On Sunday 26 Jul 2015 14:17:59 Wolfgang Bauer wrote:

Am Sonntag, 26. Juli 2015, 09:43:23 schrieb ianseeks:

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I understand that "snapperd" is only for btrfs but its launched daily and hourly by cron even though i don't use btrfs. If this a failure of the installation process that adds these cron jobs?

The cron jobs are part of the snapper package. If you install that package, the cron jobs will be there.

If you don't use btrfs (or don't want to use snapshots), you could just uninstall it. I didn't make a choice to install it, something else made the decision. i'll uninstall it and see what happens.

But in your case there probably isn't set up any configuration anyway (see /etc/sysconfig/snapper and /etc/snapper/configs/), so the cron job will not do anything at all. True, it just fires up "snapperd" every hour.

Btw, snapper also seems to support ext4. http://snapper.io/overview.html I cannot tell you how good that works or how to enable it though. I'm not sure what it means "support ext4" as it was developed for btrfs according to that web site

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Do we have a Plasma tool to manage crontab (there used to be a kcron if i remember correctly) ?

There still is kcron, and it has been ported to KF5 months ago, it is part of the KDE Applications 15.04 release. Tumbleweed does (only) contain the KF5 based version. Install it and you should find kcron in systemsettings5. THanks. It used to be automatically installed but it hadn't been this time (unlike snapperd and bluetooth)

Kind Regards, Wolfgang

Thanks for the help and info. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

On Sunday 26 Jul 2015 12:34:41 Chris Murphy wrote:

On Sun, Jul 26, 2015 at 10:59 AM, ianseeks wrote:

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I'm not sure what it means "support ext4" as it was developed for btrfs according to that web site

I have done no testing yet but my understanding is it supports any file system when it's on LVM thin volumes. ok, thanks. it won't bother me then :o) -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

On Monday 27 Jul 2015 12:52:49 Wolfgang Bauer wrote:

Am Sonntag, 26. Juli 2015, 17:59:12 schrieb ianseeks:

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Btw, snapper also seems to support ext4. http://snapper.io/overview.html I cannot tell you how good that works or how to enable it though.

I'm not sure what it means "support ext4" as it was developed for btrfs according to that web site

According to that site it supports ext4 and LVM too.

Well,AIUI snapper just creates snapshots regularly and allows you to view and rollback the changes, this should actually be possible with _any_ file system.

But it makes use of some of btrfs's features (Copy On Write, e.g., which I think is also supported by ext4 though) to make this more efficiently.

And I think only btrfs would allow to mount and boot from previous snapshots, that's probably the reason why it's enabled by default only on btrfs.

But I'm not really an expert here. Other people should know more details about all of that.

Sounds like it might be useful on some systems but I've uninstalled it now as i don't ever see me using it. My installation is too trivial. As long as my data is backed up via the script running on logout (not "Shutdown" as stated in systemsettings5 - hope someone changes that terminology soon).

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There still is kcron, and it has been ported to KF5 months ago, it is part of the KDE Applications 15.04 release. Tumbleweed does (only) contain the KF5 based version. Install it and you should find kcron in systemsettings5.

THanks. It used to be automatically installed but it hadn't been this time (unlike snapperd and bluetooth)

I think it wasn't installed by default in 13.1 or 13.2, but I'm not sure.

Maybe it was because i had it installed it on either 11 or 12 and it followed the upgrades

Kind Regards, Wolfgang

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On Monday 27 Jul 2015 13:16:34 Wolfgang Bauer wrote:

Am Sonntag, 26. Juli 2015, 17:59:12 schrieb ianseeks:

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On Sunday 26 Jul 2015 14:17:59 Wolfgang Bauer wrote:

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Am Sonntag, 26. Juli 2015, 09:43:23 schrieb ianseeks:

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I understand that "snapperd" is only for btrfs but its launched daily and hourly by cron even though i don't use btrfs. If this a failure of the installation process that adds these cron jobs?

The cron jobs are part of the snapper package. If you install that package, the cron jobs will be there.

If you don't use btrfs (or don't want to use snapshots), you could just uninstall it.

I didn't make a choice to install it, something else made the decision. i'll uninstall it and see what happens.

I just want to add that snapper is installed on my 13.2 system using reiserfs (upgraded since 8.1... ;-) ) as well, and I didn't install it manually.

I used to use Reiserfs but got worried when it looked like it was falling out of favour with the community

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So probably it is recommended by some installation pattern or other package since some time. yes, you have to keep your wits about you with all these dependencies appearing silently

But I haven't bothered about that at all until now.

Kind Regards, Wolfgang

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Am Sonntag, 26. Juli 2015, 18:01:22 schrieb ianseeks:

Shouldn't tools like "kcron" and "kcm_systemd" be automatically installed when systemsettings5 is installed?

Well, kcm_systemd is not even part of the distribution, and therefore cannot be installed by default. Also, we have YaST->System->Services Manager for that... ;) For kcron, yes it could be recommended by systemsettings5 or the KDE patterns, but as mentioned already I think this wasn't even the case in 13.1 any more (was it ever?). But something like this has to be decided on a case-by-case basis. It doesn't really make sense to automatically install any available settings module automatically I'd say. Kind Regards, Wolfgang -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

Am Montag, 27. Juli 2015, 13:41:31 schrieb ianseeks:

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Also, we have YaST->System->Services Manager for that... ;)

I've not used that for ages, it looks different to the last time i used it. I was looking for a tool to possibly show me a graphical tree representation of the systemd config with all dependencies and i mistakenly thought kcm_systemd did that (although it helps).

You're probably looking for "systemctl-analyze plot".

I think it'll be a hard decision to decide what is important regarding systems settings but i would advocate that anything to do with systems settings should be installed automatically if that system i.e. cron, systemd etc is installed and active

Well, cron and systemd is installed and active on every openSUSE system, and you cannot check the "active" state at package installation time anyway. So this would mean, unconditionally install them automatically. The question rather is whether users in general need it or would profit from it. Everybody who wants to have it can install it manually. And just because systemd or cron is installed and running, doesn't mean every user needs that KDE configuration module (and to repeat, for the former one, there's the YaST module too that is installed by default). As long as kcm_systemd is not part of the distribution, it is no option to be installed automatically anyway. Regarding kcron, I think it might even confuse (in particular newbie) users. I can imagine bug reports like this: "I configured VLC to be started at 20:00 every day, but it doesn't work!". But, that's not my decision, and I don't really have a strong opinion about it either. Kind Regards, Wolfgang -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

Am Donnerstag, 6. August 2015, 14:55:45 schrieb Carlos E. R.:

On 2015-08-06 12:43, Wolfgang Bauer wrote:

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Regarding kcron, I think it might even confuse (in particular newbie) users. I can imagine bug reports like this: "I configured VLC to be started at 20:00 every day, but it doesn't work!".

Not really. It happens a number of times already. I have seen the question pop up in the forum.

Well, it would probably pop up even more often if kcron was installed by default...

The solution for that would be for KDE to add something that allowed to run a graphical tool at the requested time :-)

Well, there are tools for that too, like KTimer e.g. (can run applications at a specified time or after a specified interval). But kcron is a frontend to cron (and crontab), not more, not less. And cron cannot run graphical tools in the user's session that easily, as it is a system service running as root, *outside* the graphical session. Kind Regards, Wolfgang -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org