[opensuse-packaging] fedora needs some deltarpm love :)
Hi, let me first introduce myself. I'm a Fedora contributor and Fedora Ambassador for Croatia, but I'm not directly part od Fedora board or Fedora Project. Still I would like to ask you for assistance in one matter that you have more experience dealing that Fedora - and that is deltarpm. Fedora 9 features list has Presto[1] on it - it is a yum plugin that handles deltarpms during updates. Currently the deltarpm integration is stuck because the infrastructure team is stuck[2] in its implementation. Is there some way in which you can help with your longer experience with handling deltarpm files so that this greatly needed feature comes on by default in Fedora 9? Is there some other list that is more specialized on this sort of topics that I would be better of trying elsewere? Cheers, Valent from Croatia. [1] http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/FeaturePresto [2] http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Infrastructure/PrestoBuildsysIntegration -- http://kernelreloaded.blog385.com/ linux, blog, anime, spirituality, windsurf, wireless registered as user #367004 with the Linux Counter, http://counter.li.org. ICQ: 2125241, Skype: valent.turkovic --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-packaging+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-packaging+help@opensuse.org
I am happy to see other distros using deltarpm (and deltaiso)... -- -Alexey Eremenko "Technologov" --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-packaging+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-packaging+help@opensuse.org
On Feb 9, 2008 2:12 PM, Alexey Eremenko
I am happy to see other distros using deltarpm (and deltaiso)...
Me too. Can you help out in some way regarding the topic? Valent. -- http://kernelreloaded.blog385.com/ linux, blog, anime, spirituality, windsurf, wireless registered as user #367004 with the Linux Counter, http://counter.li.org. ICQ: 2125241, Skype: valent.turkovic --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-packaging+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-packaging+help@opensuse.org
Actually from what I see, you're buildging a whole infrastructure around deltarpm.. nice... very nice... So you're question seems to be not how-to use deltarpm, but how-to build distro infrastructure around it. But openSUSE doesn't have a real infrastructure around deltarpms (AFAIK). I.e. We only make delta ISOs to update, like openSUSE BETA1->BETA2. We do not have delta ISO build factory, online updates, and stuff like that. Building such an infrastructure is not an easy task. Deltrarpm usage is really simply: (it has 4 main commands) -makedeltarpm -makedeltaiso -applydeltarpm -applydeltaiso In openSUSE it is used mainly for distributing BETA DVDs. I think, that "deltarpm" for online updates must have 2 versions - for "latest" updates and for "RTM" (release to manufacture) updates (i.e. for users, that just installed Fedora from DVD, but want to do online update). So perhaps there needs to be 2 mirrors (for "latest" and "RTM") users, and they must be pre-registered in /etc/yum.repo... Garbage collection must function only on the "latest" mirror. This way, if user has not online-updated his system for several days (say he forgot to update last night), the RPMs that are updated to latest on mirror were "Garbage collected", so he will not be able to use "deltarpms". He will need to do update from normal RPM mirror, but only the RPMs that were updated last night will be updated this way. At least I see it this way... I see, that you also have hi-level dependency resolver (yum) integration with deltrarpm, while we have nothing like this for our (zypper). Since we only patch DVDs offline, we don't need dependency resolver integration with deltarpm. But very interesting idea indeed... -- -Alexey Eremenko "Technologov" --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-packaging+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-packaging+help@opensuse.org
On 09/02/2008, Alexey Eremenko
Actually from what I see, you're buildging a whole infrastructure around deltarpm.. nice... very nice...
So you're question seems to be not how-to use deltarpm, but how-to build distro infrastructure around it.
But openSUSE doesn't have a real infrastructure around deltarpms (AFAIK).
I.e. We only make delta ISOs to update, like openSUSE BETA1->BETA2.
We do not have delta ISO build factory, online updates, and stuff like that. Building such an infrastructure is not an easy task.
Deltarpms are used for online updates to released products. see the .delta.rpms here http://download.opensuse.org/update/10.3/rpm/i586/ These are referenced from the patch*.xml files here http://download.opensuse.org/update/10.3/repodata/ which are referenced from the main rpm-md metadata. See also http://en.opensuse.org/Standards/Rpm_Metadata and and http://en.opensuse.org/Libzypp/Metadata/repomd/patches , although this documentation is somewhat incomplete. -- Benjamin Weber --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-packaging+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-packaging+help@opensuse.org
Hi, On Sat, 9 Feb 2008, Alexey Eremenko wrote:
I.e. We only make delta ISOs to update, like openSUSE BETA1->BETA2.
That's not true. deltarpms are also used for patches to released products. And deltarpm is also one core of our mirroring structure, drpmsync. Valent: you might want to wait until Thursday, where our deltarpm author returns from vacation. Otherwise state specific questions and we might be able to help. AFAIU it's more a question of procedure, right? Like "how to best built deltarpms?".
I see, that you also have hi-level dependency resolver (yum) integration with deltrarpm, while we have nothing like this for our (zypper).
I don't know what you mean. deltarpms itself have no dependencies. rpms have. deltarpms are merely a mean to efficiently download rpms. A solver doesn't enter the game. Our solver (zypp) is integrated with package management (zypp again), and support deltarpms natively.
Since we only patch DVDs offline,
This is false ...
we don't need dependency resolver integration with deltarpm.
... hence this is irrelevant (and in fact also false). Ciao, Michael. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-packaging+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-packaging+help@opensuse.org
Sorry dudes, perhaps I was lacking information !
I see, that you also have hi-level dependency resolver (yum) integration with deltrarpm, while we have nothing like this for our (zypper).
I don't know what you mean. deltarpms itself have no dependencies. rpms have. deltarpms are merely a mean to efficiently download rpms. A solver doesn't enter the game. Our solver (zypp) is integrated with package management (zypp again), and support deltarpms natively.
But if you some repo "X" has deltarpms in it, is it possible to install those with zypp ? -- -Alexey Eremenko "Technologov" --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-packaging+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-packaging+help@opensuse.org
Hi, On Sun, 10 Feb 2008, Alexey Eremenko wrote:
I don't know what you mean. deltarpms itself have no dependencies. rpms have. deltarpms are merely a mean to efficiently download rpms. A solver doesn't enter the game. Our solver (zypp) is integrated with package management (zypp again), and support deltarpms natively.
But if you some repo "X" has deltarpms in it, is it possible to install those with zypp ?
Yes, of course. A repo never only contains just deltarpms, it always also contains (at least) the full rpms (the targets of the deltarpms). It can contain multiple deltarpms between several underlying versions. If zypp gets the request to download rpm "X-1.1", it will look on the users system if it already has "X" in some version installed (say X-1.0a), then looks if the repo happens to have a delta from X-1.0a to X-1.1 and prefers to download that instead of the full rpm. I.e. deltarpms really are just a download accelerator. If a matching deltarpm doesn't exist zypp simply will download the full rpm (or if that exists maybe a patch rpm, but those meanwhile are obsolete as they have too many problems by design). Ciao, Michael. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-packaging+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-packaging+help@opensuse.org
participants (4)
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Alexey Eremenko -
Benji Weber -
Michael Matz -
Valent Turkovic