Mike, On Sunday 17 April 2005 08:03, Mike McMullin wrote:
Is anyone interested in working on this?
Absolutely no one is interested in working on this, of course. But seriously, have you considered making it a Wiki? If you did, people could contribute as they saw fit and possessed some knowledge to add without having to commit to any particular amount of effort. It would also allow people to add both questions and answers. Randall Schulz
On Sun, 2005-04-17 at 11:09, Randall R Schulz wrote:
Mike,
On Sunday 17 April 2005 08:03, Mike McMullin wrote:
Is anyone interested in working on this?
Absolutely no one is interested in working on this, of course.
Too bad. ;)
But seriously, have you considered making it a Wiki? If you did, people could contribute as they saw fit and possessed some knowledge to add without having to commit to any particular amount of effort. It would also allow people to add both questions and answers.
Can you recommend a good starting point? I have little to no idea about wiki, other than it's an information resource.
Op zondag 17 april 2005 17:25, schreef Mike McMullin:
But seriously, have you considered making it a Wiki? If you did, people could contribute as they saw fit and possessed some knowledge to add without having to commit to any particular amount of effort. It would also allow people to add both questions and answers.
Can you recommend a good starting point? I have little to no idea about wiki, other than it's an information resource.
Install mediawiki that comes with suse-9.3 :) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wiki -- Richard Bos Without a home the journey is endless
On Sun, 2005-04-17 at 11:35, Richard Bos wrote:
Op zondag 17 april 2005 17:25, schreef Mike McMullin:
But seriously, have you considered making it a Wiki? If you did, people could contribute as they saw fit and possessed some knowledge to add without having to commit to any particular amount of effort. It would also allow people to add both questions and answers.
Can you recommend a good starting point? I have little to no idea about wiki, other than it's an information resource.
Install mediawiki that comes with suse-9.3 :) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wiki
<thwap> Come on Richard, I have to wait for 9.3. I wasn't part of the beta team like some folks are. I suppose I'm going to order it in a month or so. On the other hand I could use that time for other projects, like the ones I'm neglecting. :) Mike
Op maandag 18 april 2005 05:30, schreef Mike McMullin:
Install mediawiki that comes with suse-9.3 :) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wiki
<thwap> Come on Richard, I have to wait for 9.3. I wasn't part of the beta team like some folks are. I suppose I'm going to order it in a month or so. On the other hand I could use that time for other projects, like the ones I'm neglecting. :)
It is easy to install wikipedia, just get the tarball from http://wikipedia.sourceforge.net/ and untar it in /srv/www/htdocs. After that it is more or less, -- Richard Bos Without a home the journey is endless
Sun, 17 Apr 2005, by rschulz@sonic.net:
Mike,
On Sunday 17 April 2005 08:03, Mike McMullin wrote:
Is anyone interested in working on this?
Absolutely no one is interested in working on this, of course.
But seriously, have you considered making it a Wiki? If you did, people could contribute as they saw fit and possessed some knowledge to add without having to commit to any particular amount of effort. It would also allow people to add both questions and answers.
Then I would suggest using an existing Linux wiki, namely the one on linuxquestions.org, in stead of fracturing the information even more. http://wiki.linuxquestions.org/wiki/Main_Page Theo -- Theo v. Werkhoven Registered Linux user# 99872 http://counter.li.org ICBM 52 13 26N , 4 29 47E. + ICQ: 277217131 SUSE 9.2 + Jabber: muadib@jabber.xs4all.nl Kernel 2.6.8 + See headers for PGP/GPG info.
Op maandag 18 april 2005 23:35, schreef Theo v. Werkhoven:
Then I would suggest using an existing Linux wiki, namely the one on linuxquestions.org, in stead of fracturing the information even more. http://wiki.linuxquestions.org/wiki/Main_Page
Right, that's a very good proposal. SuSE is starting here: http://wiki.linuxquestions.org/wiki/SuSE Let's jump on it all together now. -- Richard Bos Without a home the journey is endless
Op maandag 18 april 2005 23:35, schreef Theo v. Werkhoven:
Then I would suggest using an existing Linux wiki, namely the one on
Right, that's a very good proposal. SuSE is starting here: http://wiki.linuxquestions.org/wiki/SuSE That's great. Now the first thing I see is that perhaps there should be some of the most common links that have been very
Richard Bos wrote: popular. The most obvious (to me) link would be the famous Togan FAQ. Since I know almost zero about wikis except that it is community maintained, can someone do that? Damon Register
On Tue, Apr 19, 2005 at 06:35:15AM -0400, Damon Register wrote:
Op maandag 18 april 2005 23:35, schreef Theo v. Werkhoven:
Then I would suggest using an existing Linux wiki, namely the one on
Right, that's a very good proposal. SuSE is starting here: http://wiki.linuxquestions.org/wiki/SuSE That's great. Now the first thing I see is that perhaps there should be some of the most common links that have been very
Richard Bos wrote: popular. The most obvious (to me) link would be the famous Togan FAQ. Since I know almost zero about wikis except that it is community maintained, can someone do that?
Stop, stop. It is incredable, within 12 hours a dedicated suse wiki has popped. And I think it will be better to use that one. For one simple reason that the rss feed e.g. will than only contain updates dedicated to suse. The url is easy to remember to: http://www.susewiki.org I have already configured akregator with the rss of http://www.susewiki.org so if you start making I'll see them :) -- Richard
Richard, On Tuesday 19 April 2005 03:45, radoeka wrote:
...
Stop, stop. It is incredable, within 12 hours a dedicated suse wiki has popped. And I think it will be better to use that one. For one simple reason that the rss feed e.g. will than only contain updates dedicated to suse. The url is easy to remember to: http://www.susewiki.org
I guess this was predictable...
I have already configured akregator with the rss of http://www.susewiki.org so if you start making I'll see them :)
The RSS feed there (http://www.susewiki.org/index.php?title=Special:Recentchanges&feed=rss) isn't exactly easy to find. I found it in the "toolbox" box in the lower-left-hand corner of the "Recent Changes" page (http://www.susewiki.org/index.php?title=Special:Recentchanges). There's also an Atom feed (though I actually don't know what that is or how it differs from an RSS feed).
-- Richard
Randall Schulz
radoeka wrote:
has popped. And I think it will be better to use that one. but why? Theo v. Werkhoven wrote:
Then I would suggest using an existing Linux wiki, namely the one on linuxquestions.org, in stead of fracturing the information even more. Learning SuSE and finding all the resources is already hard enough. Why make it worse? If it already exists, why not use it?
For one simple reason that the rss feed e.g. will than only contain updates dedicated to suse. The url is easy to remember to: What? How is http://wiki.linuxquestions.org/wiki/SuSE not about SuSE?
Damon Register
On Tue, Apr 19, 2005 at 10:23:18AM -0400, Damon Register wrote:
For one simple reason that the rss feed e.g. will than only contain updates dedicated to suse. The url is easy to remember to: What? How is http://wiki.linuxquestions.org/wiki/SuSE not about SuSE?
The rss feed for wiki.linuxquestions.org will contain all updates, also the once not releated to suse. As there are many many topics suse updates in the rss will be difficult to spot. This in contradiction to a dedicated suse wiki. -- RIchard
Richard, On Tuesday 19 April 2005 08:15, radoeka wrote:
...
The rss feed for wiki.linuxquestions.org will contain all updates, also the once not releated to suse. As there are many many topics suse updates in the rss will be difficult to spot. This in contradiction to a dedicated suse wiki.
Please help me find this RSS feed.
RIchard
Randall Schulz
Op dinsdag 19 april 2005 17:27, schreef Randall R Schulz:
The rss feed for wiki.linuxquestions.org will contain all updates, also the once not releated to suse. As there are many many topics suse updates in the rss will be difficult to spot. This in contradiction to a dedicated suse wiki.
Please help me find this RSS feed.
Can't find it either. For me this is a big minus, the wiki seems to be mediawiki, which provides an rss feed normally. So it seems to be removed on purpose. As susewiki.org provides an rss, it deserves some good bonus points here. -- Richard Bos Without a home the journey is endless
Tue, 19 Apr 2005, by radoeka@xs4all.nl:
On Tue, Apr 19, 2005 at 06:35:15AM -0400, Damon Register wrote:
Op maandag 18 april 2005 23:35, schreef Theo v. Werkhoven:
Then I would suggest using an existing Linux wiki, namely the one on
Right, that's a very good proposal. SuSE is starting here: http://wiki.linuxquestions.org/wiki/SuSE That's great. Now the first thing I see is that perhaps there should be some of the most common links that have been very
Richard Bos wrote: popular. The most obvious (to me) link would be the famous Togan FAQ. Since I know almost zero about wikis except that it is community maintained, can someone do that?
Stop, stop. It is incredable, within 12 hours a dedicated suse wiki has popped. And I think it will be better to use that one.
Don't be ridiculous. You present a completely virgin mediawiki site, (those exist by the hundreds no doubth) as a "dedicated suse wiki", and what, expect us to supply you with contents so you can show off with it? Think again. If you really want to make an effort for OSS or SuSE you better show your abilities on an existing project first, before starting your own. Theo -- Theo v. Werkhoven Registered Linux user# 99872 http://counter.li.org ICBM 52 13 26N , 4 29 47E. + ICQ: 277217131 SUSE 9.2 + Jabber: muadib@jabber.xs4all.nl Kernel 2.6.8 + See headers for PGP/GPG info.
Op dinsdag 19 april 2005 19:49, schreef Theo v. Werkhoven:
Stop, stop. It is incredable, within 12 hours a dedicated suse wiki has popped. And I think it will be better to use that one.
Don't be ridiculous.
I am not. The site started before the linuxquestions wiki has been mentioned on this list btw: http://www.susewiki.org/index.php?title=Special:Recentchanges
You present a completely virgin mediawiki site, (those exist by the hundreds no doubth) as a "dedicated suse wiki", and what, expect us to supply you with contents so you can show off with it?
It is not my site, and I'm not related to it all. The site is provided by the same people that provide http://www.suseroot.com/
Think again. http://www.suseroot.com/blog/blog.php?postid=28 See comments. Tell me what you think again.
If you really want to make an effort for OSS or SuSE you better show your abilities on an existing project first, before starting your own.
What is yours? -- Richard Bos Without a home the journey is endless
On Tuesday 19 Apr 2005 19:32, Richard Bos wrote:
It is not my site, and I'm not related to it all. The site is provided by the same people that provide http://www.suseroot.com/
Thanks, Richard - very interesting site. -- Pob hwyl / Best wishes Kevin Donnelly www.kyfieithu.co.uk - Meddalwedd Rhydd yn Gymraeg www.cymrux.org.uk - Linux Cymraeg ar un CD!
Tue, 19 Apr 2005, by radoeka@xs4all.nl:
Op dinsdag 19 april 2005 19:49, schreef Theo v. Werkhoven:
Stop, stop. It is incredable, within 12 hours a dedicated suse wiki has popped. And I think it will be better to use that one.
Don't be ridiculous.
I am not. The site started before the linuxquestions wiki has been mentioned on this list btw: http://www.susewiki.org/index.php?title=Special:Recentchanges
You present a completely virgin mediawiki site, (those exist by the hundreds no doubth) as a "dedicated suse wiki", and what, expect us to supply you with contents so you can show off with it?
It is not my site, and I'm not related to it all. The site is provided by the same people that provide http://www.suseroot.com/
Think again. http://www.suseroot.com/blog/blog.php?postid=28 See comments. Tell me what you think again.
From your initial "It is incredible.." I expected a plug for another useless boneyard Linux site, but it seems more interesting and serious then that, so sorry for my assumption. I'm still not convinced that this site would be any better than linuxquestions.org though, the absolute requirement for a rss feed you seem to have is not something I understand with a place you go for documentation, it would be different if there was day-to-day news to follow..
If you really want to make an effort for OSS or SuSE you better show your abilities on an existing project first, before starting your own.
What is yours?
I do my best, here and in usenet groups, but this wasn't about me, it was about the best place to store and retreive information about (SuSE) Linux. Theo -- Theo v. Werkhoven Registered Linux user# 99872 http://counter.li.org ICBM 52 13 26N , 4 29 47E. + ICQ: 277217131 SUSE 9.2 + Jabber: muadib@jabber.xs4all.nl Kernel 2.6.8 + See headers for PGP/GPG info.
Op dinsdag 19 april 2005 22:39, schreef Theo v. Werkhoven:
From your initial "It is incredible.." I expected a plug for another useless boneyard Linux site, but it seems more interesting and serious then that, so sorry for my assumption.
Accepted :) I found it incredible that within some hours 2 references to suse wiki's were posted, while before that there was just none...
I'm still not convinced that this site would be any better than linuxquestions.org though, the absolute requirement for a rss feed you seem to have is not something I understand with a place you go for documentation, it would be different if there was day-to-day news to follow..
There were some changes to the site today. I see them in the rss feed. It makes it damn easy to stay up to date with the latest changes. As such one can also add to or correct the new information, just after the info has been placed.
If you really want to make an effort for OSS or SuSE you better show your abilities on an existing project first, before starting your own.
What is yours?
I do my best, here and in usenet groups, but this wasn't about me, it was about the best place to store and retreive information about (SuSE) Linux.
Yes, no problem with that. The susewiki maintainer ask for support at: http://www.susewiki.org/index.php?title=Main_Page , he can be contacted following the "please contact me" link. I hope some people from this list can help? -- Richard Bos Without a home the journey is endless
Theo v. Werkhoven wrote:
Tue, 19 Apr 2005, by radoeka@xs4all.nl:
On Tue, Apr 19, 2005 at 06:35:15AM -0400, Damon Register wrote:
Richard Bos wrote:
Op maandag 18 april 2005 23:35, schreef Theo v. Werkhoven:
Then I would suggest using an existing Linux wiki, namely the one on
Right, that's a very good proposal. SuSE is starting here: http://wiki.linuxquestions.org/wiki/SuSE
That's great. Now the first thing I see is that perhaps there should be some of the most common links that have been very popular. The most obvious (to me) link would be the famous Togan FAQ. Since I know almost zero about wikis except that it is community maintained, can someone do that?
Stop, stop. It is incredable, within 12 hours a dedicated suse wiki has popped. And I think it will be better to use that one.
Don't be ridiculous. You present a completely virgin mediawiki site, (those exist by the hundreds no doubth) as a "dedicated suse wiki", and what, expect us to supply you with contents so you can show off with it? Think again. If you really want to make an effort for OSS or SuSE you better show your abilities on an existing project first, before starting your own.
Theo
I have to disagree. If we put all our eggs in one basket we would all be running Windows. On top of that, the more Suse related sites that are out there, the more exposure Suse gets. As that is our (or most of our) favorite distro, I see that as a good thing. Every company likes free advertising. Why discourage someone for starting their own project? That is the best way to learn. Also, because they will be seriously involved, they will learn about things they never encountered, whereas if the same info was to be on another page (or wiki in this case) they may never gain that knowledge, as they were not specifically looking for that knowledge. I do understand that all info in one place can be very handy, for me it is the Internet with a little help from Google. - James W
Tue, 19 Apr 2005, by jwright@blackriverproduce.com:
Theo v. Werkhoven wrote:
Tue, 19 Apr 2005, by radoeka@xs4all.nl:
[..]
Stop, stop. It is incredable, within 12 hours a dedicated suse wiki has popped. And I think it will be better to use that one. [..] If you really want to make an effort for OSS or SuSE you better show your abilities on an existing project first, before starting your own.
Theo
I have to disagree. If we put all our eggs in one basket we would all be running Windows. On top of that, the more Suse related sites that are out there, the more exposure Suse gets. As that is our (or most of
More small sites with a few pages of information, that could either be unique but hard to find because the site is unknown, or just a duplicate of information on other sites does not help any Linux distribution IMHO. The situation in the FreeBSD world shows that a central site, where all of the information available can be found, leads to a more stable product in the long run, and more users who know about the inner secrets so newbies get better help on their mailinglists and newsgroups (again, IMHO).
our) favorite distro, I see that as a good thing. Every company likes free advertising. Why discourage someone for starting their own project? That is the best way to learn. Also, because they will be seriously involved, they will learn about things they never encountered, whereas if the same info was to be on another page (or wiki in this case) they may never gain that knowledge, as they were not specifically looking for that knowledge. I do understand that all info in one place can be very handy, for me it is the Internet with a little help from Google.
The learning curve for a wiki isn't that steep. I've setup a couple at $DAYJOB, it's 30 minutes work, tops. What's much harder to learn is howto write easy to understand and concise explanations, and how to organize the wiki to make navigating simple as possible. Google is very good, but 12,700,000 hits on "suse" doesn't make it any easier to find what you're looking for. Theo -- Theo v. Werkhoven Registered Linux user# 99872 http://counter.li.org ICBM 52 13 26N , 4 29 47E. + ICQ: 277217131 SUSE 9.2 + Jabber: muadib@jabber.xs4all.nl Kernel 2.6.8 + See headers for PGP/GPG info.
Theo v. Werkhoven wrote:
Tue, 19 Apr 2005, by jwright@blackriverproduce.com:
Theo v. Werkhoven wrote:
Tue, 19 Apr 2005, by radoeka@xs4all.nl:
[..]
Stop, stop. It is incredable, within 12 hours a dedicated suse wiki has popped. And I think it will be better to use that one.
[..]
If you really want to make an effort for OSS or SuSE you better show your abilities on an existing project first, before starting your own.
Theo
I have to disagree. If we put all our eggs in one basket we would all be running Windows. On top of that, the more Suse related sites that are out there, the more exposure Suse gets. As that is our (or most of
More small sites with a few pages of information, that could either be unique but hard to find because the site is unknown, or just a duplicate of information on other sites does not help any Linux distribution IMHO. The situation in the FreeBSD world shows that a central site, where all of the information available can be found, leads to a more stable product in the long run, and more users who know about the inner secrets so newbies get better help on their mailinglists and newsgroups (again, IMHO).
our) favorite distro, I see that as a good thing. Every company likes free advertising. Why discourage someone for starting their own project? That is the best way to learn. Also, because they will be seriously involved, they will learn about things they never encountered, whereas if the same info was to be on another page (or wiki in this case) they may never gain that knowledge, as they were not specifically looking for that knowledge. I do understand that all info in one place can be very handy, for me it is the Internet with a little help from Google.
The learning curve for a wiki isn't that steep. I've setup a couple at $DAYJOB, it's 30 minutes work, tops. What's much harder to learn is howto write easy to understand and concise explanations, and how to organize the wiki to make navigating simple as possible. Google is very good, but 12,700,000 hits on "suse" doesn't make it any easier to find what you're looking for.
Theo
I do see your point. I find that because the more (not necessarily most) relevant sites pop up first in Google. And even if you are not fluent in the ways of the Google search, a newbie using the advanced search *should* be able to find what they are looking for rather quickly. A central location does have it's advantages though. Sometimes it's nice to one-stop shop. - James W
On Mon, 2005-04-18 at 17:40, Richard Bos wrote:
Op maandag 18 april 2005 23:35, schreef Theo v. Werkhoven:
Then I would suggest using an existing Linux wiki, namely the one on linuxquestions.org, in stead of fracturing the information even more. http://wiki.linuxquestions.org/wiki/Main_Page
Right, that's a very good proposal. SuSE is starting here: http://wiki.linuxquestions.org/wiki/SuSE
Let's jump on it all together now.
That sounds like a plan. :)
The Sunday 2005-04-17 at 11:03 -0400, Mike McMullin wrote:
Is anyone interested in working on this?
What do you mean? Are you requesting help? I'm collaborating in the translation to spanish of the firewall howto by Togan Muftuoglu, if that's what you mean - but the project seems to be stuck. -- Cheers, Carlos Robinson
* Carlos E. R.;
The Sunday 2005-04-17 at 11:03 -0400, Mike McMullin wrote:
Is anyone interested in working on this?
What do you mean? Are you requesting help?
I'm collaborating in the translation to spanish of the firewall howto by Togan Muftuoglu, if that's what you mean - but the project seems to be stuck.
Well let me bring in some perspective in to this discussion. When I had the first idea of creating a FAQ based on the commonly asked questions on the list, I was hoping there would be collabrative work among the members of the list. Unfortunately this turned out to be the not the outcome. There were occasions where sompe people did send either as an article or a more like a answer as a a collabration, yet the majority of the work turned out to be my digging out the mailing list to find the common questions and the replies to them. It is not only to find the common question yet also to find the correct answer in a way that would work out in every situation without severly changing the underlying philosphy of SUSE and YaST. It has become a tedious job and drifted away from staying an enjoyable hobby. Another aspect is my personal life and the amount of time I can devote to the project has become limited. After so many years, I have become a a student again and I have to put some effort into studying. One can say my priorities have shifted a little bit. Nevertheless, I do not like to leave things unfinished and I am doing a major rewrite of the SuSEfirewall howto. What happens after this rewrite I can not say. -- Togan Muftuoglu | Unofficial SuSE FAQ Maintainer | Please reply to the list; http://susefaq.sf.net | Please don't put me in TO/CC. Nisi defectum, haud refiecendum
The Wednesday 2005-04-20 at 11:47 +0200, Togan Muftuoglu wrote:
There were occasions where sompe people did send either as an article or a more like a answer as a a collabration, yet the majority of the work turned out to be my digging out the mailing list to find the common questions and the replies to them.
Yes, I sent you one or two howtos, I think. I could adapt some of my longs emails, if the subject is interesting enough to expand into a micro-howto, on request.
It is not only to find the common question yet also to find the correct answer in a way that would work out in every situation without severly changing the underlying philosphy of SUSE and YaST. It has become a tedious job and drifted away from staying an enjoyable hobby. Another aspect is my personal life and the amount of time I can devote to the project has become limited. After so many years, I have become a a student again and I have to put some effort into studying. One can say my priorities have shifted a little bit.
I thought that was the case, as we didn't hear from you.
Nevertheless, I do not like to leave things unfinished and I am doing a major rewrite of the SuSEfirewall howto. What happens after this rewrite I can not say.
Mmm. Then, probably the ongoing translation is almost useless: superseded or obsolete, at least. Anyway, I have no more chapters to translate, unless I take over some files that have not progressed in a long time. See if you can check your email there, ein? :-) -- Cheers, Carlos Robinson
Op woensdag 20 april 2005 16:41, schreef Carlos E. R.:
There were occasions where sompe people did send either as an article or a more like a answer as a a collabration, yet the majority of the work turned out to be my digging out the mailing list to find the common questions and the replies to them.
Yes, I sent you one or two howtos, I think. I could adapt some of my longs emails, if the subject is interesting enough to expand into a micro-howto, on request.
What I happen to do sometimes these days; I write the explanation in the wiki first and sent the url of the wiki. That works very efficient (although a raw email is composed quicker than a nice looking wiki page). -- Richard Bos Without a home the journey is endless
participants (10)
-
Carlos E. R. -
Damon Register -
James Wright -
Kevin Donnelly -
Mike McMullin -
radoeka -
Randall R Schulz -
Richard Bos
-
Theo v. Werkhoven -
Togan Muftuoglu