On 07/01/2010 07:14 PM, Vincent Untz wrote:

Andreas,

Le jeudi 01 juillet 2010, à 15:58 +0200, Andreas Jaeger a écrit :

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On Thursday 01 July 2010 15:00:21 Peter Czanik wrote:

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Done: https://features.opensuse.org/310070

Thanks. I just moved it to the next release - I don't think you wanted to target 11.3...

Can we make this target visible in openfate? I can only see the description of the feature, but no product associated with it.

I can add 11.4 to openfate tommorrow. Greetings -- Thomas Schmidt (tom [at] opensuse.org) openSUSE Boosters Team "Don't Panic", Douglas Adams (1952 - 11.05.2001) -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

On Thursday 01 July 2010 21:03:13 Thomas Schmidt wrote:

On 07/01/2010 07:14 PM, Vincent Untz wrote:

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Andreas,

Le jeudi 01 juillet 2010, à 15:58 +0200, Andreas Jaeger a écrit :

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On Thursday 01 July 2010 15:00:21 Peter Czanik wrote:

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Done: https://features.opensuse.org/310070

Thanks. I just moved it to the next release - I don't think you wanted to target 11.3...

Can we make this target visible in openfate? I can only see the description of the feature, but no product associated with it.

I can add 11.4 to openfate tommorrow.

Please do - and remove 11.3, thanks! Andreas -- Andreas Jaeger, Program Manager openSUSE, aj@{novell.com,opensuse.org} Twitter: jaegerandi | Identica: jaegerandi SUSE LINUX Products GmbH, GF: Markus Rex, HRB 16746 (AG Nürnberg) Maxfeldstr. 5, 90409 Nürnberg, Germany GPG fingerprint = 93A3 365E CE47 B889 DF7F FED1 389A 563C C272 A126

On Friday 02 July 2010 09:07:23 Martin Schlander wrote:

[...] Wth? Is this an official announcement that 11.3+1 won't be 12.0? ;-)

There was no discussion how to name the next version, so 11.4 is the current code name ;) Andreas -- Andreas Jaeger, Program Manager openSUSE, aj@{novell.com,opensuse.org} Twitter: jaegerandi | Identica: jaegerandi SUSE LINUX Products GmbH, GF: Markus Rex, HRB 16746 (AG Nürnberg) Maxfeldstr. 5, 90409 Nürnberg, Germany GPG fingerprint = 93A3 365E CE47 B889 DF7F FED1 389A 563C C272 A126

On Friday 02 July 2010 16:56:04 Thomas Schmidt wrote:

Shouldn't we call this 12.0? Reassigning the features afterwards would be additional work.

Naming of the next release is a separate discussion we might have. I'm opposed to both 11.4 and 12.0 and look forward to great proposals, Andreas -- Andreas Jaeger, Program Manager openSUSE, aj@{novell.com,opensuse.org} Twitter: jaegerandi | Identica: jaegerandi SUSE LINUX Products GmbH, GF: Markus Rex, HRB 16746 (AG Nürnberg) Maxfeldstr. 5, 90409 Nürnberg, Germany GPG fingerprint = 93A3 365E CE47 B889 DF7F FED1 389A 563C C272 A126

* Andreas Jaeger [07-02-10 11:06]:

On Friday 02 July 2010 16:56:04 Thomas Schmidt wrote:

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Shouldn't we call this 12.0? Reassigning the features afterwards would be additional work.

Naming of the next release is a separate discussion we might have. I'm opposed to both 11.4 and 12.0 and look forward to great proposals,

Yes, it is disconcerting to refer to both. But what is the reasoning to jump to 12.0 rather than a more seemingly normal advance to 11.4 absent some very significant change, ie: a major kernel change/shift, a distro change in direction, support for very new and exciting technology, major change in approach to security. I would prefer that ##.0 vers would signify land moving events and ##.#? version indicate advances in more normal situations. The recent versioning appears to somewhat follow the redman mindset and be for "publicity" purposes only, ie: no sanity involved. -- Patrick Shanahan Plainfield, Indiana, USA HOG # US1244711 http://wahoo.no-ip.org Photo Album: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/gallery2 Registered Linux User #207535 @ http://counter.li.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Greetings, We will be on our way to RMLL in Bordeaux, how do I get hold of this please? This is a good opportunity to show the new breed to the geeks attending and the general public. We will be playing with openSUSE 11.3 RC2 until then. Best wishes, Jimmy Nui.fr -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Fredag den 2. juli 2010 17:05:06 skrev Andreas Jaeger:

On Friday 02 July 2010 16:56:04 Thomas Schmidt wrote:

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Shouldn't we call this 12.0? Reassigning the features afterwards would be additional work.

Naming of the next release is a separate discussion we might have. I'm opposed to both 11.4 and 12.0 and look forward to great proposals,

Let's not get too creative here. No funky codenames! :-) We should go for a simple numbering scheme, that doesn't cause the confusion that the old one has (a lot of people give different meanings to the numbers, even though they don't mean a thing - other than of course x.1 meaning "unusually buggy"). Either do it the Fedora way. openSUSE 12, 13, 14 etc. Or the Mandriva way 2011.0, 2011.1, 2012.0 etc. Or something similar. But maybe it would be best to await the conclusion of the strategy discussion before making any more major project decisions. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

On Sat, 3 Jul 2010 10:11:48 +0200, Vincent Untz wrote:

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Naming of the next release is a separate discussion we might have. I'm opposed to both 11.4 and 12.0 and look forward to great proposals,

Let's not get too creative here. No funky codenames! :-)

We actually have code names, and it's the shades of greens. 11.3 is Teal. We just don't advertize this -- yet. (I think we should).

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We should go for a simple numbering scheme, that doesn't cause the confusion that the old one has (a lot of people give different meanings to the numbers, even though they don't mean a thing - other than of course x.1 meaning "unusually buggy").

Either do it the Fedora way. openSUSE 12, 13, 14 etc.

Or the Mandriva way 2011.0, 2011.1, 2012.0 etc.

(Or the Ubuntu way, except that it doesn't work well with the next version which would be 11.03: 11.03, 11.12, 12.07)

my 20c worth. I tend to go with 2011.0, 2011.1, 2012.0 etc. or 12, 13, 14 etc. At least the current i.e 11.2 is < than that numbering order , easy to figure out which earier and later versions. Cheers Glenn -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Dnia 05-07-2010 o 12:41:15 Carlos E. R. napisał(a):

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On 2010-07-03 12:19, doiggl@velocitynet.com.au wrote:

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On Sat, 3 Jul 2010 10:11:48 +0200, Vincent Untz wrote:

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my 20c worth. I tend to go with 2011.0, 2011.1, 2012.0 etc.

I like that one. It also makes easy for newcomers to realize when they install openSUSE 11.0 it is old... openSUSE 2008.1 would be clearer.

Well, it might be really good, but here my 20c go: it'd be stupid if releases numbered 2011.x would be released in 2010. That's the thing I hate about year-based numbering. And if I'm not wrong, Mandriva does so. It doesn't help understanding when a releases had been made. Ubuntu does their numbering job well. -- Best regards, Jakub 'Livio' Rusinek http://blog.jakubrusinek.pl/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Dnia 06-07-2010 o 11:12:13 Martin Schlander napisał(a):

Mandag den 5. juli 2010 17:34:35 skrev Jakub Rusinek:

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Ubuntu does their numbering job well.

In my experience noone intuitively understands the Ubuntu versioning scheme - it always needs to be explained.

But at least there _is_ a reasonably good explanation for it :-)

Well, nobody says openSUSE should follow their numbering guidelines ;) . Whether they prefer year written as two digits or not, it's their choice. I'd personally vote for eg. 2010.1/2010.2, where the year represents year of the release and number after the point represents number of release that year. So - 2010.1 would be first release in 2010, 2010.2 would be second, 2011.1 would be first in 2011 etc. -- Best regards, Jakub 'Livio' Rusinek http://blog.jakubrusinek.pl/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Dnia 06-07-2010 o 13:34:25 Stephan Kulow napisał(a):

Am Dienstag 06 Juli 2010 schrieb Jakub Rusinek:

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Dnia 06-07-2010 o 11:12:13 Martin Schlander

napisał(a):

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Mandag den 5. juli 2010 17:34:35 skrev Jakub Rusinek:

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Ubuntu does their numbering job well.

In my experience noone intuitively understands the Ubuntu versioning scheme - it always needs to be explained.

But at least there _is_ a reasonably good explanation for it :-)

Well, nobody says openSUSE should follow their numbering guidelines ;) . Whether they prefer year written as two digits or not, it's their choice. I'd personally vote for eg. 2010.1/2010.2, where the year represents year of the release and number after the point represents number of release that year.

So - 2010.1 would be first release in 2010, 2010.2 would be second, 2011.1 would be first in 2011 etc.

Try to say "KDE 4.4.4 won't be ready for 2010.1, but it's in 2011.1" three times quickly.

Then it's your turn to work out another solution ;) . After criticizing my invention, Ubuntu's way seems pretty resonable. Year.month. -- Best regards, Jakub 'Livio' Rusinek http://blog.jakubrusinek.pl/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

2010-07-06 13:48 keltezéssel, Stephan Kulow írta:

Am Dienstag 06 Juli 2010 schrieb Jakub Rusinek:

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Then it's your turn to work out another solution ;) .

Oh, I'm fine with 11.3 and 12.0 - it wasn't me who started this storm in a teacup.

I'd also prefer to stay with the current version numbering, I got quite used to it, starting at S.u.S.E. 4.3 :-) Bye, CzP -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

On Tue, Jul 6, 2010 at 7:48 AM, Stephan Kulow wrote:

Am Dienstag 06 Juli 2010 schrieb Jakub Rusinek:

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Then it's your turn to work out another solution ;) .

Oh, I'm fine with 11.3 and 12.0 - it wasn't me who started this storm in a teacup.

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After criticizing my invention, Ubuntu's way seems pretty resonable. Year.month.

They don't talk about 2010.4, but about their code names and then label it, so others are not confused. And if you look at ubuntu.com, they have 10.04 not 2010.4 - actually the web page doesn't talk about versions a lot.

How about the release is 11.4 next March and 11.5 in Nov. (or whenever they are). Then in 2012, switch to yy.mm release notation. That way we get to it, but in a way that the release numbers are always increasing. Greg -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Option 1: @octalcount \ 10.0 ;0 (first with new "open" name + open source) 10.1 ;1 10.2 ;2 10.3 ;3 11.0 ;4 11.1 ;5 11.2 ;6 11.3 ;7 this release == 20 next release, or option 1b, this release 21 2nd next 22 3rd next 23 ... 24 25 26 27 30 ... Option 2: @decimalcount \ 7.1 (first release in this century, 2001/01/24) 7.2 7.3 8.0 8.1 8.2 9.0 9.1 9.2 9.3 10.0 10.1 10.2 10.3 11.0 11.1 11.2 11.3 this release == 18 next release 19 2nd next release 20 3rd next release ... Option 3: ... 10.3 11.0 11.1 11.2 11.3 this release == 12 next release 13 2nd next release 14 3rd next release ... Option 4: starting next, not this, the Ubuntu way, less leading 2 characters, and lose the dots e.g.: 1001 current 1103 next in 8 months 1111 next 8 months after that I really don't seen any point in points, regardless of starting point or method, as absent non-numeric characters, it implies a fraction. -- "The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation) Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Le mardi 06 juillet 2010, à 14:41 +0100, Peter Nikolic a écrit :

What exactly is wrong with the current system

Apparently, my attempt to move the discussion to the opensuse-project mailing list didn't work out that well... Anyway, the current discussion has been summarized at: http://wiki.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Versioning_scheme I'd appreciate if we can keep the discussion to the opensuse-project mailing list; opensuse-factory is not the best place for this. (Mail-Followup-To set to opensuse-project) Thanks, Vincent -- Les gens heureux ne sont pas pressés. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

On 07/06/2010 09:41 AM, Peter Nikolic wrote:

On Tuesday 06 Jul 2010 12:37:58 Jakub Rusinek wrote:

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Dnia 06-07-2010 o 13:34:25 Stephan Kulow napisał(a):

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Am Dienstag 06 Juli 2010 schrieb Jakub Rusinek:

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Dnia 06-07-2010 o 11:12:13 Martin Schlander

napisał(a):

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Mandag den 5. juli 2010 17:34:35 skrev Jakub Rusinek:

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Ubuntu does their numbering job well.

In my experience noone intuitively understands the Ubuntu versioning scheme - it always needs to be explained.

But at least there _is_ a reasonably good explanation for it :-)

Well, nobody says openSUSE should follow their numbering guidelines ;) . Whether they prefer year written as two digits or not, it's their choice. I'd personally vote for eg. 2010.1/2010.2, where the year represents year of the release and number after the point represents number of release that year.

So - 2010.1 would be first release in 2010, 2010.2 would be second, 2011.1 would be first in 2011 etc.

Try to say "KDE 4.4.4 won't be ready for 2010.1, but it's in 2011.1" three times quickly.

Then it's your turn to work out another solution ;) .

After criticizing my invention, Ubuntu's way seems pretty resonable. Year.month.

What exactly is wrong with the current system IS this yet another change for the sake of change or does someone have a rock solid reason for changing what seems to work very well for Opensuse note We are NOT Ubuntu we are NOT Fedora we are NOT Debian .

My vote is we stay exactly as we are now and don't wreak a system that works just because someone fancies mucking things up for something to do / get their name mentioned ..

There is a saying don't fix what ain't broken or dow yow fix what ay bosted

Pete

-- Powered by openSUSE 11.2 (x86_64) Kernel: 2.6.30-rc6-git3-4-default KDE: 4.2.86 (KDE 4.2.86 (KDE 4.3 >= 20090514)) "release 1" 14:36 up 3 days 16:20, 4 users, load average: 1.98, 1.84, 1.51

I agree. There is nothing broken. Changing it will just confuse people. My vote is to NOT change it. -- Cheers! Roman -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

On 03/07/10 08:10, Martin Schlander wrote:

Fredag den 2. juli 2010 17:05:06 skrev Andreas Jaeger:

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On Friday 02 July 2010 16:56:04 Thomas Schmidt wrote:

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Shouldn't we call this 12.0? Reassigning the features afterwards would be additional work.

Naming of the next release is a separate discussion we might have. I'm opposed to both 11.4 and 12.0 and look forward to great proposals,

Let's not get too creative here. No funky codenames! :-)

We should go for a simple numbering scheme, that doesn't cause the confusion that the old one has (a lot of people give different meanings to the numbers, even though they don't mean a thing - other than of course x.1 meaning "unusually buggy").

Either do it the Fedora way. openSUSE 12, 13, 14 etc.

Or the Mandriva way 2011.0, 2011.1, 2012.0 etc.

Or something similar. But maybe it would be best to await the conclusion of the strategy discussion before making any more major project decisions.

As long as it is a number I'm happy, just don't go the debian way of using codenames, they confuse the hell out of me as to which is future, current, old or ancient. Regards Sid. -- Sid Boyce ... Hamradio License G3VBV, Licensed Private Pilot Emeritus IBM/Amdahl Mainframes and Sun/Fujitsu Servers Tech Support Specialist, Cricket Coach Microsoft Windows Free Zone - Linux used for all Computing Tasks -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Hello, 2010-07-01 19:11 keltezéssel, Cristian Rodríguez írta:

El 01/07/10 09:00, Peter Czanik escribió:

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Done: https://features.opensuse.org/310070

Im yet to see real hardware with enough resources to build the whole distro natively... this liltte devices have 512 MB ram only.

It's there: the OBS :-) It uses cross compilation, but if it necessary, it can compile "natively" using Qemu. It's a lot more slower, but works. See http://lizards.opensuse.org/2009/06/16/opensusearmgsoc-cross-compilation-spe... So using ARM hardware for compilation is not necessary. BTW: by the time openSUSE 12.0 will be out, ARM promises to have real server grade hardware to be available with multiple cores, couple gigabytes of RAM and still low power consumption. Bye, CzP -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Am Donnerstag, 1. Juli 2010, 20:21:07 schrieb Peter Czanik:

Hello,

2010-07-01 19:11 keltezéssel, Cristian Rodríguez írta:

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El 01/07/10 09:00, Peter Czanik escribió:

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Done: https://features.opensuse.org/310070

Im yet to see real hardware with enough resources to build the whole distro natively... this liltte devices have 512 MB ram only.

It's there: the OBS :-) It uses cross compilation, but if it necessary, it can compile "natively" using Qemu. It's a lot more slower, but works. See http://lizards.opensuse.org/2009/06/16/opensusearmgsoc-cross-compilation-sp eedup/ So using ARM hardware for compilation is not necessary.

BTW: by the time openSUSE 12.0 will be out, ARM promises to have real server grade hardware to be available with multiple cores, couple gigabytes of RAM and still low power consumption.

Bye, CzP

Ugh, isn't 11.3+1 already 12.0? even if not, then there is less then 16 months for ARM based 'big irons', I heavily doubt they will pull it off. ARM platform in my eyes is very promising, but it's just not engineered for something like obs, they have multicore in the pipe since ages, just look at how long it took to spread Cortex A8 to a handful of consumer devices. It will take quite some time for ARM architecture to compete with x86 on a MIPS/Watt scale in the high performance sector. How is debian doing their armel port, I understand their buildsystem doesn't blindly rebuild once a dependency rebuilt because of a minor version bump down in the pipe? What ARM based build system do they base their port on? I just can't imagine a sheeva plug build farm just so we get opensuse factory built in less then 3 days, and that what obs seems most tackled with (whole factory rebuild because some low low low level modification). So qemu or crossbuild won't be replaced any time soon by native build systems I think. Regards, Karsten -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org