-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Content-ID: The Monday 2008-07-14 at 13:46 +0200, Will Stephenson wrote:

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...

care for it. Apparently, and I'm a LiveCD building noob, it's easier than falling out of bed, but it might not seem like that, looking in. Any takers? (Answers to opensuse-kde@opensuse.org - reply-to: is set).

I don't usually use lives, but I guess many people would like that live. There was an attempt here to make that live but we didn't know how to make it.

I forwarded your email to the Spanish list, too.

Can you make it to the KDE meeting next week at 2000 CEST to discuss this further - we can help you get over the problems that you had earlier.

It was Larry Stotler who tried. Let me see if I can find the thread... here: http://lists.opensuse.org/opensuse/2008-06/msg01633.html * [opensuse] How to create CD install media?, Larry Stotler (18 June, 2008) http://lists.opensuse.org/opensuse-factory/2008-06/msg00765.html * [opensuse-factory] Why no KDE3 LiveCD?, Larry Stotler (22 June, 2008)

(please also forward to the Spanish list, no hablo mucho español ;))

Done :-) - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.4-svn0 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFIe0zztTMYHG2NR9URAouQAJwKzGSzhaqSXXpQBQy+NTsg9etJVgCeNmya Zh1LarssKUSTpv3ZgM+BPiE= =Xkzx -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

On Thursday 10 July 2008 15:25:50 Larry Stotler wrote:

On Wed, Jul 9, 2008 at 4:02 PM, Will Stephenson wrote:

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I've been reading the various KDE 3/4 threads on this list and would like to gauge the demand for a KDE 3.5.x based openSUSE LiveCD. My aim is to see if it's worth doing and then to form the germ of a group to build and care for it. Apparently, and I'm a LiveCD building noob, it's easier than falling out of bed, but it might not seem like that, looking in. Any takers? (Answers to opensuse-kde@opensuse.org - reply-to: is set).

All for it. Either that, or a stripped down KDE4 that looks and works more like KDE3.

Having tried to install from the KDE4 liveCD, I was unable to remove KDE4 and replace it with KDE3 without dependency hell.

I would definately be willing to help out in any way I can - like testing.

Great. Can you attend next week's KDE IRC meeting? (http://en.opensuse.org/KDE/Meetings) and we'll soon find ways for you to help. If the time doesn't fit, shout and we'll set something else up. regards Will -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Will Stephenson pecked at the keyboard and wrote:

On Monday 14 July 2008 13:47:59 Will Stephenson wrote:

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Great. Can you attend next week's KDE IRC meeting?

...

(http://en.opensuse.org/KDE/Meetings) and we'll soon find ways for you to

...

help. If the time doesn't fit, shout and we'll set something else up.

We're not seeing much interest in this other than from Larry - anyone else who would use/like a LiveCD lurking on the list?

Will

I would be more inclined to give a friend a live CD with KDE 3.5.x and I will NOT hand out one with KDE 4.x to anyone but an enemy. -- Ken Schneider SuSe since Version 5.2, June 1998 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Ken Schneider wrote:

Will Stephenson pecked at the keyboard and wrote:

...

On Monday 14 July 2008 13:47:59 Will Stephenson wrote:

...

Great. Can you attend next week's KDE IRC meeting?

...

(http://en.opensuse.org/KDE/Meetings) and we'll soon find ways for you to

...

help. If the time doesn't fit, shout and we'll set something else up.

We're not seeing much interest in this other than from Larry - anyone else who would use/like a LiveCD lurking on the list?

Will

I would be more inclined to give a friend a live CD with KDE 3.5.x and I will NOT hand out one with KDE 4.x to anyone but an enemy.

You got it! Fred -- This message originated from a Linux computer using Open Source software: openSuSE Linux 11.0 No Gates, no Windows....just Linux - STABLE & SECURE! -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

John Andersen wrote:

..

I think everyone expects it was comming and saw no need to respond. I'd like a live CD of 3, but would be willing to wait till 3.5.10 is out.

For once, Will, I'm dead on with John. I've never had occasion to use a live cd, but if I did, I would make sure it did not include kde4 until some time after 4 had been pretty well wrung out. There are several of us who tried kde4 and went back to kde3 because it's simply not up to a level we can use. I would imagine there are quite a few who, like me, have no use for a live cd except to show windows- or mac-centric friends how good linux can be. If I can't feel confident using it myself, how could I show it to a friend as an improvement over what he already knows and probably likes? John Perry -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Thursday 2008-07-17 at 17:51 -0400, Greg Freemyer wrote:

A month ago there was an active demand for a install CD for OS11 / KDE 3.5. I don't know where those users disappeared to.

That's was mostly Larry and a few others trying to help. - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.4-svn0 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFIf8gYtTMYHG2NR9URAq/kAJ9AmTOx6aSALAO1GKXF/QulMvlQ7QCdEOrN 6N4Cs7yFOtRIkZ3r8CcAZSM= =aRJq -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Thu, Jul 17, 2008 at 2:44 PM, John E. Perry wrote:

I would imagine there are quite a few who, like me, have no use for a live cd except to show windows- or mac-centric friends how good linux can be.

I enjoy copying them, running off to best buy / circuit city / Fry's and inserting them in vista machines and then power cycling the machines. You would be surprised how many of these are set to boot from the CDrom. If it works I leave it there for others to try. -- ----------JSA--------- Sig line deleted for the humor impaired. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Will Stephenson a écrit :

We're not seeing much interest in this other than from Larry - anyone else who would use/like a LiveCD lurking on the list?

I would be interested by a way to install from cd on low end computer without network. if the kde3 cd asks for less memory than mde4, yes. but simply having the install option on the boot menu should be good (when the live don't run) jdd -- Jean-Daniel Dodin Président du CULTe www.culte.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Carlos E. R. a écrit :

personally am interested in learning how to create a custom install CD, like a text mode minimal install in one CD.

I probably don't have the need to learn howto do it (the present wiki information is too hard for me), but I could use it daily! my LUG uses second hand computers, 8 years old (and perfectly working), so a minimal cd should be a must. exactly the day I had to make an install, an ethernet cable choosed to fail, and I had no Internet. My city feast place don't have net, so when I have to make some sort of demo, I'm stuck jdd -- Jean-Daniel Dodin Président du CULTe www.culte.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Fri, Jul 18, 2008 at 5:18 AM, Will Stephenson wrote:

Ok, this is the situation: We (the KDE team at SUSE) won't produce a KDE 3 liveCD ourselves - no time. We will however impart the skills and information needed to do so to anyone who wants to, support them in maintaining it, and host the resulting images. It is a non-programming task, it just requires as much common sense as is needed to keep your normal openSUSE install ticking over. We're flexible in how to provide this knowledge - the IRC meeting is just the obvious venue.

I realize that KDE4 is the next new thing, but having used KDE3 since 2001, I'm probaby just gonna be stubborn about it. I'm also looking to lean down openSUSE. It's getting pretty bloated for my low memory systems. As I said before, I won't be able to do the IRC. Sorry, but my son is pushing to be playing in the ways at that point.

Larry is most willing to put time into this so I suggest he contacts me directly with a time/place to kick this off. Carlos would like the skills, can you and the Spanish list people to do the same and I will coordinate. Mi espanol es muy feo pero trato a hablarlo*.

I can put some time in it starting next month. This month is booked up. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Mon, Jul 14, 2008 at 7:47 AM, Will Stephenson wrote:

On Thursday 10 July 2008 15:25:50 Larry Stotler wrote:

...

All for it. Either that, or a stripped down KDE4 that looks and works more like KDE3.

Having tried to install from the KDE4 liveCD, I was unable to remove KDE4 and replace it with KDE3 without dependency hell.

I would definately be willing to help out in any way I can - like testing.

Great. Can you attend next week's KDE IRC meeting? (http://en.opensuse.org/KDE/Meetings) and we'll soon find ways for you to help. If the time doesn't fit, shout and we'll set something else up.

No. I don't have an irc account(nor do I use any IM or even text messaging on my cell phone - I have unlimited minutes, I call people). Further, I hope to be at the beach with my son during that meeting, but please go ahead and let those guys know that: 1. I would definately support a KDE3 LiveCD until KDE4 is fully matured(hopefully by 4.2). What amazes me is that these guys should know that especially businesses don't just upgrade like this. They want a full working system. Basically why we have avoided Vista like the plague. While I don't administer a linux setup, I am going to install a Linux server and workstation(probable 2-3) at the company I just joined to make things much easier than how they are doing it now, and I don't have time to reconfig KDE4 to work like i need it. 2. I will be willing to test it out on i386, x96-64, and PPC. I don't program, but I will help anyway i can. 3. That I realize that KDE4 is the future, but there is still a lot of life left in KDE3. KDE4 is a work in progress. When it's much more complete(not done mind you) compared to KDE3, I will move toward it. Till then, I don't have a lot of time to work with it. Time is money at my job, and that's the last place I have time to have to make things work. Getting machines fixed and customers happy is what pays the bills. Thanx -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Friday 2008-07-18 at 11:57 +0200, Philipp Thomas wrote:

* Larry Stotler () [20080718 01:11]:

...

No. I don't have an irc account(nor do I use any IM or even text messaging on my cell phone - I have unlimited minutes, I call people).

You don't need an account for for the IRC channels.

There are people, like me, that don't even know what IRC is. O:-) My ADSL connection is relatively recent, so if irc is some chat thing it has never interested me. I still don't like chat things, never used one. I don't know what it is, how to use it, netiquete for that method... whatever. - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.4-svn0 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFIgGtEtTMYHG2NR9URAhRRAJ9rUhG9b2Gr1sgZLTSYkj1pZCW7ngCfcMgl kY6va1PF2K3JfZK42DLgUqE= =vg8r -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Fri, Jul 18, 2008 at 6:06 AM, Carlos E. R. wrote:

There are people, like me, that don't even know what IRC is. O:-)

IIRC, IRC (:-) stands for Internet Relay Chat, which is probably the granddaddy

My ADSL connection is relatively recent, so if irc is some chat thing it has never interested me. I still don't like chat things, never used one. I don't know what it is, how to use it, netiquete for that method... whatever.

Same here. I guess I'm too old(or too stubborn - probably stubborn since I'm only 34) to find much benefit in all these new modes of communication, at least at the prices they are costing now. 10 years ago I had unlimited text messages for $2/mn. Now it's 10???? Whatever. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

----- Original Message ----- From: "Carlos E. R." To: "OS-en" Sent: Friday, July 18, 2008 6:06 AM Subject: Re: [opensuse] Demand for a KDE 3 LiveCD?

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The Friday 2008-07-18 at 11:57 +0200, Philipp Thomas wrote:

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* Larry Stotler () [20080718 01:11]:

...

No. I don't have an irc account(nor do I use any IM or even text messaging on my cell phone - I have unlimited minutes, I call people).

You don't need an account for for the IRC channels.

There are people, like me, that don't even know what IRC is. O:-)

My ADSL connection is relatively recent, so if irc is some chat thing it has never interested me. I still don't like chat things, never used one. I don't know what it is, how to use it, netiquete for that method... whatever.

IRC is a chat thing, but it's about as old as telnet. I don't frequentchat rooms in general, per se, yet, I do have one that I have been a regular in with a bunch of other like-minded Spider Robinson loving souls for .. gosh 13 or 14 years. Chat does not equal 13 year old kids, OMG LOL wtfbbq? unless you go to chat rooms with 13 year old kids. For that matter, the one I frequent sometimes has a few of those, but only the natural proportion that _should_ be in any random group of people. Often it's one of the regular's kids and as such, more interesting to converse with than most adults anyways. Like anything else, it's not intrinsicly worthy or unworthy. It's just a thing that has it's place and it's uses, no more no less. -- Brian K. White brian@aljex.com http://www.myspace.com/KEYofR +++++[>+++[>+++++>+++++++<<-]<-]>>+.>.+++++.+++++++.-.[>+<---]>++. filePro BBx Linux SCO FreeBSD #callahans Satriani Filk! -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

----- Original Message ----- From: "Carlos E. R." To: "OS-en" Sent: Saturday, July 19, 2008 6:56 AM Subject: Re: [opensuse] Demand for a KDE 3 LiveCD?

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The Friday 2008-07-18 at 19:48 -0400, Brian K. White wrote:

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IRC is a chat thing, but it's about as old as telnet.

Is it? The program "chat" is a console thing and is very old, but I doubt that IRC is as old as that. That's the only chat I have ever used, the *nix chat on my own or friend's computers. Now, I do have "xchat". Is that for IRC?

xchat is for irc, but before there were gui irc clients there were text ones. The oldest is "ircii" (irc 2, meaning there was I guess a "irc" even before that.) And, before there were official irc clients, the protocol itself is theoreticaly doable directly by a human using merely a telnet client, like most of the other the oldest protocols. These days you couldn't do the protocol directly using just a telnet client or even a simpler connector like netcat, but that is merely because the servers all have a lot more users, channels, features, and traffic. Yes talk is older than irc, since it works between users of/on a single host, whereas irc is "internet relay chat" implying it requiers "internet", but, so did telnet, so comparing to talk isn't relevant to my assertion that it's almost as old as telnet. These days I'd recommend bitchx for a text client and xchat for gui, and really, as much as I like text versions of anything possible, irc really is easiest to deal with in gui, in xchat specifically.

...

I don't frequentchat rooms in general, per se, yet, I do have one that I have been a regular in with a bunch of other like-minded Spider Robinson loving souls for .. gosh 13 or 14 years.

I don't know what a chat room is... O:-)

I have a guess, though. Wikipedia time...

Honestly, as much as I'm trying to point out that theres really nothing new or bad about irc in itself, still, I wouldn't say you are exactly missing the boat on one of trhe great things in life. The sunshine beats it every time. Hell so does rain, I like rain. Perversely, having said that, many of my ultimate best realest truest family-in-all-but-name friends are from that chat room, so have 3 different girlfriends, so, who knows. I'm not sure I could have met the same number of the same quality of people any other way. Maybe I'd be happier, or maybe I'd have just learned to live with what was available. I don't think I could ever, under any circumstances, have been able to enjoy or fake enjoying such wonders as football or most other sports on tv. Playing them is fine, following teams and games on tv? *gag* never. So, that seems to be a pretty big part of everyones life that I see day to day. So I guess I'm pretty glad I was able to find a number of other outcasts to hang out with. BTW, we do actually hang out, irc is how we met, but having met, any of us who are near any others get together at various times for uh, get togethers. -- Brian K. White brian@aljex.com http://www.myspace.com/KEYofR +++++[>+++[>+++++>+++++++<<-]<-]>>+.>.+++++.+++++++.-.[>+<---]>++. filePro BBx Linux SCO FreeBSD #callahans Satriani Filk! -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Sat, Jul 19, 2008 at 11:04 AM, Carlos E. R. wrote:

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The Saturday 2008-07-19 at 09:56 -0400, Brian K. White wrote:

...

...

The Friday 2008-07-18 at 19:48 -0400, Brian K. White wrote:

...

IRC is a chat thing, but it's about as old as telnet.

Is it? The program "chat" is a console thing and is very old, but I doubt that IRC is as old as that. That's the only chat I have ever used, the *nix chat on my own or friend's computers. Now, I do have "xchat". Is that for IRC?

xchat is for irc, but before there were gui irc clients there were text ones. The oldest is "ircii" (irc 2, meaning there was I guess a "irc" even before that.) And, before there were official irc clients, the protocol itself is theoreticaly doable directly by a human using merely a telnet client, like most of the other the oldest protocols. These days you couldn't do the protocol directly using just a telnet client or even a simpler connector like netcat, but that is merely because the servers all have a lot more users, channels, features, and traffic.

Meanwhile, I've been having a look, and read part of a manual. I've tried "Konversation" and "xchat-gnome". I even connected to the #opensuse channel, though I didn't say a word (is that a lurker?). And... I can see it's uses, but I think it's not for me: even with little traffic it is an effort to keep track of the conversations. I prefer email, I can filter, browse, select, think out my response...

I might find out how to have private conversations, and maybe send files. That might become handy. Heh, a friend is trying to convince me to join yahoo, I might convince him instead to join irc >:-)

...

Yes talk is older than irc, since it works between users of/on a single host, whereas irc is "internet relay chat" implying it requiers "internet", but, so did telnet, so comparing to talk isn't relevant to my assertion that it's almost as old as telnet.

Ok :-)

...

These days I'd recommend bitchx for a text client and xchat for gui, and really, as much as I like text versions of anything possible, irc really is easiest to deal with in gui, in xchat specifically.

I saw there are dozens of clients.

...

...

...

I don't frequentchat rooms in general, per se, yet, I do have one that I > have been a regular in with a bunch of other like-minded Spider Robinson > loving souls for .. gosh 13 or 14 years.

I don't know what a chat room is... O:-)

I have a guess, though. Wikipedia time...

Honestly, as much as I'm trying to point out that theres really nothing new or bad about irc in itself, still, I wouldn't say you are exactly missing the boat on one of trhe great things in life. The sunshine beats it every time. Hell so does rain, I like rain.

As I live in the driest part of Spain, so yes, I do like rain, because we need more :-)

...

Perversely, having said that, many of my ultimate best realest truest family-in-all-but-name friends are from that chat room, so have 3 different girlfriends, so, who knows. I'm not sure I could have met the same number of the same quality of people any other way. Maybe I'd be happier, or maybe I'd have just learned to live with what was available. I don't think I could ever, under any circumstances, have been able to enjoy or fake enjoying such wonders as football or most other sports on tv. Playing them is fine, following teams and games on tv? *gag* never. So, that seems to be a pretty big part of everyones life that I see day to day. So I guess I'm pretty glad I was able to find a number of other outcasts to hang out with. BTW, we do actually hang out, irc is how we met, but having met, any of us who are near any others get together at various times for uh, get togethers.

Yep... reminds me of the getstogether ("quedadas" in Spanish) of the fidonet nodes we had not many years back... eating fried chicken and then doing weird things, like having a real test flight in an ultralight plane nearby... yep, interesting crowd :-)

(there was a chat mode in fidonet, in bbs, manual connection mode)

- -- Cheers, Carlos E. R.

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Maybe I'm just old-school - but I can't use any IRC client other than irssi. I tried xchat (gnome) and I've tried Konversation before as well - just seems like unnecessary bloat. -- -jayson -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

----- Original Message ----- From: "John Andersen" Cc: Sent: Saturday, July 19, 2008 3:21 PM Subject: Re: OT: irc, irc clients, sunshine. (was Re: [opensuse] Demand for a KDE 3 LiveCD?)

On Sat, Jul 19, 2008 at 6:56 AM, Brian K. White wrote:

...

Perversely, having said that, many of my ultimate best realest truest family-in-all-but-name friends are from that chat room, so have 3 different girlfriends, so, who knows. I'm not sure I could have met the same number of the same quality of people any other way. Maybe I'd be happier,

Maybe you should step away from the computer and go outside.

Wups, you went and made yourself look pretty stupid there, making suggestions on topics you have not the slightest clue about. tsk tsk. I know you're not so I guess it's just a slip, maybe a little tired, maybe been up too long at the computer... Ah projection! understandable. forgiven. Tell you what, if you ever find yourself in/near nj usa, I'll tell you where I'm playing next and you can gain the first teeniest bit of clue about my life away from the computer, and then you could begin to offer suggstions on that topic without sounding like an idiot automatically. -sigh- -- Brian K. White brian@aljex.com http://www.myspace.com/KEYofR +++++[>+++[>+++++>+++++++<<-]<-]>>+.>.+++++.+++++++.-.[>+<---]>++. filePro BBx Linux SCO FreeBSD #callahans Satriani Filk! -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org