[opensuse-project] Automatix for openSUSE...
Hi all, Having just returned from using Ubuntu as my main OS for a few months (I give another distro a go every now and then, but I have returned everytime so far :-), there is one thing that Ubuntu users have available that makes it very easy to setup a new machine, and that is Automatix. http://getautomatix.com/ . Automatix has got a good wrap lately with the admission that Michael Dell (of Dell Computers) uses it on his personal computer. Ideally one would solve it without yet another way to install things. What stops us (technically, legally etc) creating a similar meta repository for openSUSE, that doesn't host the actual packages but just pointers to download them from the 3rd parties? eg: http://download.skype.com/linux/skype-1.4.0.118-suse.i586.rpm http://download.gizmoproject.com/GizmoDownload/gizmo-project-3.1.0.77-1.i386... http://download3.vmware.com/software/vmplayer/VMware-player-2.0.1-55017.i386... etc ie. it covers 3rd party packages that we can't host or redistribute, but a nice central location that is a great benefit for the user. pflodo Peter Flodin. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
On 10/14/07, Peter Flodin
Hi all,
Hi Peter!
Having just returned from using Ubuntu as my main OS for a few months (I give another distro a go every now and then, but I have returned everytime so far :-), there is one thing that Ubuntu users have available that makes it very easy to setup a new machine, and that is Automatix. http://getautomatix.com/
On the contrary, as I recall it was a temporarily proprietary script, had an author who would pretty much hate any form of constructive criticism, did various bad things (like dpkg forces), dangerously packaged, and was officially thought of as dangerous by the technical board there. . Automatix has got a good wrap
lately with the admission that Michael Dell (of Dell Computers) uses it on his personal computer.
The technical board there afaik explicitly recommends that users do not use it. But it doesn't have to be that way. The mission of the script is noble enough; it was just terribly executed. So what do we have so far? The main thing in use these days is: * Two ymps (for kde and gnome respectively) which use 1-click-install to handle many of the necessary things. See http://opensuse-community.org/Restricted_Formats/10.3 * The excellent konvenientSUSE, which is a kommander script handling a lot of that stuff http://www.kde-apps.org/content/show.php?content=43378 The problem with the YMPs in this scenario is that they're repository-bound, so i.e. since skype don't have the openSUSE RPM in a repository, we can't provide it as an option in the 1-click-install. I've contacted them about doing this, so we'll see.
Ideally one would solve it without yet another way to install things. What stops us (technically, legally etc) creating a similar meta repository for openSUSE, that doesn't host the actual packages but just pointers to download them from the 3rd parties? eg: http://download.skype.com/linux/skype-1.4.0.118-suse.i586.rpm http://download.gizmoproject.com/GizmoDownload/gizmo-project-3.1.0.77-1.i386... http://download3.vmware.com/software/vmplayer/VMware-player-2.0.1-55017.i386... etc ie. it covers 3rd party packages that we can't host or redistribute, but a nice central location that is a great benefit for the user.
These might be good ideas for konvenientSUSE, so you might want to think about suggesting them to Martin Schlander http://en.opensuse.org/User:Cb400f who created and maintains it. Kind thoughts, -- Francis Giannaros http://francis.giannaros.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
On 10/15/07, Francis Giannaros
The technical board there afaik explicitly recommends that users do not use it.
On 10/15/07, Druid
1) Do some homework and go search about how uglyhackish and problematic is that script. Even I know that.
Ok, so Automatix has some implementation issues that can cause disasters. Clearly the plan was never to actually run Automatix on openSUSE. I still maintain that Ubuntu users regard it highly because it makes life easy for them.
The problem with the YMPs in this scenario is that they're repository-bound, so i.e. since skype don't have the openSUSE RPM in a repository, we can't provide it as an option in the 1-click-install.
One could maybe create a repository, and then use "HTTP 301 Redirect" to get the webserver to redirect the request for the .rpm to the URL of the actual .rpm on the 3rd party site.
Kind thoughts,
Likewise, Pflodo Peter Flodin. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
Peter Flodin escribió:
Ok, so Automatix has some implementation issues that can cause disasters.
some ? :-D it is clearly a hack , check the reload nautilus function ;)
Clearly the plan was never to actually run Automatix on openSUSE.
AFAICS the plan is to improve YMP's.
I still maintain that Ubuntu users regard it highly because it makes life easy for them.
Like YMPs do for ours.
One could maybe create a repository, and then use "HTTP 301 Redirect" to get the webserver to redirect the request for the .rpm to the URL of the actual .rpm on the 3rd party site.
have you read the redistribution agreement ? http://www.skype.com/company/legal/promote/distributionterms.html "1.4 You will not distribute Skype Software through other media than CD-ROM or DVD, unless approved by Skype in an explicit written communication to You" is that clear enough right ? ;-) -- "You don't have to burn books to destroy a culture. Just get people to stop reading them." --Ray Bradbury Cristian Rodríguez R, Core Services SUSE LINUX Products GmbH Research & Development http://www.opensuse.org/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
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---------------------------------------------------------------------To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.orgFor additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
On 16/10/2007, Peter Flodin
But you can't give me an YMP for Google Earth, or Skype.
I believe google have a repository for some of their stuff in http://dl.google.com/linux/rpm/stable/i386/ . If google earth is in there then anyone could make a YMP to install it. Skype isn't at present in a repository, either the vendor needs to host it in a repository, or libzypp support installing individual packages which are not in a repository. I believe this is on the feature plan anyway. It might even be possible for a community member to host rpm-md metadata which points to third party applications without hosting them. I'm not sure whether that would work, but I believe rpm-md is flexible enough for it - depends whether libzypp will break horribly or not. In any case this isn't a limitation of YMPs -- Benjamin Weber --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
Den Monday 15 October 2007 00:25:11 skrev Francis Giannaros:
ie. it covers 3rd party packages that we can't host or redistribute, but a nice central location that is a great benefit for the user.
These might be good ideas for konvenientSUSE, so you might want to think about suggesting them to Martin Schlander http://en.opensuse.org/User:Cb400f who created and maintains it.
I decided to discontinue konviSUSE for 10.3 because of the one-click-installer+ymps, opensuse-codec-installer and the "community repositories" yast module - making it obsolete imo. Wrt. 3rd party non-free stuff, I never wanted to support that beyond Adobe Flash, Sun Java and 3D drivers. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
1) Do some homework and go search about how uglyhackish and
problematic is that script. Even I know that.
2) There are YMPs in suse
Marcio
---
Druid
On 10/14/07, Peter Flodin
Hi all,
Having just returned from using Ubuntu as my main OS for a few months (I give another distro a go every now and then, but I have returned everytime so far :-), there is one thing that Ubuntu users have available that makes it very easy to setup a new machine, and that is Automatix. http://getautomatix.com/ . Automatix has got a good wrap lately with the admission that Michael Dell (of Dell Computers) uses it on his personal computer.
Ideally one would solve it without yet another way to install things. What stops us (technically, legally etc) creating a similar meta repository for openSUSE, that doesn't host the actual packages but just pointers to download them from the 3rd parties? eg: http://download.skype.com/linux/skype-1.4.0.118-suse.i586.rpm http://download.gizmoproject.com/GizmoDownload/gizmo-project-3.1.0.77-1.i386... http://download3.vmware.com/software/vmplayer/VMware-player-2.0.1-55017.i386... etc ie. it covers 3rd party packages that we can't host or redistribute, but a nice central location that is a great benefit for the user.
pflodo Peter Flodin. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
--------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
On 14/10/2007, Peter Flodin
Hi all,
Having just returned from using Ubuntu as my main OS for a few months (I give another distro a go every now and then, but I have returned everytime so far :-), there is one thing that Ubuntu users have available that makes it very easy to setup a new machine, and that is Automatix. http://getautomatix.com/ . Automatix has got a good wrap lately with the admission that Michael Dell (of Dell Computers) uses it on his personal computer.
It also has many criticisms, e.g. http://mjg59.livejournal.com/77440.html
Ideally one would solve it without yet another way to install things. What stops us (technically, legally etc) creating a similar meta repository for openSUSE, that doesn't host the actual packages but just pointers to download them from the 3rd parties?
There's nothing stopping this really, except it probably can't be hosted by Novell.
eg: http://download.skype.com/linux/skype-1.4.0.118-suse.i586.rpm http://download.gizmoproject.com/GizmoDownload/gizmo-project-3.1.0.77-1.i386... http://download3.vmware.com/software/vmplayer/VMware-player-2.0.1-55017.i386... etc ie. it covers 3rd party packages that we can't host or redistribute, but a nice central location that is a great benefit for the user.
These third party packages can be linked with a YMP link from any webpage, for example the codecs installation on http://opensuse-community.org/Restricted_Formats/10.3 There is a project to create a complete community hosted software portal which could list all opensuse & third party packages http://en.opensuse.org/Software_Portal . Unfortunately this has stalled somewhat due to lack of time of those involved. But the plan is to have a portal where users can find software for opensuse from any source, and install it easily. There is also my package search on http://packages.opensuse-community.org which I plan to add "install now" links to results this week. (I'm currently working on some major improvements to the search itself, the install now links are next on my todo). -- Benjamin Weber --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
On Mon, 2007-10-15 at 08:10 +1000, Peter Flodin wrote:
Hi all,
Having just returned from using Ubuntu as my main OS for a few months (I give another distro a go every now and then, but I have returned everytime so far :-), there is one thing that Ubuntu users have available that makes it very easy to setup a new machine, and that is Automatix. http://getautomatix.com/ . Automatix has got a good wrap lately with the admission that Michael Dell (of Dell Computers) uses it on his personal computer.
Ideally one would solve it without yet another way to install things. What stops us (technically, legally etc) creating a similar meta repository for openSUSE, that doesn't host the actual packages but just pointers to download them from the 3rd parties? eg: http://download.skype.com/linux/skype-1.4.0.118-suse.i586.rpm http://download.gizmoproject.com/GizmoDownload/gizmo-project-3.1.0.77-1.i386... http://download3.vmware.com/software/vmplayer/VMware-player-2.0.1-55017.i386... etc ie. it covers 3rd party packages that we can't host or redistribute, but a nice central location that is a great benefit for the user.
pflodo Peter Flodin. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
Automatix is a disaster waiting to happen. Reading your arguments I get the impression you haven't tested openSUSE 10.3 yet. Otherwise you would know that nowadays guru's repositories have been merged with packman. And you can easily install the packman repository through yast. Making software like automatix irrelevant (not to mention the new opensuse packages site). -- Regards, Aniruddha Please adhere to the OpenSUSE_mailing_list_netiquette http://en.opensuse.org/OpenSUSE_mailing_list_netiquette --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
participants (7)
-
Aniruddha -
Benji Weber -
Cristian Rodriguez -
Druid -
Francis Giannaros -
Martin Schlander -
Peter Flodin