On Sun, 2002-08-04 at 03:22, Joe & Sesil Morris (NTM) wrote:

...

- I get SCSI emulation for my DVD drive (which is totally useless and messes up my symlinks /dev/dvd and /dev/cdrom)

This happened to me with Hubert's kernel (so I changed the symlinks)

OK, of course, one could do this:-)

...

- I get a lot of permissions turned to something like 'paranoid' E.g. I can no longer enter several /dev subdirectories as user.

That never happened with me. Did your security setting get changed (and implemented by a SuSEconfig run)?

no, and that's even more weird:-)

...

- Bash by clicking on the shell in the KDE panel no longer works as user, only as root;

No problems here with that as well.

...

- Starting YaST2 as user asks me for the password, when I'm finished entering it, it says: "The program 'su' is not found! Make sure your PATH is set correctly." Then it quits. I mean, su is in /bin and /bin is in $HOME/.profile in the PATH section, so that's crap:-)

Again, no problem with that as well. Those kind of problems don't seem like a kernel upgrade problem as much as SuSEconfig changing something (like security set to paranoid).

I agree! This isn't sort'a kernel like problem BUTTTTT: why did it occur after upgrading the kernel? Why do the permissions change now once more after upgrading to the 234 build? (I was on 183 and went back to 174). So it must have a connection, somehow. Cheers ... Wolfi ============================================= mailto:wolfi_z@gmx.net

On Sun, 2002-08-04 at 03:59, Anders Johansson wrote:

On Sunday 04 August 2002 03:45, wolfi wrote:

...

I agree! This isn't sort'a kernel like problem BUTTTTT: why did it occur after upgrading the kernel? Why do the permissions change now once more after upgrading to the 234 build? (I was on 183 and went back to 174). So it must have a connection, somehow.

I haven't tried the mantel test kernels, but I can say that the new kernel in the updates directory (k_smp build 212) resolves the main problem I've had with the 2.4.18 kernels. Now DMA works on my dvd drive again. I haven't been able to watch dvds properly since 2.4.16 so for me this is great news :)

//Anders

Ok, I'll try the 231 build from the update directory. Is your DVD drive running as a SCSI emulated drive now or is it working 'normally'? Cheers .... Wolfi ============================================= mailto:wolfi_z@gmx.net

On Sun, 2002-08-04 at 03:59, Anders Johansson wrote:

On Sunday 04 August 2002 03:45, wolfi wrote:

...

I agree! This isn't sort'a kernel like problem BUTTTTT: why did it occur after upgrading the kernel? Why do the permissions change now once more after upgrading to the 234 build? (I was on 183 and went back to 174). So it must have a connection, somehow.

I haven't tried the mantel test kernels, but I can say that the new kernel in the updates directory (k_smp build 212) resolves the main problem I've had with the 2.4.18 kernels. Now DMA works on my dvd drive again. I haven't been able to watch dvds properly since 2.4.16 so for me this is great news :)

//Anders

And another question is ... how can I turn on/off SCSI emulation for a specific drive in SuSE 8.0? So let's say, if the kernel update turns my DVD drive into a SCSI emulated one, which file do I need to hack to get it back to normal again? I definitely am not keen on running a drive under SCSI emulation if I don't have to. Cheers .... Wolfi ============================================= mailto:wolfi_z@gmx.net

Dear all, It seems a lot of people have been having problems after upgrading their SuSE 8.0 to KDE 3.0.2. I would like to comment on these briefly, since I am thinking of wrting a serious compliant letter to SuSE and I would like to hear your opinion. But first, since some of these problems have been reported here more than once, it is perhaps useful to list them again, together with the solutions that worked for me: 1. Yast2 cannot be accessed through a GUI, only through its clumsy text interface. If you try to start the GUI interface Yast2 does fire up (but some people even experienced some segfaults), but the interface does not show up. Solution: I downloaded and installed qt3-non-mt-3.0.4-87 2. KPPP does no longer work. Solution: create the file /etc/ppp/peers/kppp and add "plugin passwordfd.so" to it. 3. Kinternet does not work. Solution: to the file with the name of your provider in /etc/sysconfig/network/providers add the line "STUPIDMODE="yes"" (mind the quotation marks around "yes") 4. Apps handbook no longer work. Solution: none that i know of (correct me if I am wrong) Now, in my opinion these are very serious defects for a relatively minor upgrade version. You would expect such problems when upgrading to a X.0 version, not from 3.0.1 to 3.0.2.. And since KDE 3.0.2 is mainly a maintance release i cannot but conclude that SuSE did a poor job of packaging the upgrade files. Now, this can happen, nobody is perfect, but where SuSE really disappointed me is in its reaction to these problems, namely there was no reaction, just silence, and this is simply not acceptable. Speaking for myself, I cannot allow any serious fault in my box: I work on it and I very much want it to be stable (for instance, right now i have on it the 60 abstracts of a conference I am organizing). That's why i keep it always updated with YOU and I never launch myself into upgrading from source or install any development package. Finding myself unable to launch Yast2 and connect to the internet (another thing I need for my job) was really upsetting. Furthermore, none of these problems were solved by support at SuSE, but only by experimenting and by all the helpful people here on this list (thanks again, folks!). These hassles certainly cost me lot of time and effort. All this is surprising, since SuSE was not obliged to put those KDE 3.0.2 upgrade packages in YOU to start with. SuSE is very clear about not providing update patches, but only bugfixes, so there was no reason to include KDE 3.0.2 in YOU. It was already available on their LINUKS page so those who wanted it could get it there, but those of us who prefer a stable system could keep on updating with YOU. Since then, SuSE's behavior only got worse: the KDE 3.0.2 packages were silently removed from YOU and then (silently) put back again, with no word from SuSE warning people of the problems found in the original upgrade packages. We don't even know whether the "handbook" bug has been solved at all. This not the way any serious firm, be it big or small, behaves. So, to conclude, i was going to send SuSe a feedback letter asking for: 1. the removing of all the unstable or broken pacakges from YOU, including KDE 3.0.2 and any other eventual broken package, and an open disclosure of all the problems those pacakges had. 2. new, patched packages of KDE 3.0.2 that those of use that already installed the original ones should upgarde to - again. Only these patches should appear in YOU, not the general KDE 3.0.2 packages. 3. A major cleanup of the "linuks" update packages. From what i can see, the old KDE 3.0 packages are still there, end even some KDE 2.x packages all of them mixed up in the same place. In my opinion, exactly as the "Linuks" page is divided into SuSE version it should also be divided into KDE version so that, for instance, a 7.3 user that did not upgrade to KDE 3.0 before can do it now. All these corrections are very simple to implement, and it is surprising that SuSE did not already do them. SuSE is certainly a great distribution and the problems with KDE 3.0.2 or the deficiencies of the Yast2 text interface do not change this simple fact. But SuSE's reaction to the KDE 3.0.2 problems is managing to do this. It is in SuSE own interest to provide KDE updates, and that's the reason they do it, but we have the right to expect those updates not to break anything in our systems and to be replaced by pached one if they do. It' as simple as that. Let me know wht you think. fred

On Sunday 04 August 2002 16:45, Federico Damonte wrote:

...

3. Kinternet does not work.

Solution: to the file with the name of your provider in /etc/sysconfig/network/providers add the line "STUPIDMODE="yes"" (mind the quotation marks around "yes")

This has absolutely nothing to do with the kde upgrade. Stupid mode is sometimes needed because of the way some ISP server software is implemented. It is a feature of wvdial. If you need it after the kde upgrade you needed it before the upgrade

indeed, i did not use kinternet before kppp stopped working. THanks for pointing that out.

It is a bug, however, that there is no way to set Stupid Mode through the YaST2 internet setup.

it is indeed

And as I reported last Wednesday: copy-ing a link to the clipboard and from there open the link in Mozilla doesn't work anymore. Mozilla can't work anymore due to the extra characters that are copied. This is how it looks: openURL(http://pug.komkon.org, new-window) and Mozilla doesn't know what to do with the 'openURL(' nor with the ', new-window)'. This feature worked in KDE3.0.1 Nobody responded to that email, so I guess nobody has the solution for that either. Frits J. Wüthrich (Sent with Kmail) On Sunday 04 August 2002 15:45, Federico Damonte wrote:

Dear all,

It seems a lot of people have been having problems after upgrading their SuSE 8.0 to KDE 3.0.2. I would like to comment on these briefly, since I am thinking of wrting a serious compliant letter to SuSE and I would like to hear your opinion. But first, since some of these problems have been reported here more than once, it is perhaps useful to list them again, together with the solutions that worked for me:

1. Yast2 cannot be accessed through a GUI, only through its clumsy text interface. If you try to start the GUI interface Yast2 does fire up (but some people even experienced some segfaults), but the interface does not show up.

Solution: I downloaded and installed qt3-non-mt-3.0.4-87

2. KPPP does no longer work.

Solution: create the file /etc/ppp/peers/kppp and add "plugin passwordfd.so" to it.

3. Kinternet does not work.

Solution: to the file with the name of your provider in /etc/sysconfig/network/providers add the line "STUPIDMODE="yes"" (mind the quotation marks around "yes")

4. Apps handbook no longer work.

Solution: none that i know of (correct me if I am wrong)

Now, in my opinion these are very serious defects for a relatively minor upgrade version. You would expect such problems when upgrading to a X.0 version, not from 3.0.1 to 3.0.2.. And since KDE 3.0.2 is mainly a maintance release i cannot but conclude that SuSE did a poor job of packaging the upgrade files. Now, this can happen, nobody is perfect, but where SuSE really disappointed me is in its reaction to these problems, namely there was no reaction, just silence, and this is simply not acceptable. Speaking for myself, I cannot allow any serious fault in my box: I work on it and I very much want it to be stable (for instance, right now i have on it the 60 abstracts of a conference I am organizing). That's why i keep it always updated with YOU and I never launch myself into upgrading from source or install any development package. Finding myself unable to launch Yast2 and connect to the internet (another thing I need for my job) was really upsetting. Furthermore, none of these problems were solved by support at SuSE, but only by experimenting and by all the helpful people here on this list (thanks again, folks!). These hassles certainly cost me lot of time and effort.

All this is surprising, since SuSE was not obliged to put those KDE 3.0.2 upgrade packages in YOU to start with. SuSE is very clear about not providing update patches, but only bugfixes, so there was no reason to include KDE 3.0.2 in YOU. It was already available on their LINUKS page so those who wanted it could get it there, but those of us who prefer a stable system could keep on updating with YOU. Since then, SuSE's behavior only got worse: the KDE 3.0.2 packages were silently removed from YOU and then (silently) put back again, with no word from SuSE warning people of the problems found in the original upgrade packages. We don't even know whether the "handbook" bug has been solved at all. This not the way any serious firm, be it big or small, behaves.

So, to conclude, i was going to send SuSe a feedback letter asking for:

1. the removing of all the unstable or broken pacakges from YOU, including KDE 3.0.2 and any other eventual broken package, and an open disclosure of all the problems those pacakges had.

2. new, patched packages of KDE 3.0.2 that those of use that already installed the original ones should upgarde to - again. Only these patches should appear in YOU, not the general KDE 3.0.2 packages.

3. A major cleanup of the "linuks" update packages. From what i can see, the old KDE 3.0 packages are still there, end even some KDE 2.x packages all of them mixed up in the same place. In my opinion, exactly as the "Linuks" page is divided into SuSE version it should also be divided into KDE version so that, for instance, a 7.3 user that did not upgrade to KDE 3.0 before can do it now.

All these corrections are very simple to implement, and it is surprising that SuSE did not already do them. SuSE is certainly a great distribution and the problems with KDE 3.0.2 or the deficiencies of the Yast2 text interface do not change this simple fact. But SuSE's reaction to the KDE 3.0.2 problems is managing to do this. It is in SuSE own interest to provide KDE updates, and that's the reason they do it, but we have the right to expect those updates not to break anything in our systems and to be replaced by pached one if they do. It' as simple as that.

Let me know wht you think.

fred

Boy, that is a lot of irrevalent info. Please do some trimming.

I assume you are running klipper. Change the action to: mozilla "%s"

thanks, that worked!

I just checked, and it turns out I also have this problem.

And as I reported last Wednesday: copy-ing a link to the clipboard and from there open the link in Mozilla doesn't work anymore. Mozilla can't work anymore due to the extra characters that are copied. This is how it looks: openURL(http://pug.komkon.org, new-window) and Mozilla doesn't know what to do with the 'openURL(' nor with the ', new-window)'. This feature worked in KDE3.0.1 Nobody responded to that email, so I guess nobody has the solution for that either.

Frits J. Wüthrich

On Sunday 04 August 2002 07:45 am, Federico Damonte wrote:

4. Apps handbook no longer work.

Solution: none that i know of (correct me if I am wrong)

I just discovered that you can enter the URL help:/kwhatever/index.html in konqi and it will take you to the appropriate Handbook. I found the one I was looking for that's not available in the khelpcenter, namely knode, by entering help:/knode/index.html. The same can be done for other KDE apps, then you can create a new bookmark folder in konqi to get to them faster. This will probably have to suffice until the next update or SuSE 8.1. -- Bryce Hardy (Santa Rosa, CA) brycehdy@sonic.net

On Sunday 04 August 2002 10:45, Federico Damonte wrote:

Dear all,

It seems a lot of people have been having problems after upgrading their SuSE 8.0 to KDE 3.0.2.

3. Kinternet does not work.

Solution: to the file with the name of your provider in /etc/sysconfig/network/providers add the line "STUPIDMODE="yes"" (mind the quotation marks around "yes")

Federico, A small digression here. I have also had to do the things you speak of. Except that my /etc/sysconfig/network/providers file is empty. There are no files in it since Yast2 failed to set up my modem. Would you mind please, giving me the name of the file in order that I may construct it?

Now, in my opinion these are very serious defects for a relatively minor upgrade version.

Agreed

These hassles certainly cost me lot of time and effort.

Agreed, Me too !

Let me know what you think.

I think that we should let SuSE know about our dissatisfaction. That is what feedback is for. I have sent them some of my complaints. What remains to be seen is do they actually read and evaluate them so they will respond with the fixes?...........SuSE support is absolutely useless....Makes me wonder about feedback. Bob S.

It seems a lot of people have been having problems after upgrading their SuSE 8.0 to KDE 3.0.2. I would like to comment on these briefly, since I am thinking of wrting a serious compliant letter to SuSE and I would like to hear your opinion.

Save your breath. The kde-3.0.2 updates from SuSE are not supported - it's made quite clear on the FTP server that you download and use the packages at your own risk. I don't know if YOU has a mechanism for getting that message across (I never use YOU). It explains why SuSE aren't interested in your problems. Back out to KDE-3.0.0 and wait for SuSE-8.1, which is rumoured to be out next month. -- 7:55am up 11 days, 22:34, 1 user, load average: 0.10, 0.11, 0.16

On Sunday 04 August 2002 15:45, you wrote:

Dear all,

It seems a lot of people have been having problems after upgrading their SuSE 8.0 to KDE 3.0.2. I would like to comment on these briefly, since I am thinking of wrting a serious compliant letter to SuSE and I would like to hear your opinion.

I upgraded using rpm -Fvh. No problems to report, kde 3.02 is very beautiful, though I did have problems starting YaST2 in graphical mode a while ago (when first upgrading to 3.0.1) until some whizz spotted that you needed the up-to-date qt-non-mt rpm. Other people have dealt with your 'STUPIDMODE' problem, it's unrelated to kde. Yes, we all (to a greater or lesser degree) have relied on this list. Using unix means using usenet, that's a feature, not a bug. Linux is a cooperative movement as well as an OS. Don't waste your time or SuSE's writing a letter of complaint. They're doing their best, and they're doing it well. If stability is your primary concern, you'd be better off not knocking the rock, or only undertaking the security updates, though I've had no stability problems with 8.0. SuSE are major contributors to the KDE project, and that project has come on in leaps and bounds in the last few years. Enjoy the fact that you've fixed your problems and enjoy your computing, leave the litigious approach in its box. Your summary of solutions is a nice idea though. Best Fergus

wolfi wrote:

WHERE in hell is this append line now since everything is different in 8.0 ??? I was able to change it easily with YaST1 in the older releases ... but ... how does one edit this append line now (with 8.0)??

/etc/lilo (remember to run lilo after edit). Interesting enough, I tried to edit it the 'proper' way, with Yast2>System>Bootloader Configuration, but with me, I could add the line, but it wouldn't save it, so I just edited it with Kedit, and it is fine now. YMMV -- Joe & Sesil Morris New Tribes Mission Email Address: Joe_Morris@ntm.org Web Address: http://www.mydestiny.net/~joe_morris Registered Linux user 231871 God said, I AM that I AM. I say, by the grace God, I am what I am.