On Wednesday June 30 2010 18:17:28 Guido Berhoerster wrote:

* Jan Engelhardt [2010-06-30 17:11]:

...

== Statement ==

We deliver a well-balanced platform that equally appeals to end users, power users, developers and server administrators. (Other fields we currently do?)

== Activities ==

=== Will do... ===

* Do as we always did

* Good compromise between actuality and stability * Agreeable release cycle between 8 and 12 months * Support for the 3 most current releases

I certainly would love this - even if it is just some core for servers that gets longer support. Another alternative would be to make some LTS once in a while.

...

* Continue the naturally growth of openSUSE:Factory

by incorporating contributors' submissions

* provide a low entry-barrier for potential contributors (through the OBS it is probably easier to make contributions than any other Linux distro)

...

* For end users

* Deliver both KDE and GNOME desktops

(with a focus on KDE. By laws of physics we are required to provide an antipole to the otherwise GNOME-ridden world ;-)

Heh, before the flame war starts once again stick with the "all desktop are considered equal" maxim ;D (I use only KDE myself but I think that openSUSE does a pretty good job in having the different alternatives polished and is one of the few distros that can claim this so this shouldn't get changed)

...

* Covering a multitude of areas of interest

(publishing:/latex, OOo, graphics:/gimp, inkscape, etc.)

* For developers

* C, C++, Perl, Python, Java and the usual satellite libraries

(boost, libwhatdoIknow, maven, ...)

* For power users and sysadmins

* Agreeable command line experience (I can quantify that if desired..) * Xen VM * Networking Services (dns,http,etc etc etc)

* easy creation of specialized derivatives and applicances (through Studio)

...

=== Try to... ===

* Deliver a third, more minimalistic desktop environment

* Speed it up (doesn't everybody? :-)

* minimal system (we're ok I'd say)

* blubb.

We already do with the LXDE desktop which will make its debut with the 11.3 release :)

...

* Do The Right Thing™ rather than just doing what the loudest voice says - i.e. critical analysis towards hyped items

* Better marketing, in particular communicating our existing strengths and unique features (i.e. competitive advantages)

...

=== Will... ===

* not solely focus on a narrow band topic only

* not necessarily do something just because Ubuntu does it

+10 for this proposal.

You should put in on the wiki.

/signed Merge this together with Martins "poweruser" proposal and the developer one and we have the best IMHO. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org

Le mercredi 30 juin 2010, à 19:30 +0200, Jan Engelhardt a écrit :

On Wednesday 2010-06-30 18:56, Stephan Kleine wrote:

...

...

...

* Deliver both KDE and GNOME desktops

(with a focus on KDE. By laws of physics we are required to provide an antipole to the otherwise GNOME-ridden world)

Heh, before the flame war starts once again stick with the "all desktop are considered equal" maxim ;D

My point exactly: We have to push KDE, to make the situation equal. :)

(Rationale: GNOME has more exposure due to being in Fedora and Bountu.)

Let's try to not open this topic again. Last time was not fun, really. Vincent -- Les gens heureux ne sont pas pressés. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org

On Wednesday 30 June 2010 18:56:08 Stephan Kleine wrote:

[...] Merge this together with Martins "poweruser" proposal and the developer one and we have the best IMHO.

I've tried some merging with Martin's "poweruser" and Jan has updated the proposal: http://en.opensuse.org/Documents/Strategy/Status_quo We have never documented the Status Quo yet, so I think it's worth while to document that. I'd ask everybody to review the page and send comments - not where you want to go but where are we today. Is that what we've written a good description of the status quo? What is missing from the status quo? What's wrong? One thing that was in Martin's proposal under "We will not do anymore": * Supporting old hardware and non-mainstream architectures * Supporting form-factors that are not workstation, laptop, server or netbook What is the best way to describe the current situation regarding form-factory and architectures? Andreas -- Andreas Jaeger, Program Manager openSUSE, aj@{novell.com,opensuse.org} Twitter: jaegerandi | Identica: jaegerandi SUSE LINUX Products GmbH, GF: Markus Rex, HRB 16746 (AG Nürnberg) Maxfeldstr. 5, 90409 Nürnberg, Germany GPG fingerprint = 93A3 365E CE47 B889 DF7F FED1 389A 563C C272 A126

On Thursday 08 July 2010 11:48:53 Guido Berhoerster wrote:

* Andreas Jaeger [2010-07-08 10:55]:

...

On Wednesday 30 June 2010 18:56:08 Stephan Kleine wrote:

...

[...] Merge this together with Martins "poweruser" proposal and the developer one and we have the best IMHO.

I've tried some merging with Martin's "poweruser" and Jan has updated the proposal:

http://en.opensuse.org/Documents/Strategy/Status_quo

We have never documented the Status Quo yet, so I think it's worth while to document that.

This was not intended as a _documentation_ of the status quo.

My goal was to create a documentation of the status quo - I would have added a third page but Jan merged it in his proposal, so let's go from there.

Although it does that as well, it primarily constitutes a _proposal for a strategy_ which aims to focus on and stick to

Guido, Jan calls it "Status quo" with a purpose.

existing strengths of the project while addressing some deficiencies. In fact it incorporates parts of the other proposals and should stand adjacent to them as an equal alternative.

Andreas -- Andreas Jaeger, Program Manager openSUSE, aj@{novell.com,opensuse.org} Twitter: jaegerandi | Identica: jaegerandi SUSE LINUX Products GmbH, GF: Markus Rex, HRB 16746 (AG Nürnberg) Maxfeldstr. 5, 90409 Nürnberg, Germany GPG fingerprint = 93A3 365E CE47 B889 DF7F FED1 389A 563C C272 A126

Andreas Jaeger wrote:

One thing that was in Martin's proposal under "We will not do anymore": * Supporting old hardware and non-mainstream architectures * Supporting form-factors that are not workstation, laptop, server or netbook

What is the best way to describe the current situation regarding form-factory and architectures?

I'm not sure we need to state "what we will not do any more". When it comes to hardware, it's better to state "what we will do": What we will do: * endeavour to support primary form-factors: workstation, laptop, server and netbook. * endeavour to support current hardware and mainstream architectures. I understand this definition of "current hardware" is as fuzzy as "old hardware", but I doubt if anyone will be able to come up with an exact definition. -- Per Jessen, Zürich (23.1°C) -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org

On Thursday 2010-07-08 13:02, Andreas Jaeger wrote:

On Thursday 08 July 2010 12:11:16 Per Jessen wrote:

...

Andreas Jaeger wrote:

...

One thing that was in Martin's proposal under "We will not do anymore": * Supporting old hardware and non-mainstream architectures * Supporting form-factors that are not workstation, laptop, server

or netbook

What is the best way to describe the current situation regarding form-factory and architectures?

I'm not sure we need to state "what we will not do any more". When it comes to hardware, it's better to state "what we will do":

What we will do:

* endeavour to support primary form-factors: workstation, laptop, server and netbook. * endeavour to support current hardware and mainstream architectures.

I understand this definition of "current hardware" is as fuzzy as "old hardware", but I doubt if anyone will be able to come up with an exact definition.

mainstream architectures are x86 and x86-64. How do we describe the current status of support for Arm, PowerPC, Sparc etc?

"Still in development". -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org

On Thursday 2010-07-08 14:15, Per Jessen wrote:

...

...

What we will do:

* endeavour to support primary form-factors: workstation, laptop, server and netbook. * endeavour to support current hardware and mainstream architectures.

I understand this definition of "current hardware" is as fuzzy as "old hardware", but I doubt if anyone will be able to come up with an exact definition.

mainstream architectures are x86 and x86-64. How do we describe the current status of support for Arm, PowerPC, Sparc etc?

Non-existent?

I wouldn't be _that_ nihilistic :-) http://download.ares.medozas.de/Black_Ares%3a/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org

On Wednesday 30 June 2010 18:17:28 Guido Berhoerster wrote:

[...] You should put in on the wiki.

Jan put it up and I linked it from: http://en.opensuse.org/Documents/Strategy Andreas -- Andreas Jaeger, Program Manager openSUSE, aj@{novell.com,opensuse.org} Twitter: jaegerandi | Identica: jaegerandi SUSE LINUX Products GmbH, GF: Markus Rex, HRB 16746 (AG Nürnberg) Maxfeldstr. 5, 90409 Nürnberg, Germany GPG fingerprint = 93A3 365E CE47 B889 DF7F FED1 389A 563C C272 A126