On Monday 05 June 2006 17:32, Pascal Bleser wrote:

...

Umm, how is it that we're supposed to install packages to 10.1 systems? We now have several different tools (yum, yast, smart, apt) that see only subset of total packages available, and thus, are unable to satisfy dependencies for anything. Let alone bugs, but is this even conceptially figured out now?

A subset ? huh ?

Well, we have at least yum, yast, apt, smart and god knows what else as repository types. These tools are completely unaware of each other, and thus can't solve dependencies properly as each sees only a subset of the packages available. As a concrete example, I just tried to upgrade to KDE 3.5.3 using YUM, but this yielded dozens of missing dependencies (as these packages are to be served via yast). Is the idea now that SUSE is trying to create some kind of a magical superset tool that magically binds all these together and is able to resolve dependencies between different repository types? Or what's going on? That said, it won't be long now that somebody comes out with new 'cool looking' package management tool that once againt tries to solve a puzzle that can't really be solved without revising basics [of Linux]..

I'm able to install everything with smart.

I had some outdated version installed that didn't really work. Trying the current version now, but then again - I don't think a tool you are serving on some corner of the web is supposed to be the way SUSE is going to address this? But hey, thanks for this. Lets give it a go once again. -- // Janne --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-help@opensuse.org

On Monday 05 June 2006 19:14, jdd wrote:

...

Well, we have at least yum, yast, apt, smart and god knows what else as repository types. These tools are completely unaware of each other

why start with a wrong assertion?

Umm, it's not wrong. If apt and yum know RPM, it does not make them know of each other. Thus, YUM is unable to pull stuff in from APT repository. -- // Janne --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-help@opensuse.org

On Monday 05 June 2006 20:05, jdd wrote:

I guess respective repositories are mostly links to the rpm's and separate link to metadata - I don't see any reason to duplicate the rpm themselves

Yep, but it's annoying to use half a dozen different tools to get one single thing installed. Luckily, smart seems to be the key here as it does operate as a superset tool allowing access to almost any repository. In theory, that is. Importing repositories from software.opensuse.org is currently giving timeouts [smart fails silently without explaining btw]. Which reminds me - where is the build service mirror list? -- // Janne --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-help@opensuse.org

On Monday 05 June 2006 20:26, Marcus Rueckert wrote:

the common repos format they all support is rpm-md. (dunno if the apt in the distro is already recent enough. but richard has an up2date package for sure)

Thanks for clarifying, I didn't know this.

as most sources should ship with rpm-md files you can happily add them everywhere. If you use multiple tools concurrently, you need to add the sources to each of them.

OK, so all we're left with is the burden of syncronizing between these. Not quite as bad as i thought, but still. -- // Janne --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-help@opensuse.org

On Mon, Jun 05, 2006 at 07:35:31PM +0200, Marcus Rueckert wrote:

On 2006-06-05 20:33:12 +0300, Janne Karhunen wrote:

...

On Monday 05 June 2006 20:26, Marcus Rueckert wrote:

...

as most sources should ship with rpm-md files you can happily add them everywhere. If you use multiple tools concurrently, you need to add the sources to each of them.

OK, so all we're left with is the burden of syncronizing between these. Not quite as bad as i thought, but still.

how about: decide for one of them? that would solve the problem.

What is the fun in that? ;-) Somebody just write a tool to do so. I believe all tools have a CLI interface. So all you have to do is look wich ones are installed, look what repo each has and if one has one and not another, add that. Then add that tool at the end of each 'add source' process of each tool. Should not be too hard to do, but then I have not looked at it, so it could be unpossible. houghi -- This openSUSE mailinglist is about the community. All discussion about the community is welcome. If you have a techical question just subscribe via this email address: suse-linux-e-subscribe@suse.com, post your original email again there, and you will get a straight answer. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-help@opensuse.org

On Mon, Jun 05, 2006 at 08:34:32PM +0200, Marcus Rueckert wrote:

On 2006-06-05 20:17:50 +0200, houghi wrote:

...

Should not be too hard to do, but then I have not looked at it, so it could be unpossible.

you are way too bored are you? but go ahead write that tool.

The moment I plan on using 10.1 AND am planning on using more then the deafult installer that comes with SUSE, I might. Till then I have absolutely no interest in it myself. That would mean perhaps in about two or three years, perhaps. Also I believe that other people have both better insight in the matter AND are better programmers then I am. That last part is not that hard. I am not a programmer, just a copy & paste "scripter". e.g. makeSUSEdvd is made completly of things and samples I stole from others. :-) And I use the term scripter very loosely. Thief would be a better term. :-D houghi -- This openSUSE mailinglist is about the community. All discussion about the community is welcome. If you have a techical question just subscribe via this email address: suse-linux-e-subscribe@suse.com, post your original email again there, and you will get a straight answer. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-help@opensuse.org

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Janne Karhunen wrote:

On Monday 05 June 2006 20:35, Marcus Rueckert wrote:

...

...

OK, so all we're left with is the burden of syncronizing between these. Not quite as bad as i thought, but still. how about: decide for one of them? that would solve the problem.

Okay, so - which one works or am i clueless again?

After the network blackout yesterday I managed to update to KDE 3.5.3 with smart. However, looks like now smart is trying to downgrade to KDE 3.5.1 while trying to pull stuff in from "YOU". Have to use smart for this as it is the only thing that works even a little bit..

There must be a good reason for that, maybe a change of dependency (at least there's always been up to now ;)), although that's normally never the case for online updates as they're almost always backports. smart upgrade --explain ... - -- -o) Pascal Bleser http://linux01.gwdg.de/~pbleser/ /\\ _\_v The more things change, the more they stay insane. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFEhZ+Er3NMWliFcXcRArFwAJ0U3Ip/rRAXh3e3EMOR7tUDvT59GACgpMRq kanRXp3q7yrS0g4uNvg1+9Y= =/WpP -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-help@opensuse.org

On Monday 05 June 2006 20:36, Andreas Hanke wrote:

...

OK, so all we're left with is the burden of syncronizing between these. Not quite as bad as i thought, but still.

Why?

For most tasks no reason really, but every now and then I find it easier for task Z to use tool Y. That, and history has thought me that relying on one tool will not necessarily get the job done (for various reasons). -- // Janne --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-help@opensuse.org

Hi, On Mon, 5 Jun 2006, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

* Pascal Bleser [06-05-06 10:34]:

...

Works perfectly for me (and I haven't heard that complaint about it, at least not yet ;)).

Have you tried using my smart RPMs [1] ? they come preconfigured with a lot of channels, including the main repository, -updates, -non-oss, guru, packman, ... (make sure to take the latest build, 0.41-26)

[1] http://ftp.skynet.be/pub/suser-guru/rpm/packages/System/smart/

But, with 10.1_x64 (smart-0.41-26.guru.suse101.x86_64) :

Failed to download packages:

http://software.opensuse.org/download/KDE:/Backports/SUSE_Linux_10.1/x86_64/...: timed out http://software.opensuse.org/download/KDE:/KDE3/SUSE_Linux_10.1/x86_64/kdeba...: timed out http://software.opensuse.org/download/KDE:/Backports/SUSE_Linux_10.1/x86_64/...: timed out http://software.opensuse.org/download/KDE:/Backports/SUSE_Linux_10.1/x86_64/...: timed out http://software.opensuse.org/download/KDE:/Backports/SUSE_Linux_10.1/x86_64/...: timed out http://software.opensuse.org/download/KDE:/Backports/SUSE_Linux_10.1/i586/am...: timed out http://software.opensuse.org/download/KDE:/Backports/SUSE_Linux_10.1/x86_64/...: timed out http://software.opensuse.org/download/KDE:/Backports/SUSE_Linux_10.1/x86_64/...: timed out http://software.opensuse.org/download/KDE:/Backports/SUSE_Linux_10.1/x86_64/...: timed out

That is a matter of software.opensuse.org aka stage.opensuse.org. The server does not respond currently, it seems the http and rsync services are not running. Cheers -e -- Eberhard Moenkeberg (emoenke@gwdg.de, em@kki.org) --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-help@opensuse.org

* Eberhard Moenkeberg [06-05-06 16:01]:

You can try

http://ftp-1.gwdg.de/pub/opensuse/repositories/KDE:/...

Thanks, trying now.... -- Patrick Shanahan Registered Linux User #207535 http://wahoo.no-ip.org @ http://counter.li.org HOG # US1244711 Photo Album: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/gallery2 --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-help@opensuse.org

* Pascal Bleser [06-05-06 16:35]:

You're not actually blaming smart for timeouts on the software.opensuse.org HTTP server, are you ? ;)

No, frustration with the update system .....

As Eberhard mentioned, you can use ftp-1.gwdg.de as a mirror.

Added his suggestions manually.

Here's how to do it with smart:

smart mirror --add http://software.opensuse.org/download \ http://ftp-1.gwdg.de/pub/opensuse/repositories

(that's a one-liner)

One liners are good. Will try after present update completes (if). tks, -- Patrick Shanahan Registered Linux User #207535 http://wahoo.no-ip.org @ http://counter.li.org HOG # US1244711 Photo Album: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/gallery2 --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-help@opensuse.org

On Monday 05 June 2006 15:32, Pascal Bleser wrote:

Works perfectly for me (and I haven't heard that complaint about it, at least not yet ;)).

At the minute, Smart is by far the most reliable and easily-installed package manager for SUSE. Apt-rpm may do more specialised things, but for everyday users, just install Smart and you'll find things very easy. You need to have the following Python packages installed: python-numeric rpm-python python-gtk These are available at: http://download.opensuse.org/distribution/SL-10.0-OSS/inst-source/suse/i586 (or similar, eg replace 10.0 with 10.1, i586 with your architecture, etc) if you do not have them on your install media. Then install smart, smart-gui and (optionally) smart-ksmarttray from Pascal's site: http://ftp.skynet.be/pub/suser-guru/rpm/packages/System/smart/ as he suggested. Pascal is doing a terrific job with Smart, as Richard Bos does with apt-rpm. -- Pob hwyl / Best wishes Kevin Donnelly www.kyfieithu.co.uk - KDE yn Gymraeg www.eurfa.org.uk - Geiriadur rhydd i'r Gymraeg www.rhedadur.org.uk - Rhedeg berfau Cymraeg www.cymrux.org.uk - Linux Cymraeg ar un CD --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-help@opensuse.org

Smart isn't so smart......d'led something that KDE doesn't like, and KILLED KDE...won't start up. Thankfully, I still have Gnome.

Also for me KDE did not want to start - maybe it's the same as your problem. The solution was: for some reason I still (or again?) had kdebase3-5.1 while all others were 3.5.3 (check either with smart gui or rpm -qi kdebase3). So I just updated l channels and upgraded kdebase - now the 3.5.3 version and voila, KDE runs again.

Fred gl

P.S.: I know this list is not for answers (or at least not yet...) but I could not resist... -- G�nter Lichtenberg ========>mailto:lichten@arcor.de --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-help@opensuse.org

On Wednesday 07 June 2006 12:02 pm, Günter Lichtenberg wrote:

...

Smart isn't so smart......d'led something that KDE doesn't like, and KILLED KDE...won't start up. Thankfully, I still have Gnome.

Also for me KDE did not want to start - maybe it's the same as your problem. The solution was: for some reason I still (or again?) had kdebase3-5.1 while all others were 3.5.3 (check either with smart gui or rpm -qi kdebase3). So I just updated l channels and upgraded kdebase - now the 3.5.3 version and voila, KDE runs again.

...

Fred

gl

P.S.: I know this list is not for answers (or at least not yet...) but I could not resist.

NOT a problem........TOO many people need solutions for problems that never should have been in a released product, so not to worry. 'Correct......the KDEbase is either blown away by Smart or the wrong version has been/is installed. Fred -- Paid purchaser of ALL SuSE Linux releases since 6.x --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-help@opensuse.org