Upgrade 6.4->7.2 v. fresh install?
I think I already know what the answer is, but because my manager is being
pushy, what is the recommended way to upgrade?
Given an existing SuSE 6.4 system with a reasonable amount of non-rpm
software packages installed and a fair amount of post-installation
customization, would it be simpler (in the long run) to stick in my 7.2 cd
and let it do an upgrade, or do a fresh install and repeat the work from
scratch?
Personally, I'm thinking the latter, mainly because a great many things
changed from 6.4->7.2, and we've got a lot of other stuff tucked in around
it...
What's the general consensus?
--
Gregory K. Ade
On Tuesday 09 October 2001 19:44 pm, Gregory Ade wrote:
I think I already know what the answer is, but because my manager is being pushy, what is the recommended way to upgrade?
Given an existing SuSE 6.4 system with a reasonable amount of non-rpm software packages installed and a fair amount of post-installation customization, would it be simpler (in the long run) to stick in my 7.2 cd and let it do an upgrade, or do a fresh install and repeat the work from scratch?
Personally, I'm thinking the latter, mainly because a great many things changed from 6.4->7.2, and we've got a lot of other stuff tucked in around it...
The latter: 1) You can take good notes about things added/changed. 2) You'll get rid of a lot of dead wood. 3) Any extra time spent re-doing the changes would override time spent trying to find/fix the bugs in an upgrade. 4) You always learn something from an install.
What's the general consensus?
-- +----------------------------------------------------------------------------+ + Bruce S. Marshall bmarsh@bmarsh.com Bellaire, MI 10/09/01 22:33 + +----------------------------------------------------------------------------+ "Warning: Dates in the calendar are closer than they appear."
On Tue, Oct 09, 2001 at 10:34:49PM -0400, Bruce Marshall wrote:
On Tuesday 09 October 2001 19:44 pm, Gregory Ade wrote:
I think I already know what the answer is, but because my manager is being pushy, what is the recommended way to upgrade?
Given an existing SuSE 6.4 system with a reasonable amount of non-rpm software packages installed and a fair amount of post-installation customization, would it be simpler (in the long run) to stick in my 7.2 cd and let it do an upgrade, or do a fresh install and repeat the work from scratch?
Personally, I'm thinking the latter, mainly because a great many things changed from 6.4->7.2, and we've got a lot of other stuff tucked in around it...
The latter:
1) You can take good notes about things added/changed. 2) You'll get rid of a lot of dead wood. 3) Any extra time spent re-doing the changes would override time spent trying to find/fix the bugs in an upgrade. 4) You always learn something from an install.
What's the general consensus?
Do *not* pass go, do not collect 100 pounds, go straight to jail .. that is if you do an upgrade. A fresh installation my friend, prepare yourself well and I would bet money you will come to less grief than if you try an upgrade. Suse is far far behind in respect to this kind of thing compared to other longer in the tooth UN*X's. But this is a favourite pet-peeve of mine so I will shut up now.. One thing, a lot of things will end up in different places in 7.2 than in 6.4, don't let that alarm you. Suse is keen on the increasing standardisation of where certain things should live on Linux systems. Apache files have particularly itchy feet. Oh and documentation as well roams around a lot. -- Regards Cliff
Hi Cliff, Aren't you being overly dramatic about this? The step between 6.4 and 7.2 is quite long, and I don't know very many systems that even allow upgrades with distances that far. OS/400 for instance, one of the most stable and predictable OSes in the world, has very well defined upgrade paths, and it's simply not possible to make a jump that far. You'd have to go in stages. As far as file locations are concerned, I'd have to say that standardization is A Good Thing. Once it's a standard, you can trust it to remain that way. Things that aren't standardized, well, where can you ever trust that? To the original question: 6.4 -> 7.2 is best (only?) done with a fresh install. Make sure all configuration of programs you actively use is backed up. Especially config files that store passwords. regards Anders On Wednesday 10 October 2001 07.43, Cliff Sarginson wrote:
On Tue, Oct 09, 2001 at 10:34:49PM -0400, Bruce Marshall wrote:
On Tuesday 09 October 2001 19:44 pm, Gregory Ade wrote:
I think I already know what the answer is, but because my manager is being pushy, what is the recommended way to upgrade?
Given an existing SuSE 6.4 system with a reasonable amount of non-rpm software packages installed and a fair amount of post-installation customization, would it be simpler (in the long run) to stick in my 7.2 cd and let it do an upgrade, or do a fresh install and repeat the work from scratch?
Personally, I'm thinking the latter, mainly because a great many things changed from 6.4->7.2, and we've got a lot of other stuff tucked in around it...
The latter:
1) You can take good notes about things added/changed. 2) You'll get rid of a lot of dead wood. 3) Any extra time spent re-doing the changes would override time spent trying to find/fix the bugs in an upgrade. 4) You always learn something from an install.
What's the general consensus?
Do *not* pass go, do not collect 100 pounds, go straight to jail .. that is if you do an upgrade. A fresh installation my friend, prepare yourself well and I would bet money you will come to less grief than if you try an upgrade. Suse is far far behind in respect to this kind of thing compared to other longer in the tooth UN*X's. But this is a favourite pet-peeve of mine so I will shut up now..
One thing, a lot of things will end up in different places in 7.2 than in 6.4, don't let that alarm you. Suse is keen on the increasing standardisation of where certain things should live on Linux systems. Apache files have particularly itchy feet. Oh and documentation as well roams around a lot.
On Wed, Oct 10, 2001 at 01:18:24PM +0200, Anders Johansson wrote:
Hi Cliff,
Aren't you being overly dramatic about this? Oh, possibly, but I do talk from some many years experience as an ex-UN*X system manager on many different flavours. (ex- because it is a far too high stress a job, and everybody hates you .. lol)
The step between 6.4 and 7.2 is quite long, and I don't know very many systems that even allow upgrades with distances that far. OS/400 for instance, one of the most stable and predictable OSes in the world, has very well defined upgrade paths, and it's simply not possible to make a jump that far. You'd have to go in stages.
As far as file locations are concerned, I'd have to say that standardization is A Good Thing. Once it's a standard, you can trust it to remain that way. Things that aren't standardized, well, where can you ever trust that?
Oh, don't misunderstand me on this. I think it's a good idea to have some predictability in this world ! It was meant as a warning rather than as a critique.
To the original question: 6.4 -> 7.2 is best (only?) done with a fresh install. Make sure all configuration of programs you actively use is backed up. Especially config files that store passwords.
What was being asked for were views based on experience, as I think I said I am happy if people have had a good result from upgrading. My experience is that the upgrade path has not been a success story, and the cause, in my view, is inadequate testing of upgrades. To be honest I don't see how Suse with it's breakneck schedule for new-releases can find the time or person-power to do this properly anyway. An upgrade is infinitely more complicated for a distributor to setup than a fresh install. -- Regards Cliff
On Wednesday 10 October 2001 07.43, Cliff Sarginson wrote:
On Tue, Oct 09, 2001 at 10:34:49PM -0400, Bruce Marshall wrote:
On Tuesday 09 October 2001 19:44 pm, Gregory Ade wrote:
I think I already know what the answer is, but because my manager is being pushy, what is the recommended way to upgrade?
Given an existing SuSE 6.4 system with a reasonable amount of non-rpm software packages installed and a fair amount of post-installation customization, would it be simpler (in the long run) to stick in my 7.2 cd and let it do an upgrade, or do a fresh install and repeat the work from scratch?
Personally, I'm thinking the latter, mainly because a great many things changed from 6.4->7.2, and we've got a lot of other stuff tucked in around it...
The latter:
1) You can take good notes about things added/changed. 2) You'll get rid of a lot of dead wood. 3) Any extra time spent re-doing the changes would override time spent trying to find/fix the bugs in an upgrade. 4) You always learn something from an install.
What's the general consensus?
Do *not* pass go, do not collect 100 pounds, go straight to jail .. that is if you do an upgrade. A fresh installation my friend, prepare yourself well and I would bet money you will come to less grief than if you try an upgrade. Suse is far far behind in respect to this kind of thing compared to other longer in the tooth UN*X's. But this is a favourite pet-peeve of mine so I will shut up now..
One thing, a lot of things will end up in different places in 7.2 than in 6.4, don't let that alarm you. Suse is keen on the increasing standardisation of where certain things should live on Linux systems. Apache files have particularly itchy feet. Oh and documentation as well roams around a lot.
On October 9, 2001 07:44 pm, Gregory Ade wrote:
I think I already know what the answer is, but because my manager is being pushy, what is the recommended way to upgrade?
Given an existing SuSE 6.4 system with a reasonable amount of non-rpm software packages installed and a fair amount of post-installation customization, would it be simpler (in the long run) to stick in my 7.2 cd and let it do an upgrade, or do a fresh install and repeat the work from scratch?
Personally, I'm thinking the latter, mainly because a great many things changed from 6.4->7.2, and we've got a lot of other stuff tucked in around it...
What's the general consensus?
If you're local stuff is in /usr/local then un upgrade won't touch any of it. Also if you have a good list of what you've installed [names and version numbers] it's not too hard to just check the versions that the upgrade will install. If you have installed alot of your own stuff then it's quite likely your 6.4 system will be MORE up to date in places then a brand new 7.2 system. It depends on how much planning you've done before this point. If you stick your stuff in safe spots then you can wipe out the SuSE stuff and re-install it while never touching anything you've installed. If you've stuck stuff all over the place then it requires more effort. Personally I only do a new install if I'm changing the HD layout. If I had to do a new install every time I upgraded I'd just get the new packages I wanted and install them by hand. Configuring and tuning a system takes the most time and effort IMHO. Nick
participants (5)
-
Anders Johansson
-
Bruce Marshall
-
Cliff Sarginson
-
Gregory Ade
-
Nick Zentena