also! So 4 places. Where was that configuration tool that I used last week? And then the Leave. Is leave the correct term? I've never heard that anybody would leave a OS. Well, ok on this list many people have been heard to say that they'll leave SUSE after the MS deal ;-) Maybe that's what the leave stands for? The Leave-menu has 8 options (+ the scrollbar). Switch user brings up another two. Start operating system another 3 (from which one is floppy, even though I do not have a floppy drive). Logout brought up another dialog asking for confirmation. How accidentially do you get to the logout on leave menu on the SUSE-menu? Locking results in a dialog asking for the password, but at the same time offering to log in as another user. So what is the difference to the switch user that locks the screen? And then shutdown, restart and further down another restart and then in between those two "pause" selections. I mean leaving SUSE really is hard ;-) Again, I know what those all mean, but I will have to teach this to my wife and children. So, I'm back to the old KDE menu. Submenus open just by hovering, no scrollbars, I can easily surf around the submenus and find things, shutdown has less options. -- HG. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Well, for me, it's hard to tell if the new menu is good or not. I have not liked it any more than standard KDE menu. I prefer the standard KDE menu, but I can work with the new menu as well without major productivity loss. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Saturday 09 December 2006 22:24, George Stoianov wrote:

On 12/9/06, Alexey Eremenko wrote:

...

Well, for me, it's hard to tell if the new menu is good or not.

I have not liked it any more than standard KDE menu. I prefer the standard KDE menu, but I can work with the new menu as well without major productivity loss. --

This new menu seems very Mac like, too many clicks plus the mac opens different columns in th Finder, so you can see where you started from... I do not like it beside being different it is not more useful.

I don't know the Mac menu, but I don't like that I have to click to see a submenu, or to go back to a parent menu. To be able to do this just with simple mouse movement, and without clicking is what I like in the original KDE-menu. The way of navigating between submenus is probably inherent to the concepts of both menu's. But I do not dislike the new menu. It offers a choice, and that alone I consider an improvement. I like the grouping of the tabs, and to be able to switch between tabs without clicking, but with mouse movement alone. What I also like is being able to switch between both menu styles with just two clicks. The search feature has improved because the results are listed below the Search field. In the KDE-menu one would have to navigate to the application in question. In short: * quite a few improvements * I dislike navigation between submenu's with mouse clicks I'll keep the new menu for now... ;-) Cheers, Leen -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Sunday 10 December 2006 22:20, Roger Oberholtzer wrote:

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I'm kinda digging it, just for the compactness of the menus.

My only complaint is that when you go back (left arrow in the menu) it does not leave you where you were in the previous menu. You have to manually go back there. So, when simply exploring the menus, one is forced to use the brain to remember where one was. I thought computers meant I did not have to use my brain :)

Can't stand it myself. Too slow. I only played with it on Sabayon Linux (an Italian gentoo based distro). Its a nice Distro from what I saw (LiveCD) and it included the Suse menu system as an option. -- _____________________________________ John Andersen

On 12/11/06, James Knott wrote:

I also don't care for the new menu.

I realize this discussions has been resolved with the option to switch back to old KDE menu. But I did want to add one personal experience with this with the hope that it might aid future development. I personally like the new menu -- but I find it's very hard to use when you are using a laptop with the track ball or trackpoint and built in click buttons. However, if you are using an external mouse -- it works fine. -- "Develop success from failures. Discouragement and failure are two of the surest stepping stones to success." - Dale Carnegie -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Monday 11 December 2006 21:42, John Andersen wrote:

On Monday 11 December 2006 10:42, D Gavrilovic wrote:

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I personally like the new menu -- but I find it's very hard to use when you are using a laptop with the track ball or trackpoint and built in click buttons. However, if you are using an external mouse -- it works fine.

Well, I agree its easier with an external mouse, but there are still problems and those problems are generic to all kde menus.

With new high resolution monitors moving the mouse into a sub menu from one of the kde main menus is tricky because you can drift off the very narrow line of a single menu item and a new menu popup appears with a different sublist, Vary annoying.

This is one thing that the Suse menu's do help with.

I suggested an improvement to kde as a wish list item http://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=137270 but it has languished with no votes. Apparently I'm the only one running at 1920x1200.

No, you're not, although currently I'm at 1600x1200, in 10.1 I was at 1920x1440 (did 2048x1536 for a while). As for your bug-report, I did read it, but could not understand your problem. (Is discussing that here off-topic?) Cheers, Leen -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Monday 11 December 2006 18:54, John Andersen wrote:

On Monday 11 December 2006 12:07, Leendert Meyer wrote:

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As for your bug-report, I did read it, but could not understand your problem. (Is discussing that here off-topic?)

Its not a bug report, its a wishlist item.

Click K to pop up the menu Slide mouse straight pointer up to Multimedia, and hover there. Submenu appears

Now to select a sub menu item, you have to slide your mouse pointer straight across with out falling off (above or below) the multimedia line. The higher the resolution the harder this is to do, extremely tricky with a trackball or a touch pad mouse.

What I've gotten in the habit of doing on the main KDE/SUSE menu is just sliding the mouse pointer to the right hand side of whichever menu/submenu level and then going vertical to the submenu I want. That way the pointer is right there where the next submenu appears and you avoid the aggravation of falling off a specific submenu.

If the submenu appeared immediately to the right of the cursor this would be much faster, easier, and even possible with notebook touch-pads.

That would be even better. Stan -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

D Gavrilovic wrote:

On 12/11/06, James Knott wrote:

...

I also don't care for the new menu.

I realize this discussions has been resolved with the option to switch back to old KDE menu. But I did want to add one personal experience with this with the hope that it might aid future development.

I personally like the new menu -- but I find it's very hard to use when you are using a laptop with the track ball or trackpoint and built in click buttons. However, if you are using an external mouse -- it works fine. You can change to old fashion by right click on start. I f You want to come back again. the procedure is the same. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org