Hello, everyone.
I have noticed a disturbing trend in recent weeks of
people begging for free
copies of our favourite distro. Is this beginning to wear a little thin for
anyone else, or am I just being mean ?
Flame away, my asbestos undies are firmly in place...
Bye for now, Stuart.
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No...not really. The professional version of SuSE 7.3 was released at £50.....by the time that goes down to a reasonable price to buy...the next version is more or less ready to be released. And as SuSE/Linux is GNU/GPL anyway...I say COPY COPY COPY away... --Thomas Adam the
archives at http://lists.suse.com
Thomas Adam
"The Linux Weekend Mechanic" --
That's ok! You go ahead and COPY COPY COPY right up to the point where SuSE can't get anymore infusions of Cash and bounce back into the red and then file chapter 11 and then fold up the shop and then NO MORE SUSE. But that's ok - cause you can do it! Just don't complain when you favorite distro goes belly up because it went broke. Oh, and if this occurs, I would mention this habit to anyone that might have made a living before said company folded. I don't think you'll make any friends that way. But like I said - go ahead - if you can do it why not? Cheers, Curtis :) On Friday 12 October 2001 10:58, THOMAS ADAM wrote:
Hello, everyone.
I have noticed a disturbing trend in recent weeks of
people begging for free
copies of our favourite distro. Is this beginning to
wear a little thin for
No...not really. The professional version of SuSE 7.3 was released at £50.....by the time that goes down to a reasonable price to buy...the next version is more or less ready to be released.
And as SuSE/Linux is GNU/GPL anyway...I say COPY COPY COPY away...
--Thomas Adam
anyone else, or am I just being mean ?
Flame away, my asbestos undies are firmly in place...
Bye for now, Stuart.
-- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-
unsubscribe@suse.com
For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-
help@suse.com
Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/support/faq and
the
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Thomas Adam "The Linux Weekend Mechanic" --
A Student at the "Southampton Institute", Southampton, Hants, ENGLAND
On Friday 12 October 2001 11:58 am, THOMAS ADAM wrote:
Hello, everyone.
I have noticed a disturbing trend in recent weeks of
people begging for free
copies of our favourite distro. Is this beginning to
wear a little thin for
No...not really. The professional version of SuSE 7.3 was released at £50.....by the time that goes down to a reasonable price to buy...the next version is more or less ready to be released.
And as SuSE/Linux is GNU/GPL anyway...I say COPY COPY COPY away...
--Thomas Adam
And when SuSE goes out of business? You'll just move on to the next distro I assume.
anyone else, or am I just being mean ?
Flame away, my asbestos undies are firmly in place...
Bye for now, Stuart.
-- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-
unsubscribe@suse.com
For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-
help@suse.com
Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/support/faq and
the
archives at http://lists.suse.com
Thomas Adam "The Linux Weekend Mechanic" --
A Student at the "Southampton Institute", Southampton, Hants, ENGLAND
-- +----------------------------------------------------------------------------+ + Bruce S. Marshall bmarsh@bmarsh.com Bellaire, MI 10/12/01 12:04 + +----------------------------------------------------------------------------+ Glendower: "I can call the spirits from the vasty deep."||Hotspur: "Why, so can I, or so can any man; But will they come when you do call for them?"| - William Shakespeare: Henry IV, Part I, act iii, scene i
On Fri, 12 Oct 2001, Bruce Marshall wrote:
On Friday 12 October 2001 11:58 am, THOMAS ADAM wrote:
Hello, everyone.
I have noticed a disturbing trend in recent weeks of
people begging for free
copies of our favourite distro. Is this beginning to
wear a little thin for
No...not really. The professional version of SuSE 7.3 was released at £50.....by the time that goes down to a reasonable price to buy...the next version is more or less ready to be released.
And as SuSE/Linux is GNU/GPL anyway...I say COPY COPY COPY away...
--Thomas Adam
And when SuSE goes out of business? You'll just move on to the next distro I assume.
Hmm, so lets think about this: SuSE sells it's professional edition for US$79.95. How many developer hours does that pay for? (Never mind CEO, Marketing, etc.) Like newspapers, broadcast television and colleges/universities, this is not where SuSE makes its money. (I recall the Treasurer of the Small But Lively Midwestern Liberal Arts College that I used to work for jumping up and down with glee when he finally got tuition to pay for a full 1/3 of the semester's operating budget!) SuSE makes its money through things like its firewall, its support contracts, its technical services consulting, and apparently by being a part of IBM's R&D division. It's not from distributing Linux, especially to private, individual users such as myself. If it was, that FTP site would be locked down tight. right? I think it's appropriate to spiff SuSE with a little cash now and again, but I don't think that SuSE is going to go out of business just because I miss paying for a release or two. Later, --Gregory -- "But Nat Wyeth lived in Cambridge, and in Cambridge the world has always seemed simpler, more high-minded and more amenable to reason that it proves to be when one goes out to mingle with the children of darkness." --Bernard DeVoto, "Across the Wide Missouri"
* Gregory Sawyer [Fri, 12 Oct 2001 16:39:22 -0700]:
Marketing, etc.) Like newspapers, broadcast television and colleges/universities, this is not where SuSE makes its money.
Wrong :) SuSE does make a substantial amount of money from selling the boxes.
and apparently by being a part of IBM's R&D division.
Where did you get that idea from? It's nowhere near reality!
but I don't think that SuSE is going to go out of business just because I miss paying for a release or two.
No, not because of you alone :) But if enough people think like this ..... Don't get me wrong. I'm not blaming anyone for taking an out time from updates. If I wouldn't get a copy for free, I most probably wouldn't buy every new version. Philipp -- "The idea that Bill Gates has appeared like a knight in shining armour to lead all customers out of a mire of technological chaos neatly ignores the fact that it was he who, by peddling second-rate technology, led them into it in the first place." - Douglas Adams in Guardian, 25-Aug-95
Thank you Phillip, Exactly my point in an earlier rebuttal. It's not to fly in the face of Osource or the F.S.F as much as it has to do with a business. I'm for the overridding concepts behind Osource and the F.S.F. However, "businesses" can't pay the bills under those paridigms. They have to adhere to the paradigms and realities of the market and business environment. I personally think that proper patronage includes kicking down the bucks for a product that is worth it. And, what bothers myself is that fact that a cummulative effect of "free" downloads can have a real impact on a company's bottom line. I guess all I'm trying to point out is a happy medium. Buy "1" boxed set of cd's and then burn dupes to your hears content. That way you can set up other businesses and a lan, etc... without have to pay a per seat license or whatever, and SuSE gets the initial monetary infusion (albeit small from a single sale - but cummulative none the less) that they are due. Just MHO, Cheers. Curtis On Saturday 13 October 2001 09:47, Philipp Thomas wrote:
* Gregory Sawyer [Fri, 12 Oct 2001 16:39:22 -0700]:
Marketing, etc.) Like newspapers, broadcast television and colleges/universities, this is not where SuSE makes its money.
Wrong :) SuSE does make a substantial amount of money from selling the boxes.
and apparently by being a part of IBM's R&D division.
Where did you get that idea from? It's nowhere near reality!
but I don't think that SuSE is going to go out of business just because I miss paying for a release or two.
No, not because of you alone :) But if enough people think like this .....
Don't get me wrong. I'm not blaming anyone for taking an out time from updates. If I wouldn't get a copy for free, I most probably wouldn't buy every new version.
Philipp
Hi
Don't get me wrong. I'm not blaming anyone for taking an out time from updates. If I wouldn't get a copy for free, I most probably wouldn't buy every new version.
I agree! I always buy the package just to support SuSE and get the manuals (and stickers!) Jaska.
Philipp
** On Sun, 14 Oct 2001 03:12:11 +0300 Jaakko Tamminen
--- jfweber@eternal.net wrote:
ps... to Suse Central Command. I'd love to be able to get extra copies of the stickers..
Damn! What is it about those bloody stickers?!?! People: get some Avery labels and an inkjet printer or something -- sheesh! :) (<me> Hi, my name is Jon, and I'm a sticker junkie. <group> Hi, Jon.) ===== -- -=|JP|=- Hit me! - http://www.xanga.com/cowboydren/ Jon Pennington | Debian 2.3 -o) cowboydren @ yahoo . com | Auto Enthusiast /\\ Kansas City, MO, USA | ICQ UIN 69 67 29 31 _\_V __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Make a great connection at Yahoo! Personals. http://personals.yahoo.com
* Jon Pennington (cowboydren@yahoo.com) [011013 12:52]: -> ->(<me> Hi, my name is Jon, and I'm a sticker junkie. <group> Hi, Jon.) -> You sucking on the pipe again..? :) -- Ben Rosenberg mailto:ben@whack.org ----- "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." -Benjamin Franklin
--- jfweber@eternal.net wrote:
ps... to Suse Central Command. I'd love to be able to get extra copies of the stickers..
Damn! What is it about those bloody stickers?!?! People: get some Avery labels and an inkjet printer or something -- sheesh! :)
(<me> Hi, my name is Jon, and I'm a sticker junkie. <group> Hi, Jon.)
===== Oh sure, now you want us to configure the stickers, too......as if graphics cards,etc., aren't enough to deal with. Stay away from the sticker
On Saturday 13 October 2001 02:51 pm, Jon Pennington wrote: thing......they just work out of the box. ;-) -- TRBishop tb64710@alltel.net SuSE 7.2 Pro
On Sat, Oct 13, 2001 at 03:56:19PM -0500, Thomas Bishop wrote:
--- jfweber@eternal.net wrote:
ps... to Suse Central Command. I'd love to be able to get extra copies of the stickers..
Damn! What is it about those bloody stickers?!?! People: get some Avery labels and an inkjet printer or something -- sheesh! :)
(<me> Hi, my name is Jon, and I'm a sticker junkie. <group> Hi, Jon.)
===== Oh sure, now you want us to configure the stickers, too......as if graphics cards,etc., aren't enough to deal with. Stay away from the sticker
On Saturday 13 October 2001 02:51 pm, Jon Pennington wrote: thing......they just work out of the box. ;-)
Mmm. I thinks the choice of a chameleon as the company animal is *very* suspicious, we all know what chameleons do... -- Regards Cliff
** On Sun, 14 Oct 2001 13:30:03 +0200 Cliff Sarginson
On Sunday 14 October 2001 13.30, Cliff Sarginson wrote:
On Sat, Oct 13, 2001 at 03:56:19PM -0500, Thomas Bishop wrote:
On Saturday 13 October 2001 02:51 pm, Jon Pennington wrote:
--- jfweber@eternal.net wrote:
ps... to Suse Central Command. I'd love to be able to get extra copies of the stickers..
Damn! What is it about those bloody stickers?!?! People: get some Avery labels and an inkjet printer or something -- sheesh! :)
(<me> Hi, my name is Jon, and I'm a sticker junkie. <group> Hi, Jon.)
=====
Oh sure, now you want us to configure the stickers, too......as if graphics cards,etc., aren't enough to deal with. Stay away from the sticker thing......they just work out of the box. ;-)
Mmm. I thinks the choice of a chameleon as the company animal is *very* suspicious, we all know what chameleons do...
eat bugs? Anders -- ICQ: 132715168 YM: cicerose
Damn! What is it about those bloody stickers?!?! People: get some Avery labels and an inkjet printer or something -- sheesh! :)
But they do cost some money... Is there any free printers somewhere..? Jaska.
(<me> Hi, my name is Jon, and I'm a sticker junkie. <group> Hi, Jon.)
=====
On Sunday 14 October 2001 03.10, Jaakko Tamminen wrote:
Damn! What is it about those bloody stickers?!?! People: get some Avery labels and an inkjet printer or something -- sheesh! :)
But they do cost some money... Is there any free printers somewhere..?
I'm not sure if this is true these days, but there used to be a goldmine outside most major companies, in their garbage dumpsters. You could find completely working computers with minimal work, and some companies even let you rummage through the dumpsters. Perhaps in these days of eco-enlightenment they are recycled, I don't know. Aside from that, you can get a very good quality printer brand new for about $100 here. I don't know prices in Finland, but I can't imagine it'd be that great a difference, and $100 is within most people's budgets I'm sure (cut down on those Jolts for a couple of weeks).
Jaska.
(<me> Hi, my name is Jon, and I'm a sticker junkie. <group> Hi, Jon.)
=====
regards Anders PS. I just heard on the news here that someone sent anthrax virus to MS HQ, but can't find info on the net to verify it. Has anyone heard this? URL?
-> ->PS. I just heard on the news here that someone sent anthrax virus to MS HQ, ->but can't find info on the net to verify it. Has anyone heard this? URL? Frontpage of http://www.cnn.com ;) It almost bit ya eh? -- Ben Rosenberg mailto:ben@whack.org ----- "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." -Benjamin Franklin
On 13 Oct 2001, Anders Johansson wrote:
I'm not sure if this is true these days, but there used to be a goldmine outside most major companies, in their garbage dumpsters. You could find completely working computers with minimal work, and some companies even let you rummage through the dumpsters. Perhaps in these days of eco-enlightenment they are recycled, I don't know.
I am aware of only the situation in the United States. It is illegal in all 50 states for _corporations_ to throw out computers, TV, and other major electrical equipment: it must be recycled. Individuals can, however, dispose of electical equipment via the dumpster... except in Massachetts and California which passed laws forbidding it in the last 6 months or so. (Source: PC World Magazine) I am an environmentalist (my math teacher called me a fuckin' "tree hugger"), so recycling is great. IIRC, it is illegal to throw out _any_ electrical equipment in Sweden because of the hazardous effects of poisonous metals in parts. My school's SysAdmin decided to throw out (!) some computer instead of offering them for sale... he threw out 3 computers Pentiums with 64MB of RAM each, a 333Mhz machine with 96MB of RAM, and a 466MHz one. That's ridiculous, because I'm here at home writing this on a 233MMX with 32MB of RAM. -- noodlez: Karol Pietrzak PGP KeyID: 0x3A1446A0
On Sunday 14 October 2001 03.10, Jaakko Tamminen wrote:
Damn! What is it about those bloody stickers?!?! People: get some Avery labels and an inkjet printer or something -- sheesh! :)
But they do cost some money... Is there any free printers somewhere..?
I'm not sure if this is true these days, but there used to be a goldmine outside most major companies, in their garbage dumpsters. You could find
Do they give any support for these printers? (hint: Should we all just download updates from SuSE...) Jaska.
Sorry, there probably should have been a smiley after the IBM comment -- I was refering to the investment IBM made in SuSE a few weeks ago. Please also note that I just this very afternoon went and bought yet another box of SuSE. There's a variety of reasons for that -- because I'm not that big a fan of sysadmin work, I'd prefer to install off of CD, it's cleaner, and I don't have to ferret through tons of FTP sites to keep software basically upgraded -- all the stuff I want is right on the CD set. (The fact that Earthlink/Mindspring uses PPPoE for xDSL also throws a curve into FTP installation.) But mainly, no matter what impression my original post made, I'm personally in favor of contributing to SuSE's well-being -- they won me over when they included Sybase on their 6.2 distro. BTW: To the person that commented about Anthrax at Microsoft HQ, it didn't happen in Washington/Microsoft HQ -- the incident occured at a MS mail processing center in Reno, Nevada. Later, --Gregory On Sat, 13 Oct 2001, Philipp Thomas wrote:
* Gregory Sawyer [Fri, 12 Oct 2001 16:39:22 -0700]:
Marketing, etc.) Like newspapers, broadcast television and colleges/universities, this is not where SuSE makes its money.
Wrong :) SuSE does make a substantial amount of money from selling the boxes.
and apparently by being a part of IBM's R&D division.
Where did you get that idea from? It's nowhere near reality!
but I don't think that SuSE is going to go out of business just because I miss paying for a release or two.
No, not because of you alone :) But if enough people think like this .....
Don't get me wrong. I'm not blaming anyone for taking an out time from updates. If I wouldn't get a copy for free, I most probably wouldn't buy every new version.
Philipp
-- "The idea that Bill Gates has appeared like a knight in shining armour to lead all customers out of a mire of technological chaos neatly ignores the fact that it was he who, by peddling second-rate technology, led them into it in the first place." - Douglas Adams in Guardian, 25-Aug-95
-- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/support/faq and the archives at http://lists.suse.com -- "But Nat Wyeth lived in Cambridge, and in Cambridge the world has always seemed simpler, more high-minded and more amenable to reason that it proves to be when one goes out to mingle with the children of darkness." --Bernard DeVoto, "Across the Wide Missouri"
On Friday 12 October 2001 3:58 pm, THOMAS ADAM wrote:
Hello, everyone.
I have noticed a disturbing trend in recent weeks of
people begging for free
copies of our favourite distro. Is this beginning to
wear a little thin for
No...not really. The professional version of SuSE 7.3 was released at £50.....by the time that goes down to a reasonable price to buy...the next version is more or less ready to be released.
And as SuSE/Linux is GNU/GPL anyway...I say COPY COPY COPY away...
I have to agree with Bruce here, your approach "COPY COPY COPY" is not in
keeping with the GNU ethos; RMS used to sell his GNU Emacs for $150 a tape
back in the early days (1985). How do you think he made a living? I doubt
that I'd be here writing this if everyone thought that $150 was an
unreasonable price to pay for quality software back then; no Emacs, no GCC,
no Linux...
Open Source is community. That means everyone contributes. Even though I may
not be able to contribute in the way some do (Don Sanders, Waldo Bastian et
al, for example who author KMail) I can exchange £50 for a boxed distribution
every so often (not necessarily every version) and help others getting
started.
And if you can't afford a boxed set of the current version there's always an
older version available, the SuSE FTP site, and Linux ISO! TAKE TAKE TAKE is
not the answer.
BTW, I've got SuSE 6.1 and 6.4 to giveaway.
M
--
Martin Webster
On Friday 12 October 2001 14:50 pm, Martin Webster wrote:
Open Source is community. That means everyone contributes. Even though I may not be able to contribute in the way some do (Don Sanders, Waldo Bastian et al, for example who author KMail) I can exchange £50 for a boxed distribution every so often (not necessarily every version) and help others getting started.
I've always thought that there should be some sort of 'fund' that people could contribute to... a fund that could, for example, purchase that 'new widget card' that not many people need but a driver author for it could be found. Buy the card, give it to that person, let them write a driver and the card either goes to the author or could be given to the next person to add to the driver or who becomes the maintainer. It would cost each of us pennies... and would probably make Linux advance faster. And a better idea would be to have each distro contribute a $1 of each purchase price to the fund. Just my $.02US -- +----------------------------------------------------------------------------+ + Bruce S. Marshall bmarsh@bmarsh.com Bellaire, MI 10/12/01 14:56 + +----------------------------------------------------------------------------+ "It was a book to kill time for those who liked it better dead."
I like the idea but it doubt that anyone would be that generous. But at this point i would donate Xpert 128 to someone so they could write drivers for i am that desperate for drivers for it. Alex :) Bruce Marshall wrote:
On Friday 12 October 2001 14:50 pm, Martin Webster wrote:
Open Source is community. That means everyone contributes. Even though I may not be able to contribute in the way some do (Don Sanders, Waldo Bastian et al, for example who author KMail) I can exchange £50 for a boxed distribution every so often (not necessarily every version) and help others getting started.
I've always thought that there should be some sort of 'fund' that people could contribute to... a fund that could, for example, purchase that 'new widget card' that not many people need but a driver author for it could be found. Buy the card, give it to that person, let them write a driver and the card either goes to the author or could be given to the next person to add to the driver or who becomes the maintainer. It would cost each of us pennies... and would probably make Linux advance faster.
And a better idea would be to have each distro contribute a $1 of each purchase price to the fund.
Just my $.02US
-- +----------------------------------------------------------------------------+ + Bruce S. Marshall bmarsh@bmarsh.com Bellaire, MI 10/12/01 14:56 + +----------------------------------------------------------------------------+ "It was a book to kill time for those who liked it better dead."
-- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/support/faq and the archives at http://lists.suse.com
On Friday 12 October 2001 7:00 pm, Bruce Marshall wrote:
On Friday 12 October 2001 14:50 pm, Martin Webster wrote: I've always thought that there should be some sort of 'fund' that people could contribute to... a fund that could, for example, purchase that 'new widget card' that not many people need but a driver author for it could be found. Buy the card, give it to that person, let them write a driver and the card either goes to the author or could be given to the next person to add to the driver or who becomes the maintainer. It would cost each of us pennies... and would probably make Linux advance faster.
I agree with your sentiment. However, it's not sufficient to have a card to hand in order to write a driver. Manufacturers need to provide information to the software engineer too. And this is where we come in: lobby manufactuers if they don't support Linux!
And a better idea would be to have each distro contribute a $1 of each purchase price to the fund.
I think you'll find that they're 'donating' far more than this per user, for
example:
<q>In its activities, SuSE Linux AG makes good use of the largest development
team for Open Source software. "More than one hundred developers in our SuSE
Labs work on solutions for tomorrow. The innovations in connection with the
numerous core components of the Linux operating system are directly
implemented in the latest SuSE Linux versions," remarks Nussbickel.</q>
(http://www.suse.de/uk/press/services/information/company/portrait.html)
The same goes for other distributions.
Also, if anyone wants a free boxed set of SuSE 7.0 please see
http://www.suse.de/uk/company/giveaway/index.html.
M
--
Martin Webster
--- Bruce Marshall
I've always thought that there should be some sort of 'fund' that people could contribute to...
There are several, hit FSF.org first. I've personally also been known to ship hardware out of my "private stock" to hardware driver developers for this or that. While working for Atipa, an instance I recall clearly was that of "Rev 8+" es137x sound chips not working properly. I talked to the hardware VP, appropriated a card (Rev 9, IIRC), and sent it to him as quickly as I could. If the driver problem was ever fixed or not, I'll never know, but that's one very small instance of a company selling Linux/Free Software solutions helping everyone else out at minimal cost to the consumer. If SuSE doesn't do this, I don't know who you can say does...isn't, like, a third of the XFree86 core team on a SuSE payroll? Are you familiar with the ALSA project at all? :) ===== -- -=|JP|=- Hit me! - http://www.xanga.com/cowboydren/ Jon Pennington | Debian 2.3 -o) cowboydren @ yahoo . com | Auto Enthusiast /\\ Kansas City, MO, USA | ICQ UIN 69 67 29 31 _\_V __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Make a great connection at Yahoo! Personals. http://personals.yahoo.com
participants (16)
-
Alex -
Anders Johansson -
Ben Rosenberg -
Bruce Marshall -
Cliff Sarginson -
Curtis Rey -
Glenn -
Gregory Sawyer -
Jaakko Tamminen -
jfweber＠eternal.net -
Jon Pennington -
Karol Pietrzak -
Martin Webster -
philippt＠t-online.de -
THOMAS ADAM -
Thomas Bishop