On 12/22/2009 07:00 PM, Stan Goodman pecked at the keyboard and wrote:

At 00:39:18 on Wednesday Wednesday 23 December 2009, "Ken Schneider - openSUSE" wrote:

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On 12/22/2009 04:49 PM, Stan Goodman pecked at the keyboard and wrote:

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Until now, I have been using my notebook machine with a wired connection to a router. Today I tried to use its wireless controller (Intel 5300), but failed.

The controller is recognized by openSuSE, and I was able to configure it (I don't swear that I configured it correctly). Since it was seen without any action from me, apparently its driver is also in the kernel. But I was surprised that I didn't have to apply the firmware to it; I don't see how YaST could have managed that; perhaps that's why I have not been able to reach the network through this interface.

The configuration screen contained many more options than what I see in the Network Services screens, and I don't know how to find those configuration screens so I could post here what I did at that stage, the details of which I do not remember entirely.

Help?

Let's cover some of the obvious.

Correct SSID set Correct auth type set and passwd.

Those were points that I left empty, hoping to come back to them. But I don't see how to find where they are.

Meaning you don't know what they are or where they are set in the wireless router. Unless you set these values your wireless _will not_ work.

What I didn't understand about SSID is that all the elements in a net must share the identical one. But in a laptop machine with DCHP, and used for travel and expected to work with arbitrary networks of which I am not the administrator, what SSID must I set?

The one that is correct for the network you are on, and yes each network is different.

...

Unless these are set correct it won't work period.

-- Ken Schneider SuSe since Version 5.2, June 1998

-- Ken Schneider SuSe since Version 5.2, June 1998 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

At 02:10:42 on Wednesday Wednesday 23 December 2009, "Ken Schneider - openSUSE" wrote:

On 12/22/2009 07:00 PM, Stan Goodman pecked at the keyboard and wrote:

...

At 00:39:18 on Wednesday Wednesday 23 December 2009, "Ken Schneider -

openSUSE" wrote:

...

On 12/22/2009 04:49 PM, Stan Goodman pecked at the keyboard and wrote:

...

Until now, I have been using my notebook machine with a wired connection to a router. Today I tried to use its wireless controller (Intel 5300), but failed.

The controller is recognized by openSuSE, and I was able to configure it (I don't swear that I configured it correctly). Since it was seen without any action from me, apparently its driver is also in the kernel. But I was surprised that I didn't have to apply the firmware to it; I don't see how YaST could have managed that; perhaps that's why I have not been able to reach the network through this interface.

The configuration screen contained many more options than what I see in the Network Services screens, and I don't know how to find those configuration screens so I could post here what I did at that stage, the details of which I do not remember entirely.

Help?

Let's cover some of the obvious.

Correct SSID set Correct auth type set and passwd.

Those were points that I left empty, hoping to come back to them. But I don't see how to find where they are.

Meaning you don't know what they are or where they are set in the wireless router.

I know what the SSDI is in the router; I have verified it by opening the router's configuration in its web server. I left it blank in the WiFi card's configuration because I wasn't sure how to handle it in the case of access to networks other than my own. I have gone through this with another laptop machine (now deceased), but I don't remember what I did then. And now that the card's configuration dialog is gone, I don't find how to bring it back, or where to enter the missing items. In the configuration, I set authorization type to "Managed". I configured with ifup, but it is set now for Network Manager. The LAN is not set for either WEP or WPA; neither is necessary in my situation.

Unless you set these values your wireless _will not_ work.

...

What I didn't understand about SSID is that all the elements in a net must share the identical one. But in a laptop machine with DCHP, and used for travel and expected to work with arbitrary networks of which I am not the administrator, what SSID must I set?

The one that is correct for the network you are on, and yes each network is different.

...

...

Unless these are set correct it won't work period.

-- Ken Schneider SuSe since Version 5.2, June 1998

-- Ken Schneider SuSe since Version 5.2, June 1998

-- Stan Goodman Qiryat Tiv'on Israel -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

At 15:20:29 on Wednesday Wednesday 23 December 2009, James Knott wrote:

Stan Goodman wrote:

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I know what the SSDI is in the router; I have verified it by opening the router's configuration in its web server. I left it blank in the WiFi card's configuration because I wasn't sure how to handle it in the case of access to networks other than my own. I have gone through this with another laptop machine (now deceased), but I don't remember what I did then. And now that the card's configuration dialog is gone, I don't find how to bring it back, or where to enter the missing items.

When you use KNetworkManager, you can configure several different connections, each with it's own SSID.

"KNetworkManager" is an unrecognized command. Software Manager returns "No Results". I have the usual repos installed; where is it? -- Stan Goodman Qiryat Tiv'on Israel -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Wednesday 23 December 2009 15:35:47 Teruel de Campo MD wrote:

On Wed, 2009-12-23 at 16:24 +0200, Stan Goodman wrote:

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"KNetworkManager" is an unrecognized command. Software Manager returns "No Results". I have the usual repos installed; where is it?

I can run it with from a terminal by typing knetworkmanager or choose it from the serach on kde4 by clicking the kmenu and typing knetworkmanager into the search field. L x -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Stan Goodman said the following on 12/23/2009 11:46 AM:

At 17:12:54 on Wednesday Wednesday 23 December 2009, lynn wrote:

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On Wednesday 23 December 2009 15:35:47 Teruel de Campo MD wrote:

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On Wed, 2009-12-23 at 16:24 +0200, Stan Goodman wrote:

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"KNetworkManager" is an unrecognized command. Software Manager returns "No Results". I have the usual repos installed; where is it?

I can run it with from a terminal by typing knetworkmanager or choose it from the serach on kde4 by clicking the kmenu and typing knetworkmanager into the search field. L x

I wish I could say the same. Obviously, that was how I tried to run it. When I do so as normal user, it tells me "No such file or directory". When as root, it doesn't even tell me that, but just puts up the prompt again. I couldn't belief that such a command would be only for root, but I wanted to try just in case. Nothing is impossible.

And when you run a 'ps' is it listed there? My expereince -I run KDE4.3.1 - is that /usr/bin/knetworkmanager runs somewhere in the background d I have an icon in my toobar that I right-click on to get the GUI to control it. So: what the important question is: DO YOU HAVE THE ICON ON YOUR TOOLBAR? I not then lets work backwards from there Oh, you do have it installed, don't you? # rpm -q -a | grep -i networkmanager That should give you the package, the libraries, the KDE layer, the KDE libraries, the KDE language pack and perhaps a proxy package. -- Those who wish to seek out the cause of miracles, and to understand the things of nature as philosophers, and not to stare at them in astonishment like fools, are soon considered heretical and impious,and proclaimed as such by those whom the mob adores as the interpreters of nature and the gods. For these men know that once ignorance is put aside that wonderment would be taken away which is the only means by which their authority is preserved. --Spinoza -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

At 17:00:39 on Wednesday Wednesday 23 December 2009, James Knott wrote:

Stan Goodman wrote:

...

At 15:20:29 on Wednesday Wednesday 23 December 2009, James Knott

wrote:

...

Stan Goodman wrote:

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I know what the SSDI is in the router; I have verified it by opening the router's configuration in its web server. I left it blank in the WiFi card's configuration because I wasn't sure how to handle it in the case of access to networks other than my own. I have gone through this with another laptop machine (now deceased), but I don't remember what I did then. And now that the card's configuration dialog is gone, I don't find how to bring it back, or where to enter the missing items.

When you use KNetworkManager, you can configure several different connections, each with it's own SSID.

"KNetworkManager" is an unrecognized command. Software Manager returns "No Results". I have the usual repos installed; where is it?

I believe you mentioned you're running KDE. The package name is NetworkManager-kde. You should be able to install it. When installed, there should be a gray globe icon on your task bar, when unconnected. The icon changes to a bar graph, when connected via WiFi and what appears to be a USB plug, when connected via ethernet. KNetworkManager will allow you to configure several connections, both WiFi and ethernet. I use it on my ThinkPad in OpenSUSE 11.0 and it works fairly well.

I couldn't have guessed the package name. Thank you. YaST says it is installed. It also mentions that it contains KNetworkManager. Why does the system not recognize it from the CLI? -- Stan Goodman Qiryat Tiv'on Israel -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

At 17:00:39 on Wednesday Wednesday 23 December 2009, James Knott wrote:

Stan Goodman wrote:

...

At 15:20:29 on Wednesday Wednesday 23 December 2009, James Knott

wrote:

...

Stan Goodman wrote:

...

I know what the SSDI is in the router; I have verified it by opening the router's configuration in its web server. I left it blank in the WiFi card's configuration because I wasn't sure how to handle it in the case of access to networks other than my own. I have gone through this with another laptop machine (now deceased), but I don't remember what I did then. And now that the card's configuration dialog is gone, I don't find how to bring it back, or where to enter the missing items.

When you use KNetworkManager, you can configure several different connections, each with it's own SSID.

"KNetworkManager" is an unrecognized command. Software Manager returns "No Results". I have the usual repos installed; where is it?

I believe you mentioned you're running KDE. The package name is NetworkManager-kde. You should be able to install it. When installed, there should be a gray globe icon on your task bar, when unconnected. The icon changes to a bar graph, when connected via WiFi and what appears to be a USB plug, when connected via ethernet. KNetworkManager will allow you to configure several connections, both WiFi and ethernet. I use it on my ThinkPad in OpenSUSE 11.0 and it works fairly well.

Writing it in all lower case, and connecting the blue-grey blob withyour description, I can see that knetworkmanager is present in the tray. It is called "Active" in the balloon when I float the cursor over it. The "Select Wireless Network" sees my router (it tells me what its SSDI is), and notes "52%" although the distance between the two is about two meters. And I can now access the 'Net through the card. I notice that it was not necesssary for me to enter the SSDI in the initial configuration, which is what I thought from the beginning that I remembered. The card detects SSDI from available signals. Many thanks, James and everyone else. -- Stan Goodman Qiryat Tiv'on Israel -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Stan Goodman wrote:

At 15:20:29 on Wednesday Wednesday 23 December 2009, James Knott wrote:

...

... When you use KNetworkManager, you can configure several different connections, each with it's own SSID.

"KNetworkManager" is an unrecognized command. Software Manager returns "No Results". I have the usual repos installed; where is it?

Stan, that is an error. The name of the program is knetworkmanager. All lower case. John Perry -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

At 16:28:19 on Wednesday Wednesday 23 December 2009, "Ken Schneider - openSUSE" wrote:

On 12/23/2009 05:16 AM, Stan Goodman pecked at the keyboard and wrote:

...

At 02:10:42 on Wednesday Wednesday 23 December 2009, "Ken Schneider -

openSUSE" wrote:

...

On 12/22/2009 07:00 PM, Stan Goodman pecked at the keyboard and wrote:

...

At 00:39:18 on Wednesday Wednesday 23 December 2009, "Ken Schneider -

openSUSE" wrote:

...

On 12/22/2009 04:49 PM, Stan Goodman pecked at the keyboard and

wrote:

...

...

...

...

Until now, I have been using my notebook machine with a wired connection to a router. Today I tried to use its wireless controller (Intel 5300), but failed.

The controller is recognized by openSuSE, and I was able to configure it (I don't swear that I configured it correctly). Since it was seen without any action from me, apparently its driver is also in the kernel. But I was surprised that I didn't have to apply the firmware to it; I don't see how YaST could have managed that; perhaps that's why I have not been able to reach the network through this interface.

The configuration screen contained many more options than what I see in the Network Services screens, and I don't know how to find those configuration screens so I could post here what I did at that stage, the details of which I do not remember entirely.

Help?

Let's cover some of the obvious.

Correct SSID set Correct auth type set and passwd.

Those were points that I left empty, hoping to come back to them. But I don't see how to find where they are.

Meaning you don't know what they are or where they are set in the wireless router.

Previous sentence should have ended with a question mark, sorry.

No problem. I understood the intent.

...

I know what the SSID is in the router; I have verified it by opening the router's configuration in its web server. I left it blank in the WiFi card's configuration because I wasn't sure how to handle it in the case of access to networks other than my own. I have gone through this with another laptop machine (now deceased), but I don't remember what I did then. And now that the card's configuration dialog is gone, I don't find how to bring it back, or where to enter the missing items.

In the configuration, I set authorization type to "Managed". I configured with ifup, but it is set now for Network Manager.

As James has pointed out you will need to use NetworkManager to configure the connection. Perhaps it works now and is reliable. In the past it has been a pain in the ass to get working and keep working. Well at least at home where I have network ID broadcast turned off.

As I've said, after I configured the card with ifup, I switched to Network Manager. I understand from James that the way to configure Network Manager is with KNetworkManager (is there no other way>). But KNetworkManager seems to be an unknown command and YaST claims it knows nothing about it. How do I get it?

...

The LAN is not set for either WEP or WPA; neither is necessary in my situation.

OK, you will still need to set the SSID to connect to the network. -- Ken Schneider SuSe since Version 5.2, June 1998

-- Stan Goodman Qiryat Tiv'on Israel -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Stan Goodman wrote:

As I've said, after I configured the card with ifup, I switched to Network Manager. I understand from James that the way to configure Network Manager is with KNetworkManager (is there no other way>). But KNetworkManager seems to be an unknown command and YaST claims it knows nothing about it. How do I get it?

In Yast > Software Management, search on "NetworkManager-kde", with either summary or description checked. You should then be able to install it. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Thu, Dec 24, 2009 at 12:35 PM, G T Smith wrote:

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Stan Goodman wrote:

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The LAN is not set for either WEP or WPA; neither is necessary in my situation.

The only situation where this is possibly a valid assumption is if and only if you are living in the middle of a desert without any external network connection. Otherwise this is the equivalent of leaving your credit card and password on your doorstop with a 'please take me' sign!

Not necessarily. This is what Bruce Schneier wrote two years ago (and he knows a thing or two about security): http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2008/01/my_open_wireles.html Regards, -- Mark Goldstein -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Thu, Dec 24, 2009 at 1:30 PM, G T Smith wrote:

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Mark Goldstein wrote:

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On Thu, Dec 24, 2009 at 12:35 PM, G T Smith wrote:

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Stan Goodman wrote:

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The LAN is not set for either WEP or WPA; neither is necessary in my situation.

The only situation where this is possibly a valid assumption is if and only if you are living in the middle of a desert without any external network connection. Otherwise this is the equivalent of leaving your credit card and password on your doorstop with a 'please take me' sign!

Not necessarily. This is what Bruce Schneier wrote two years ago (and he knows a thing or two about security):

http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2008/01/my_open_wireles.html

Things have moved on a bit in in 2 years, and many of the assumptions made in this article are no longer valid if they were ever viable in the first place.

Unfortunately, the belief that being nice and offering the service for free is a good thing does not stand up for long when people have to pick up the bill for the services used, and the liability for the activities of those who use the service.

Well, I just said there might be different approaches. I also keep my WiFi router encrypted and still prefer not to use it for important things. But this is the opinion of an expert (and he re-cited it not once later). Regards, -- Mark Goldstein -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

At 12:35:58 on Thursday Thursday 24 December 2009, G T Smith wrote:

Stan Goodman wrote:

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The LAN is not set for either WEP or WPA; neither is necessary in my situation.

The only situation where this is possibly a valid assumption is if and only if you are living in the middle of a desert without any external network connection. Otherwise this is the equivalent of leaving your credit card and password on your doorstop with a 'please take me' sign!

This is, in fact, what I have told my friend, who lives in a house surrounded by other computer users and very close to the street. I, on the other hand, am surrounded by the homes of elderly folk who are afraid of computers, and am far from the street, so "drive-by" hacking would be difficult. We are talking several hundred meters. In addition to all that, my home is built of concrete blocks, like virtually all buildings in this country (in which lumber has to be imported at some expense), and I can't detect my router even from directly outside the building; I doubt that the card has more juice than the router. The easiest way to intrude into my WiFi card would be to hover over the house in a helicopter -- the roof is my Achilles heel. -- Stan Goodman Qiryat Tiv'on Israel -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Stan Goodman wrote:

At 00:39:18 on Wednesday Wednesday 23 December 2009, "Ken Schneider - ...

...

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Help? Let's cover some of the obvious.

Correct SSID set Correct auth type set and passwd. ...

Besides Ken's and Nkoli's correct comments, I found that when I was using 10.3 and 11.0, I had to set the authorization type to "managed", even though my home network was "Ad hoc", or it would refuse to let me put in my WPA2-PSK information. I just discovered accidentally a few days ago that NetworkManager will now let me set these parameters even in "Ad hoc" mode, which solved the last of my wifi problems (I had to reconnect manually each time I shut down the computer). kde 4.3 is now handling my networking quite well. John Perry -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

At 05:25:23 on Wednesday Wednesday 23 December 2009, James Knott wrote:

Stan Goodman wrote:

...

...

Let's cover some of the obvious.

Correct SSID set Correct auth type set and passwd.

Those were points that I left empty, hoping to come back to them. But I don't see how to find where they are.

What I didn't understand about SSID is that all the elements in a net must share the identical one. But in a laptop machine with DCHP, and used for travel and expected to work with arbitrary networks of which I am not the administrator, what SSID must I set?

The SSID is the WiFi network name. If you don't have one that matches the WiFi router or access point you will not be able to connect. Are you using your own router/access point? Or at work or other? Can you see any WiFi activity with KNetworkManager? The other items mentioned are for encryption. If you're trying to connect to an existing WiFi network, you'll need those. If your own, initially configure for no encryption, to verify you can connect. Also, pick a name for the SSID. The DHCP stuff comes in after the WiFi connection is made. Once you have a connection, you can enable security. WPA2 is preferred. You can get a 63 random character string, for a password, from here: https://www.grc.com/passwords.htm Choose the alpha numeric string to avoid problems with some devices that choke on certain characters.

I did not set an SSID in the wireless card, but left that rubric empty. Once I got it rhrough my head what to look for after loading knetworkmanager, I was immediately able to see the router, which announced its own SSID, which I recognized. Once I clicked on it, I was able to communicate with the 'Net. To repeat, I did not write an SSID in the wireless card's configuration. Now that I see all this, I recall that this configuration was exactly what I had done years ago in OS/2; my confusion now has been because my memory didn't serve me well. I apologize. As for security, I can contribute an anecdote about a remarkable stupidity here. A novice friend had a wireless network installed in his home. The telephone company did that for him, and sold him the wireless router. (I didn't go that route.) The following day he told me that when he fired his machine up, he was able to see his router, but it was listed three times, not once, with three different signal strengths. Explanation: The telephone company gives the same SSID to all the routers that they deploy in peoples' homes, and the spurious signals were those of his neighbor on the right and the one on the left. They also fail to install WEP or WPA, despite the fact that this is a country of mostly multiple dwellings and apartment houses. He and I have single dwellings, but I'm sure that there are many people who can't be sure through whose account they are accessing the 'Net. There should be a group rate for such cases, like with hospitalization, but there isn't. -- Stan Goodman Qiryat Tiv'on Israel -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

At 17:48:55 on Thursday Thursday 24 December 2009, James Knott wrote:

Stan Goodman wrote:

...

I did not set an SSID in the wireless card, but left that rubric empty. Once I got it rhrough my head what to look for after loading knetworkmanager, I was immediately able to see the router, which announced its own SSID, which I recognized. Once I clicked on it, I was able to communicate with the 'Net. To repeat, I did not write an SSID in the wireless card's configuration. Now that I see all this, I recall that this configuration was exactly what I had done years ago in OS/2; my confusion now has been because my memory didn't serve me well. I apologize.

When you use KNetworkManager, it can get the SSID from the signal, as you discovered.

...

As for security, I can contribute an anecdote about a remarkable stupidity here. A novice friend had a wireless network installed in his home. The telephone company did that for him, and sold him the wireless router. (I didn't go that route.) The following day he told me that when he fired his machine up, he was able to see his router, but it was listed three times, not once, with three different signal strengths. Explanation: The telephone company gives the same SSID to all the routers that they deploy in peoples' homes, and the spurious signals were those of his neighbor on the right and the one on the left. They also fail to install WEP or WPA, despite the fact that this is a country of mostly multiple dwellings and apartment houses. He and I have single dwellings, but I'm sure that there are many people who can't be sure through whose account they are accessing the 'Net. There should be a group rate for such cases, like with hospitalization, but there isn't.

Whoever did that is incompetent. They left everyone with wide open access to their computers. I hope you changed that.

Of course they are incompetent, they work for the telephone company. Change it? I fixed my friend's network, and remark about it to somebody in the TP Business Office, but of course they think I am a crank, so they ignore it. Same thing happened years ago when OS/2 hadn't yet found a way to work against PPtP, which is what the telephone company uses for Internet. (I think only us and the Netherlands uses it.) Their answer to my statement that I did not have Windows was to sneer and answer that I was talking foolishness, because "Every computer has Windows". That wouldn't happen today, of course. -- Stan Goodman Qiryat Tiv'on Israel -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org