A: File indexing can be disabled by adding the users' home folder to the System Settings -> Desktop Search -> Do not search in these locations list.
The thing is, not everybody is going to read the documentation or know to do this. How hard is it to have a GUI option to turn indexing off? You sound so positive that this foisted feature is wanted on a wide scale, but I'm coming across quite a few threads where people are talking about not liking it. It sounds like there are also quite a few unhappy users over Baloo when searching bug reports. Extrapolate this situation, and you have a lot more people who wouldn't like Baloo if they knew what it was or what it was doing, or you have people that understand its shortcomings and aren't whatsoever involved in forums or any mailing list. It sounds like there's a great deal defensiveness going around over not only the functionality of Baloo, but the decision to hold steadfast with it being unremovable, its default options and behavior (opt-out and not opt-in), and not asking the user permission to start indexing upon initial login. This whole situation with adding the $HOME folder to turn indexing sounds to me like putting a key in a lock, turning it, and the deadbolt goes the opposite way. It makes no sense to me. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org
On Thursday 01 May 2014 10:17:04 Sam M wrote:
A: File indexing can be disabled by adding the users' home folder to the System Settings -> Desktop Search -> Do not search in these locations list. The thing is, not everybody is going to read the documentation or know to do this. How hard is it to have a GUI option to turn indexing off? You sound so positive that this foisted feature is wanted on a wide scale, but I'm coming across quite a few threads where people are talking about not liking it. It sounds like there are also quite a few unhappy users over Baloo when searching bug reports. Extrapolate this situation, and you have a lot more people who wouldn't like Baloo if they knew what it was or what it was doing, or you have people that understand its shortcomings and aren't whatsoever involved in forums or any mailing list.
I think that's nonsense. Nobody bothers about this who doesn't know what it is, really. It is very unobtrusive (ok, in this version we have a few issues that are being ironed out, but nobody who has no clue uses kde:current anyway). Home users don't know how to disable the search in Mac OS X, Windows, their Android phone - and they have no problem.
It sounds like there's a great deal defensiveness going around over not only the functionality of Baloo, but the decision to hold steadfast with it being unremovable, its default options and behavior (opt-out and not opt-in), and not asking the user permission to start indexing upon initial login. This whole situation with adding the $HOME folder to turn indexing sounds to me like putting a key in a lock, turning it, and the deadbolt goes the opposite way. It makes no sense to me.
Maybe it would be nice if the configuration dialog would explain that if you add your home to the 'do not index' list, it won't index anything. Although that seems pretty bloody obvious, what else would you expect it to do? Otherwise, there's no reason to change anything, imho. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org
On Thu, 1 May 2014 19:34:02 Jos Poortvliet wrote:
[...]
Maybe it would be nice if the configuration dialog would explain that if you add your home to the 'do not index' list, it won't index anything. Although that seems pretty bloody obvious, what else would you expect it to do?
Maybe, index everything else that is not explicitly excluded, since that now appears to be the development philosophy? I mean, after all, it has currently indexed a couple of Terabytes of video, audio and image files that are not sitting in my home directory, and lots of those are on external USB3 drives that have folders that are mounted below mount points outside /home (at boot time from /etc/fstab). How did they get indexed if it only indexes stuff under /home? I'll take a guess - they were already indexed by Nepomuk so they got imported during the conversion. Hence, they're searchable - otherwise they would not be. Actually, what I would expect it to do (because this is NOT Windows) is index exactly what I tell it to index - nothing more, nothing less. But nobody asked, and I don't recall seeing ANY requests for beta testers for this feature on either opensuse-kde or opensuse mailing lists (the only two to which I'm subscribed).
Otherwise, there's no reason to change anything, imho.
Of course, because it works for your use case. Don't assume that just because it "works for me" automatically means "it works for everyone else". BTW, re software testing, I have years of experience in both automated and manual software testing and I well understand that with modern software of the complexity of a beast like KDE it is practically impossible to test every possible path through a program and therefore to find every possible lurking bug prior to release. That simply won't happen. There will always be a "corner case" that will cause the program execution to take a path that wasn't predicted (and therefore tested) during development. C'est la vie. That is not what folks are commenting on. It is the 180 degree phase shift in design philosophy that those who have commented are unhappy about. KDE is not Windows, MacOSX, Gnome, Unity, LXDE etc. It should not try to be. It should stick to doing what it does best - being KDE. :) -- ============================================================== Rodney Baker VK5ZTV rodney.baker@iinet.net.au ============================================================== -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org
2014-05-01 15:08 GMT-03:00 Rodney Baker
Actually, what I would expect it to do (because this is NOT Windows) is index exactly what I tell it to index - nothing more, nothing less. But nobody asked, and I don't recall seeing ANY requests for beta testers for this feature on either opensuse-kde or opensuse mailing lists (the only two to which I'm subscribed).
What I, as a "normal" user (just the official repos + packman) should expect or know what I want to index? I have no idea. So yes, I like this enabled by default and include all by default behaviour. If I don't like some results I can exclude the folder or filetype from the search engine, its far more easy than to know which folders I might have to add to get the desired search results. Regards, Luiz -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org
On 05/01/2014 01:34 PM, Jos Poortvliet wrote:
On Thursday 01 May 2014 10:17:04 Sam M wrote:
A: File indexing can be disabled by adding the users' home folder to the System Settings -> Desktop Search -> Do not search in these locations list. The thing is, not everybody is going to read the documentation or know to do this. How hard is it to have a GUI option to turn indexing off? You sound so positive that this foisted feature is wanted on a wide scale, but I'm coming across quite a few threads where people are talking about not liking it. It sounds like there are also quite a few unhappy users over Baloo when searching bug reports. Extrapolate this situation, and you have a lot more people who wouldn't like Baloo if they knew what it was or what it was doing, or you have people that understand its shortcomings and aren't whatsoever involved in forums or any mailing list.
I think that's nonsense. Nobody bothers about this who doesn't know what it is, really. It is very unobtrusive (ok, in this version we have a few issues that are being ironed out, but nobody who has no clue uses kde:current anyway).
Home users don't know how to disable the search in Mac OS X, Windows, their Android phone - and they have no problem.
It sounds like there's a great deal defensiveness going around over not only the functionality of Baloo, but the decision to hold steadfast with it being unremovable, its default options and behavior (opt-out and not opt-in), and not asking the user permission to start indexing upon initial login. This whole situation with adding the $HOME folder to turn indexing sounds to me like putting a key in a lock, turning it, and the deadbolt goes the opposite way. It makes no sense to me.
Maybe it would be nice if the configuration dialog would explain that if you add your home to the 'do not index' list, it won't index anything. Although that seems pretty bloody obvious, what else would you expect it to do?
Otherwise, there's no reason to change anything, imho.
+1 -- Cheers! Roman -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org
On Thursday, May 01, 2014 10:17:04 Sam M wrote:
A: File indexing can be disabled by adding the users' home folder to the System Settings -> Desktop Search -> Do not search in these locations list.
The thing is, not everybody is going to read the documentation or know to do this. How hard is it to have a GUI option to turn indexing off? You sound so positive that this foisted feature is wanted on a wide scale, but I'm coming across quite a few threads where people are talking about not liking it. It sounds like there are also quite a few unhappy users over Baloo when searching bug reports. Extrapolate this situation, and you have a lot more people who wouldn't like Baloo if they knew what it was or what it was doing, or you have people that understand its shortcomings and aren't whatsoever involved in forums or any mailing list.
You are making a false assumption. As of the last "best guess" there are something like 440,000 users of openSUSE. KDE is the default desktop. So just for the sake of argument, lets say that 2/3rds of those installs are running KDE. 440,000 x .66 = 290,400 users. Now, how many of those users are tracking KDE:Current, rather than just running with the default 4.11.4 from the 13.1 Repos? I have no idea, but for the sake of argument, as most users never do actually change the defaults (a choice, I MIGHT add, that you made, by enabling KDE:Current, or KDE:Distro:Factory, or whatever non-base repo you decided to enable), lets say 3/4 of that userbase is still using defaults, which are still using nepomuk as the indexer. 290,400 x .25 = 72,600 Users, that have KDE repositories, other than the default 13.1 repos enabled. So, just as an intellectual exercise, we have 72,600 users that are using openSUSE KDE 4.13.x with the baloo indexer at the moment. Now, going and looking at the openSUSE bugzilla, and doing a simple search for "baloo" I find, wow, look at that! Not a single open bug report against Baloo. https://bugzilla.novell.com/buglist.cgi?quicksearch=baloo. So, we have, for the sake of argument, 72,600 Users of baloo, and ZERO bug reports, and near as I can tell, Five of you here on the mailing list, complaining about baloo, and the way it is implemented. Five Users is what percentage of 72,600? Well, according to percentagecalculator.net, it is 0.0068870523415977955% Statistically insignificant. Perhaps in the overall ecosystem of all distributions, there is a higher number of folks complaining about baloo, but I'm only concerned about openSUSE, as this is the openSUSE-KDE mailing list. So please,check your egos at the door. It's not that we don't care, it's because you don't matter, and frankly, I'm getting pretty bloody tired of this thread.
participants (6)
-
Jos Poortvliet -
Luiz Fernando Ranghetti -
Rodney Baker -
Roman Bysh -
Sam M -
Shawn W Dunn