On Wednesday, November 13, 2013 07:38:03 AM C wrote:

On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 10:19 PM, Felix Miata wrote:

...

http://lists.kde.org/?l=kde-linux&m=138424961802070&w=2 https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=318061

Someone please find a realistic solution for this soon. It's a miserable blight for KDE in 13.1 to begin life this way.

I have a feeling you will struggle to find a fix for it. As was stated in the thread you linked... floppies are obsolete (for many years) and finding someone with the knowledge AND incentive fix an issue for hopelessly obsolete hardware (even if in your use case, you still use them) is going to be very difficult... or more likely impossible.

I haven't seen a computer with a floppy drive in 5 or 6 years now... and now, CD/DVD drives are becoming rare... soon to be obsolete as well.

C.

It seems from bug-reports that this is a udisks2 problem perhaps adding ENV{UDISKS_IGNORE}="1" to the fd* statement to 80-udisks2.rules in /lib/udev/rules.d/ would hide the problem at least. Like so : # Tag floppy drives since they need special care # PC floppy drives # KERNEL=="fd*", ENV{ID_DRIVE_FLOPPY}="1", ENV{UDISKS_IGNORE}="1" Sorry i have no fdd to test with. Mark -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org

On 2013-11-13 07:38 (GMT+0100) C composed:

Felix Miata wrote:

...

http://lists.kde.org/?l=kde-linux&m=138424961802070&w=2 https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=318061

...

Someone please find a realistic solution for this soon. It's a miserable blight for KDE in 13.1 to begin life this way.

I have a feeling you will struggle to find a fix for it. As was stated in the thread you linked... floppies are obsolete (for many years) and finding someone with the knowledge AND incentive fix an

Did you read the bug? It seems to me only a little programmer help is needed to come up with a solution.

issue for hopelessly obsolete hardware (even if in your use case, you still use them) is going to be very difficult... or more likely impossible.

There really shouldn't be a material difference in this problem between an empty BluRay drive and an empty floppy drive. Absent media, there's nothing to announce about either. Regardless, device notifier ought to be able to be configured so that only selected device types be recognized. At the very least, there's no reason for it to be stealing focus.

I haven't seen a computer with a floppy drive in 5 or 6 years now... and now, CD/DVD drives are becoming rare... soon to be obsolete as well.

As long as people have floppies and CDs and DVDs they need something to access them. Combining DVDs, CDs and floppies, I have well over 3000, and I know people whose libraries are measured with 5 digits. -- "The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation) Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks! Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org

On 13/11/13 18:25, C wrote:

On Wed, Nov 13, 2013 at 8:04 AM, Felix Miata wrote:

...

As long as people have floppies and CDs and DVDs they need something to access them. Combining DVDs, CDs and floppies, I have well over 3000, and I know people whose libraries are measured with 5 digits. I gave up on floppy/CD/DVD RW as long term offline storage when I discovered "bit rot". I had around 600 CDs (several years ago) of data stored (personal videos, photos, music, multimedia etc) all burnt to CD and/or DVD. It was all "stored properly" out of the sun, in individual jewelbox cases etc. None of it survived more than about 5 years. Most was unreadable within 3 years of the burn date. A couple are still valid after 10 or 11 years though... the rare few.

* http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bit_rot * http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disc_rot

Given that the well documented bit/disk rot is a real factor... I wonder how many of your 3000 disks have failed... and the people who have libraries measured with 5 digits? I hate to think of how much data they think is stored safely is long gone.

A good reason to buy what are considered to be the best and not buy el cheapo CDs or DVDs. And which is why I only buy Verbatim discs[#] (made in Singapore, Japan, or Taiwan but not elsewhere). I have CDs/DVDs over 10 years old which are perfect. [#] Look at the site(s) dealing with audio/video media and you will find that there are 2 mfgers (when the last time I looked) who produced media worth relying on. Verbatim was one of them. BC -- Using openSUSE 13.1, KDE 4.11.2 & kernel 3.12.0-1 on a system with- AMD FX 8-core 3.6/4.2GHz processor 16GB PC14900/1866MHz Quad Channel Corsair "Vengeance" RAM Gigabyte AMD3+ m/board; Gigabyte nVidia GTX660 OC 2GB DDR5 GPU -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org

On Wednesday, November 13, 2013 06:58:43 PM Basil Chupin wrote:

On 13/11/13 18:04, Felix Miata wrote:

...

On 2013-11-13 07:38 (GMT+0100) C composed:

...

Felix Miata wrote:

...

http://lists.kde.org/?l=kde-linux&m=138424961802070&w=2 https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=318061

Someone please find a realistic solution for this soon. It's a miserable blight for KDE in 13.1 to begin life this way.

I have a feeling you will struggle to find a fix for it. As was stated in the thread you linked... floppies are obsolete (for many years) and finding someone with the knowledge AND incentive fix an

Did you read the bug? It seems to me only a little programmer help is needed to come up with a solution.

...

issue for hopelessly obsolete hardware (even if in your use case, you still use them) is going to be very difficult... or more likely impossible.

There really shouldn't be a material difference in this problem between an empty BluRay drive and an empty floppy drive. Absent media, there's nothing to announce about either.

Regardless, device notifier ought to be able to be configured so that only selected device types be recognized.

At the very least, there's no reason for it to be stealing focus.

...

I haven't seen a computer with a floppy drive in 5 or 6 years now... and now, CD/DVD drives are becoming rare... soon to be obsolete as well.

As long as people have floppies and CDs and DVDs they need something to access them. Combining DVDs, CDs and floppies, I have well over 3000, and I know people whose libraries are measured with 5 digits.

I'll go along with this.

I don't know if people realise this but vinyl LPs are back in vogue.

No joke. There is a company here in Australia which cannot keep up with the demand for vinyl LPs and is pressing them at a furious rate.

I didn't know about this until very recently but some moths ago I bought a turntable (for $A50) which will play all the old vinyls/records [33 1/3, 45, 78 ) and output using a USB port. I can now record all my vinyls/records I have sitting in "storage" and edit them using Audacity.

So don't knock floppies.

They are natural when you get older.

BC

-- Using openSUSE 13.1, KDE 4.11.2 & kernel 3.12.0-1 on a system with- AMD FX 8-core 3.6/4.2GHz processor 16GB PC14900/1866MHz Quad Channel Corsair "Vengeance" RAM Gigabyte AMD3+ m/board; Gigabyte nVidia GTX660 OC 2GB DDR5 GPU

-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org

Your 100% right on the LP's. They are coming back all over. I know magnetic tapes (Good Quality) only last 5-10 years in storage vaults. When I was working we used to rewite the older tapes to new tape on a defined schedule. Especially the ones we were required to keep for ever. Russ -- openSUSE 12.3(3.12.0-1.ge8fa6b4-desktop)|KDE 4.11.3 |Intel core2duo 2.5 MHZ,|8GB DDR3|GeForce 8400GS (NVIDIA-Linux-x86_64-331.20) -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org

On Wed, 13 Nov 2013 15:51:09 -0500 Patrick Shanahan wrote:

* Upscope [11-13-13 14:30]:

72 lines deleted including old sigs

No trim, full quote, off-topic, not even anything to do with Subject: or openSUSE or linux ...

Fun is that we have list that should pick up chatter, but it is highjacked by few discussing stuff that is very far related to openSUSE. mailto:opensuse-offtopic@opensuse.org We probably should improve on list management. -- Regards, Rajko. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org

On 2013-11-13 21:53 (GMT+0100) šumski composed:

Felix Miata wrote:

...

http://lists.kde.org/?l=kde-linux&m=138424961802070&w=2 https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=318061

...

Someone please find a realistic solution for this soon. It's a miserable blight for KDE in 13.1 to begin life this way.

Hey Felix, willing to try a patch before we go discussing cassette's and other novelties? home:sumski:branches:openSUSE:13.1:Update (kdelibs4 package, it's still building)

Please let me know when building's done. -- "The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation) Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks! Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org

On 2013-11-13 16:38 (GMT-0500) šumski composed:

On Wednesday 13 of November 2013 15:55:11 Felix Miata wrote:

...

...

Hey Felix, willing to try a patch before we go discussing cassette's and other novelties? home:sumski:branches:openSUSE:13.1:Update (kdelibs4 package, it's still building)

...

Please let me know when building's done.

x86_64 is done, and live at http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/home:/sumski:/branches:/openSUSE:/...

As this appears it's going to be a multi step process, I need to do it in 32 bit. My 32 bit installations with floppies are handy to bring on and off line. My 2 64s (of 3 total 64s) with floppies are not.

Switch all the packages available from there, following by a logout/login. I though, have a feeling that it won't quite work, but have a follow up patch prepared. Let me know how the 1st round goes - please test both the notifier applet, and dolphin's places. Please also attach what was asked in https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=318061#c11

I don't use Dolphin ever, so have no idea what I should expect of it. Any suggestions what I should do with it? Is it going to do to me what https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=283366 does? (MC rules) WRT comment 11, I've never encountered UDI before. How do I find out what UDI is assigned to the floppy drive? -- "The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation) Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks! Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org

On 2013-11-13 23:20 (GMT+0100) šumski composed:

Felix Miata wrote:

...

I don't use Dolphin ever, so have no idea what I should expect of it. Any suggestions what I should do with it? Is it going to do to me what https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=283366 does? (MC rules)

Just open dolphin, and check do you see a 0B floppy entry in the side places (below/next to e.g. hard driver partitions)

It's there, but hard to spot, since Dolphin has the same problem as https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=297219

...

WRT comment 11, I've never encountered UDI before. How do I find out what UDI is assigned to the floppy drive?

Execute solid-hardware list then find the floppy entry, e.g. /org/freedesktop/UDisks2/block_devices/fd0 (you'll see something different offcourse on your system, but it should be distinguishable) Then execute solid-hardware details $your_entry, and attach the result of that one.

https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=318061#c20 Summary: no change in behavior apparent from installing the 5 freshly built components from home:/sumski (32 bit) on host m7ncd. -- "The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation) Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks! Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org

On 2013-11-14 00:54 (GMT+0100) šumski composed:

Felix Miata wrote:

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Summary: no change in behavior apparent from installing the 5 freshly built components from home:/sumski (32 bit) on host m7ncd.

OK, as suspected. Please try updating now, as fresh packages are now ready. Just follow up with the results here, we'll see where to go from there...

Device notifier did not announce the floppy on login, but Dolphin still lists 0 B Media among 5 screens of unsorted unavailable mounts and a handful of available mounts. udi = '/org/freedesktop/UDisks2/drives/Floppy_Drive' parent = '/org/freedesktop/UDisks2' (string) vendor = '' (string) product = 'Floppy Drive' (string) description = 'Floppy Drive' (string) Block.major = 2 (0x2) (int) Block.minor = 0 (0x0) (int) Block.device = '/dev/fd0' (string) StorageDrive.bus = 'Platform' (0x5) (enum) StorageDrive.driveType = 'Floppy' (0x2) (enum) StorageDrive.removable = false (bool) StorageDrive.hotpluggable = false (bool) StorageDrive.inUse = false (bool) StorageDrive.size = 0 (0x0) (qulonglong) -- "The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation) Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks! Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org

On 2013-11-14 01:22 (GMT+0100) šumski composed:

OK. Can you describe what was previous behavior with KDE & floppies, e.g. in 12.2? Or what would be desired behavior? Was long ago since i last used floppy, so i can't recall.

On same m7ncd host running 12.1/4.9.5, notifier behavior appears identical to 4.11.2 with your freshly built components (total silence in re empty floppy). I put a disc in the drive, but device notifier remains silent in re floppy. Its menu has no "file manager" entry, though there is an ungrouped menu line item "Midnight Commander" I never use, as I run MC in already opened Konsole and on vttys. Dolphin is not installed. In 11.0/KDE3 on same host, empty floppy doesn't seem to show up anywhere except on opening "My Computer" (aka Konq). No activity seems apparent from inserting a floppy, but eventually, clicking on it in "My Computer" does show what the floppy contains. This seems quite reasonable behavior to me for such an ancient device. In 12.2/KDE4.8.5 on same host, device notifier makes no mention of empty floppy drive availability, and does not change after disc insertion. Dolphin seems unable to show me the floppy drive at all. Windows XP's Explorer lists the drive with or without a disc inserted, and displays files if a disc is inserted and drive is selected. This seems equivalent to 11.0/KDE3. I really don't need to be "notified" that I put a disc in a floppy drive. Either I did, or I didn't. I already know. For device notifier to unconditionally ignore a floppy drive seems very reasonable. More sophistication for newer devices that offer better communication is reasonable too. :-) -- "The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation) Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks! Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org