On Jun 1, 2009, at 7:58 PM, Andrew Gould wrote:

On Mon, Jun 1, 2009 at 11:57 AM, Roger Oberholtzer wrote:

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On May 31, 2009, at 11:24 AM, Malte Gell wrote:

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Hi there,

I have a Nokia N82 and can't get it running with gnokii 0.6.26 on openSUSE 11.1

Below you can see my gnokii.rc

When I try e.g. "gnokii --getphonebook ME 1 end"

I only get "Error reading from the location 1 in memory ME Error: Unknown error - well better than nothing!!"

gnokii --identify actually does work. The phone is connected via USB and of course I chose "PC Suite" as connection method.

I already reported to the gnokii mailing list, but without any response yet. So I wonder, has anyone of you a running gnokii with a Nseries devide like N82, N95 or similar?

Nokia support on other than Windows is really crap. I have a Nokia eXpressMusic and it is not even supported on my Mac. Don't even mention Linux support.

One could only hope that one thing Nokia do with Qt is make a decent cross-platform interface to their products. Current support is really crap.

--

Roger Oberholtzer

OPQ Systems / Ramböll RST

Ramböll Sverige AB Kapellgränd 7 P.O. Box 4205 SE-102 65 Stockholm, Sweden

Office: Int +46 8-615 60 20 Mobile: Int +46 70-815 1696

Are all cell phones with SyncML compatible with Linux? I've been browsing phones for this feature over at phone scoop: http://www.phonescoop.com/phones/finder.php

If you click on "Show all options", SyncML will appear in the Productivity category.

Seem there are various versions of SyncML. And they seem not all to work the same. So, even though my Nokia supports SyncML, even the most basic probe commands fail. I can see that the Nokia returns some text for the requests, but it is not accepted. You get a feeling for the hopelessness of it when you read the list of supported telephones. It almost gets to stating the day of week of manufacture. OK. I exaggerate. But not by much. The telephone guys have made a real mess. Even different phones in the same line from the same manufacturer may or may not work the same. It is like if a modem had its own version of each standard command. Or if each hard disk manufacturer made it's own interface. With one Nokia phone, they were so damned lazy that the sync software just made a connection to Outlook. Period. If you did not use/want Outlook to manage your address book, tough. Nokia (I have similar experience with Ericsson and Sony/Ericsson) are not in the position they are in today because of computer integration with their phones. Apple ARE in the position they are today partly because of the very very well done computer integration. Especially when compared to the other vendors. Of course, Apple is no more open than the other folk. But al least their software is of some level of quality. With Nokia I always get the feeling it is added as an insignificant afterthought. Someone pressed a button here... -- Roger Oberholtzer OPQ Systems / Ramböll RST Ramböll Sverige AB Kapellgränd 7 P.O. Box 4205 SE-102 65 Stockholm, Sweden Office: Int +46 8-615 60 20 Mobile: Int +46 70-815 1696 And remember: It is RSofT and there is always something under construction. It is like talking about large city with all constructions finished. Not impossible, but very unlikely. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Roger Oberholtzer wrote

Nokia support on other than Windows is really crap. I have a Nokia eXpressMusic and it is not even supported on my Mac. Don't even mention Linux support.

One could only hope that one thing Nokia do with Qt is make a decent cross-platform interface to their products. Current support is really crap.

Yes, I also hope they change their minds with Qt. I filed a complain to Nokia, unfortunately I did not find a corresponding site at the .com based Nokia site, I only could file it on the German based site. I expressed my anger about the lack of Linux support and asked for better Linux support in the future, at least for porting Nokia PC Suite to Linux and a firmware updater for Linux. It would be nice if other Nokia and Linux users could do the same and file a complaint to them. Regards Malte -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Tue, Jun 2, 2009 at 9:22 AM, Roger Oberholtzer wrote:

On Tue, 2009-06-02 at 16:15 +0200, Malte Gell wrote:

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Roger Oberholtzer wrote

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Nokia support on other than Windows is really crap. I have a Nokia eXpressMusic and it is not even supported on my Mac. Don't even mention Linux support.

One could only hope that one thing Nokia do with Qt is make a decent cross-platform interface to their products. Current support is really crap.

Yes, I also hope they change their minds with Qt. I filed a complain to Nokia, unfortunately I did not find a corresponding site at the .com based Nokia site, I only could file it on the German based site. I expressed my anger about the lack of Linux support and asked for better Linux support in the future, at least for porting Nokia PC Suite to Linux and a firmware updater for Linux. It would be nice if other Nokia and Linux users could do the same and file a complaint to them.

And MAC users. I was/am surprised that Nokia MAC support is as bad as Linux support. And Nokia probably wonder why Apple users choose iPhone over Nokia products. And I guess iPhone's integration on Windows is probably ok, as it uses iTunes to a large extent. I doubt it is as bad as Nokia's integration.

-- Roger Oberholtzer

OPQ Systems / Ramböll RST

Ramböll Sverige AB Krukmakargatan 21 P.O. Box 17009 SE-104 62 Stockholm, Sweden

Office: Int +46 8-615 60 20 Mobile: Int +46 70-815 1696

Oops, I meant to send this to the list: Rather than give Nokia broad complaints about os support, is there specific verbage that would provide standards-based guidance for better os support? Andrew -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Roger Oberholtzer wrote:

On Tue, 2009-06-02 at 09:35 -0500, Andrew Gould wrote:

<snip>

On the PC side, it is not exactly rocket science. As a minimum, phones have contact lists. Contacts tend to have some basic common features. Name, address, phone numbers. Yet there are as many ways to get that information as there are telephone models. Of course, the phones can and do make differences where logically there need be no differences. I know this is the same of many technologies. But it does not mean it is still a good idea for telephones to continue this insanity.

Actually data synchronisation is quite tricky. You really need to take a look at the SyncML spec to realise some of the issues involved...

I would not have a big issue with this if the companies (1) supported more than Windows - and even that support is often crappy, and (2) made quality software, instead of what looks to be a second tier component made with a low budget and little or no usability testing. Ever have to update the software on a Nokia phone? It runs a number of apps sequentially that are each laid out different, so it is unclear that it is all part of the same process, and that have odd redundancies that make you think it has possibly failed the first time and is trying again with a different method. This is a Nokia eXpressMusic accessed on Windows.

Phones are *not* PCs, they have to comply to national and network requirements (which do vary somewhat). When you take into account locking of a phone to a particular network often the network defines what applications (and services) the phone can provide and how they are provided.

On the MAC or Linux there is no access possible. Hard to make more than a broad complaint about that platform.

- -- ============================================================================== I have always wished that my computer would be as easy to use as my telephone. My wish has come true. I no longer know how to use my telephone. Bjarne Stroustrup ============================================================================== -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iEYEARECAAYFAkomPnkACgkQasN0sSnLmgJHkwCfRJw2yzP805GVOqT0MxPMFvEG LyEAoOPnvqmjl+Z7wXeSybkz4Z3tMBZ5 =Vb/t -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

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On the PC side, it is not exactly rocket science. As a minimum, phones have contact lists. Contacts tend to have some basic common features. Name, address, phone numbers. Yet there are as many ways to get that information as there are telephone models. Of course, the phones can and do make differences where logically there need be no differences. I know this is the same of many technologies. But it does not mean it is still a good idea for telephones to continue this insanity. Actually data synchronisation is quite tricky. You really need to take a look at the SyncML spec to realise some of the issues involved... It has been made tricky by how it is implemented. Of course,

No, I think your over simplifying. It is really a genuinely hard problem.

I would be surprised if they could not make software on the phone that could talk to the software on the PC.

I have no doubt they could; but it is very expensive and there just isn't any return.

As to telephones not being PC, I was not meaning that they were. I just mean that a telephone has two paths of communication (1) telecom for, well, phone calls and all that, and (2) PC communications for things like contacts.

This is less and less true; more and more devices "just do IP" which from an implementation/engineering stand point makes sense. Setting up an IP connection over blue-tooth may be one easy solution - it works with Palms and WinCE devices. Then you can sync over IP to a SyncML/OMA-DS service. Just install Funambol - this is how I test syncronization, no carrier required [since it is obviously cheaper to test with de-activated phones]. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Wed, Jun 3, 2009 at 11:26 AM, Roger Oberholtzer wrote:

Explain why I can hook up an iPhone to a Mac or Windows box and get all the features I think Nokia et. al, should provide? Backups, sync, updates, app installs and deleting 'just work'. No painful leaping from program to program. This is of course because Apple are in control of both parts of the puzzle. What is to stop the other guys from doing the same. This is one of many reasons iPhone sales are doing quite well.

-- Roger Oberholtzer

The major difference between the business models (Apple vs Nokia, etc) is that after the phone sale, Apple has many opportunities for additional/continued revenue streams, whereas the other phone manufacturers just hope to control costs (support, warranty). That difference drives both strategic focus and motivation. It affects how the manufacturers view their customers. Andrew -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Roger Oberholtzer wrote:

On Wed, 2009-06-03 at 13:03 -0500, Andrew Gould wrote:

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On Wed, Jun 3, 2009 at 11:26 AM, Roger Oberholtzer wrote:

<snip>

Not true. Both Sony/Ericsson (how many record companies does Sony own?) and Nokia have large music download sites. They have been trying to position themselves so that they do have after sale content. Sony/Ericsson are always advertising that they have some song by some artist before anyone else. Or that this month all downloads are free. Nokia the same. This has not gone as great as they would have hoped. I put it down partly to the crappy PC interface support.

Nokia did try to set their own content service as you note at the release of one of their N series phones... Most of the major networks in the UK did not push or supply that particular phone under contract... (The phone effectively became only available SIM free with no contract subsidy... i.e. pricey, serviceless and unsupported ). The UK market model is phone makers are expected to just make phones, and the networks supply subsidised phones, the content on those phones and set charges as appropriate. While the iPhone is tied to just one network, Apple content is not a major problem for the other networks, what may get interesting is what happens if the strong network tie disappears. The networks really do not want the phone manufacturers on their turf, and are perfectly prepared to use their control of the supply chain to enforce this. It is also a factor in why M$ have struggled a bit to make a significant impact on the mobile phone market outside the US. (In the world of villains the phone networks could give M$ a few lessons in dirty tricks). This gives in effect a fairly significant disincentive to fix the problems with PC synchronisation with phones for most phone manufacturers. (It is not worth it if the model effectively becomes blacklisted as a result). This is one the potential gotchas for open source based phones and solutions. BTW: Funnily enough, one the complaints that many people still make is that they do *not* want to use PC to backup phone data (quite a few prefer backup to memory card options)....

- -- ============================================================================== I have always wished that my computer would be as easy to use as my telephone. My wish has come true. I no longer know how to use my telephone. Bjarne Stroustrup ============================================================================== -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iEYEARECAAYFAkonnBUACgkQasN0sSnLmgJrdACeIzID5fpt1ZRO0IomMF4Bywc9 CuMAoJMUOBD8WSlz1qYBnbZQIGCyjC7p =8sQI -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Wed, 2009-06-03 at 17:45 -0500, Rajko M. wrote:

On Wednesday 03 June 2009 11:26:42 am Roger Oberholtzer wrote:

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This is of course because Apple are in control of both parts of the puzzle. What is to stop the other guys from doing the same. This is one of many reasons iPhone sales are doing quite well.

Apple success is based on others greed.

Not to start a religious war, but if one were to compare the use of the iPhone/iPod to similar devices by other manufacturers, one might conclude that Apple have done a very good job. And, even if you have to go through some hoops, which other phone maker provides a free SDK and free application hosting and distribution? Free in that you only pay a part when you sell something. It you go not sell something, you pay nothing. And, the number of totally free apps for their devices is quite a long one.

Theoretically other can do the same: - Manufacturers provide more functions out of the box, - Service providers use those functions to create services, and finally to share profit, but they compete instead.

Which brings us full circle to the point that started this thread: Partly by not really and fully following standards when they do not have to, in the hope of locking customers into their goods. This disregard for standards (on the PC side) makes open source development for their products a more difficult task than it need to be. Well, I for one an finished with this thread. Time to get back to work. -- Roger Oberholtzer OPQ Systems / Ramböll RST Ramböll Sverige AB Krukmakargatan 21 P.O. Box 17009 SE-104 62 Stockholm, Sweden Office: Int +46 8-615 60 20 Mobile: Int +46 70-815 1696 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Fri, 2009-06-05 at 13:24 -0400, Adam Tauno WIlliams wrote:

On Thu, 2009-06-04 at 08:16 +0200, Roger Oberholtzer wrote:

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On Wed, 2009-06-03 at 17:45 -0500, Rajko M. wrote: Which brings us full circle to the point that started this thread: Partly by not really and fully following standards when they do not have to, in the hope of locking customers into their goods. This disregard for standards (on the PC side) makes open source development for their products a more difficult task than it need to be.

It just is not that simple. I work every day on solutions involving sync, iCalendar, CalDAV, etc... following the letter of the standard may be ideal but it will *not* result in interoperability. There are gaps in the standards and vagueness that results in entirely legitimate differences in implementation. There are also very real differences in the capacities (and internal data models) between various applications and [especially] devices that the implementation has to compensate for in order to produce what to the end user seems the obvious behavior.

So what you really mean to say is that the PC part of the phone is made up of incomplete inadequate standards. That in fact backs up my argument that many phone suppliers (or at least Nokia, Sony/Ericsson - which is a big percentage in terms of sales) are doing crap work on the PC side. Are they not in a position to make standards happen? They did so on the telecom side. It can be done if one chooses to do so. Still, this is not the core of my complaint. I am simply saying that the software supplied by Nokia themselves that is expected to work with their own phones is (1) crap on windows and (2) not available on any other platform. Standards are surely not an issue when Nokia themselves can make both sides of the conversation.

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Well, I for one an finished with this thread. Time to get back to work.

-- Roger Oberholtzer OPQ Systems / Ramböll RST Ramböll Sverige AB Krukmakargatan 21 P.O. Box 17009 SE-104 62 Stockholm, Sweden Office: Int +46 8-615 60 20 Mobile: Int +46 70-815 1696 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

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This is less and less true; more and more devices "just do IP" which from an implementation/engineering stand point makes sense. Setting up an IP connection over blue-tooth may be one easy solution - it works with Palms and WinCE devices. Then you can sync over IP to a SyncML/OMA-DS service. Just install Funambol - this is how I test syncronization, no carrier required [since it is obviously cheaper to test with de-activated phones]. Funambol is ideal for commercial and home server use and possibly Blackberry users on desktop, but is a little heavy weight for the home desktop only

Agree, completely. But it is a functional solution. For better or worse most LINUX development focuses on client/server solutions.

(and the demo web client is a bit limited). A good alternative is egroupware (which has the added advantage of being in the SuSE repositories, and not requiring the installation and configuration of Tomcat or JBoss).

"alternative"? Syncing with eGroupware uses Funambol as the SyncML provider and integrates via a connector; as does just about every Open Source groupware server (OGo, Citadel, Zimbra, SOGo, etc...). Does the eGroupware in the repo provide a pre-configured Funambol instance?

If you can get a local IP link between PC and device all things are possible (puTTY or VNC on a symbian phone is a bit of fun, and there is a rather handy free phoned based FTP server).

-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 John E. Perry wrote:

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"alternative"? Syncing with eGroupware uses Funambol as the SyncML provider and integrates via a connector; as does just about every Open Source groupware server (OGo, Citadel, Zimbra, SOGo, etc...). Does the eGroupware in the repo provide a pre-configured Funambol instance?

So, based on this other recommendations, I tried to install funambol. It failed, saying there was no provider for tomcat55.

I can't find tomcat55 via webpin, so I look for tomcat. I find a couple of dozen tomcats, among which are tomcat5-servlet-2.4-api (5.5.25). I install it, and get the very same error. So I install tomcat6 (6.0.18), hoping against hope for something good to happen, Same error.

Installation of funambol is not entirely straight forward in my experience and I am not clear whether this is happening when unpacking the files or when you attempting to initialise funambol. When I did my first installation there were different installation scripts for JBoss, Tomcat 5 and Tomcat 5.5. I do remember having some fun and games with this and unfortunately I cannot remember how I got this fixed. I have not yet installed the last version, but there is a fair bit of installation documentation which needs to read carefully before you attempt to install. - -- ============================================================================== I have always wished that my computer would be as easy to use as my telephone. My wish has come true. I no longer know how to use my telephone. Bjarne Stroustrup ============================================================================== -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iEYEARECAAYFAkoqNu8ACgkQasN0sSnLmgKA5gCffFOMCFjdO+HpWzPqWOMsRfh9 coQAoJdKE00lTxhm+XDUNOr/SgHg2I6a =xixh -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Sat, 2009-06-06 at 11:56 -0400, John E. Perry wrote:

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So, based on this other recommendations, I tried to install funambol. It failed, saying there was no provider for tomcat55. I can't find tomcat55 via webpin, so I look for tomcat. I find a couple of dozen tomcats, among which are tomcat5-servlet-2.4-api (5.5.25). I install it, and get the very same error. So I install tomcat6 (6.0.18), hoping against hope for something good to happen, Same error. Installation of funambol is not entirely straight forward in my experience and I am not clear whether this is happening when unpacking the files or when you attempting to initialise funambol. ... but there is a fair bit of installation documentation which needs to read carefully before you attempt to install. Ah. I expected all that would be taken care of in the 1-click installs from the suse website. So I'll have to do some more digging before I

G T Smith wrote: try this again. Thanks.

I've never used, or even knew existed, Funambol packages for any distro. I use the bundled version provided by the Funambol project and just install it into /opt/Funambol. It is important to note that a 1-click install of Funambol to a working deployment is *NOT POSSIBLE*. Mobile device support is too complex and site/implementation specific. Someone could provide such a package for a specific groupware service and set of devices (or versions of a device - this matters allot!), but not a general purpose sync solution. You always have to test. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Sat, 2009-06-06 at 10:27 +0100, G T Smith wrote:

Adam Tauno WIlliams wrote:

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"alternative"? Syncing with eGroupware uses Funambol as the SyncML provider and integrates via a connector; as does just about every Open Source groupware server (OGo, Citadel, Zimbra, SOGo, etc...). Does the eGroupware in the repo provide a pre-configured Funambol instance? The version of egroupware I have currently running does not use funambol, (it has its own internal SyncML support). Now egroupware, may have since ported to a version using a funambol plugin (which would make sense because some of the results were occasionally a little odd with its own SyncML support), or may offer funambol as an alternative to its

It would also make sense as Funambol provides an architecture for dealing with the nuances of various devices - which is allot of work. These are in the form of "synclets" which are written in Java beanshell and can be used to customize the SyncML transactions at various points; most importantly the input and output pipelines based on the devices user agent string. One good document [very few exist!] that provides a tour of this functionality can be found at http://docs.opengroupware.org/Members/sasepp/ogo-nokia-sync/view.

I have not looked at Citadel or Zimbra for a year or so I cannot comment on them but I believe SOGo have their own WebDAV based client for their own synchronisation technology,

No, for mobile device support SOGo absolutely uses Funambol and provides a custom connector that does not use WebDAV. Although SOGo's GroupDAV support can also be used to support sync - again via Funamabol - using the Funambol GroupDAV connector http://bionicmessage.net/?q=node/2. CalDAV/CardDAV/GroupDAV based fat-client support (Microsoft Outlook, Novell Evolution, Kontact, Thunderous Turd, etc...) and mobile device support while superficially similar are, in actual practice, very different animals.

I have not looked at the latest version of funambol yet (not a lot of point until the Thunderbird/Lightning funambol connector can be got to work again on Linux/openSuSE),

I disagree; Thunderbird integration with your groupware solution can be achieved much more effectively via CalDAV/GroupDAV than via SyncML. Funambol's support for fat-clients will always be an after thought as their emphasis is on the [quite different] mobile device sync. It is important to avoid if-your-have-a-hammer-everything-is-a-nail mind trap that "syncronization" can become.

I want to upgrade server before loading this for obvious reasons. For the first version I loaded the unofficial funambol MySQL support which required some tweaking of the MySQL settings to get working. For the version installed currently (which does have official MySQL support), I am not sure to what extent this tweaking can be removed, in short I have to start from scratch.

I have never used Funambol's direct-DB support so I cannot comment on that (it violates the layers of architecture and is inappropriate in en enterprise environment, IMO).

IIRC The original funambol project was a PHP script which I believe is still available, at some point (to add to the confusion) this was ported

I do not believe so. The original Funambol project was Sync4j: <quote>The Funambol project was started in 2001 by developers because of the lack of an open source Java implementation for mobile device data synchronization</quote>.

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If you can get a local IP link between PC and device all things are possible (puTTY or VNC on a symbian phone is a bit of fun, and there is a rather handy free phoned based FTP server).

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On Wed, 2009-06-03 at 10:11 +0100, G T Smith wrote:

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Malte Gell wrote:

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Roger Oberholtzer wrote

Yes, I also hope they change their minds with Qt. I filed a complain to Nokia, unfortunately I did not find a corresponding site at the .com based Nokia site,

QT is a user interface and has absolutely nothing to do with SyncML which is a protocol...

Of course. What I meant was that, now that Nokia have bought Trolltech (the makers of the Qt cross-platform tool kit), perhaps Nokia will use Qt to make a PC client application for their phones that will run everywhere QT does. And that is quite a few places. As Nokia make the server side of the SyncML in question (it is in their phone), they would be in a fantastic position to know how to make a client. And they could now make one client that runs on all platforms. -- Roger Oberholtzer OPQ Systems / Ramböll RST Ramböll Sverige AB Krukmakargatan 21 P.O. Box 17009 SE-104 62 Stockholm, Sweden Office: Int +46 8-615 60 20 Mobile: Int +46 70-815 1696 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Roger Oberholtzer wrote:

On Wed, 2009-06-03 at 10:11 +0100, G T Smith wrote:

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-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1

Malte Gell wrote:

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Roger Oberholtzer wrote

Yes, I also hope they change their minds with Qt. I filed a complain to Nokia, unfortunately I did not find a corresponding site at the .com based Nokia site, QT is a user interface and has absolutely nothing to do with SyncML which is a protocol...

Of course. What I meant was that, now that Nokia have bought Trolltech (the makers of the Qt cross-platform tool kit), perhaps Nokia will use Qt to make a PC client application for their phones that will run everywhere QT does. And that is quite a few places. As Nokia make the server side of the SyncML in question (it is in their phone), they would be in a fantastic position to know how to make a client. And they could now make one client that runs on all platforms.

I think you have things a little back to front here, the phone is normally a SyncML client not a server, the PC has to supply a (cut down) server (or one uses an external source). With Nokia (and SE) this is usually supplied for Symbian based phones on the PC by PC Suite which I think you may be able to get working with wine as the code base is pretty ancient. (The Nokia SDK apparently can be made to run in wine). However, it only recognised Lotus and M$ apps so has limited usability on Linux (or Windows for that matter). PC Suite is pretty bad at what it is supposed to do.... Basic SyncML client support is pretty much standard on modern phones, but for more sophisticated support a 3rd party client is usually required. - -- ============================================================================== I have always wished that my computer would be as easy to use as my telephone. My wish has come true. I no longer know how to use my telephone. Bjarne Stroustrup ============================================================================== -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iEYEARECAAYFAkonm3sACgkQasN0sSnLmgKqJgCgmnfwZ3/gjw4hfZfedwHTBYsU +SUAn06ETyfbuxDusdKawvZeiMIutjjP =SK3O -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Tue, 2009-06-02 at 18:15 +0300, Dotan Cohen wrote:

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Nokia support on other than Windows is really crap. I have a Nokia eXpressMusic and it is not even supported on my Mac. Don't even mention Linux support.

All the latest Symbian phones support SyncML. It's the folks who would have SyncML working with your favourite PIM application that you should be sore at, not Nokia. The standard exists, no Linux applications yet support it.

I think the thing with SyncML seems to be that there are so very many versions. These are probably the result of features being added over time. But it seems to me that SyncML was not careful at the start to allow future additions. It also happens that even new phones ship with surprisingly old versions of SyncML. At least Nokia are like this. -- Roger Oberholtzer OPQ Systems / Ramböll RST Ramböll Sverige AB Krukmakargatan 21 P.O. Box 17009 SE-104 62 Stockholm, Sweden Office: Int +46 8-615 60 20 Mobile: Int +46 70-815 1696 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org