Hi, sorry for the late reply. See comments below On Sunday 05 August 2007 00:42, Pascal Bleser wrote:

I'd like to voice some concerns I have about the new susegreeter in 10.3.

The background is that a few folks on IRC (including me) have been trying to push the idea of having a one-click icon on the desktop to get onto the #suse channel on freenode. We do think that it would be a valuable way for new users to get help from the community.

What happened (unfortunately somewhat behind the scenes, which is why this email might seem a bit late) is that the concept was expanded to the following: 1) add such links to susegreeter, which is the big shiny "welcome to opensuse" window that is started when you first log in 2) not only link to #suse but also to the wiki, mailing-lists, forums, SDB 3) add a desktop icon to start susegreeter at a later point in time, not just on first login 4) for IRC, link to #opensuse instead of #suse -- #opensuse is currently just a redirect to #suse and would add an additional safety net just in case

Here's a mockup of the current implementation: http://developer.kde.org/~binner/SUSEgreeter/ General idea behind that is to link the project better with the distrbution. Therfor we think covering several aspects is a good thing.

While the above is fine and a good idea, luckily not everything is bad ;-) I think the current implementation (as of alpha7) is not very good, for the following reasons: * the text is too cluttered, and I'm not sure whether using underlined links are clear enough to unexperienced users (yeah, everyone knows the web and hyperlinks, but still) I don't see the links an issue * the text is not "action oriented", which is pretty much what everyone agrees on is the better alternative in terms of usability

What would be more effective (and easier to comprehend) would be to use action oriented bullet points (or similar), e.g.:

======================================================================== The openSUSE community are helpful people. There are several ways to get in touch with other community members, such as forums, mailing lists and internet chat (IRC). On the openSUSE wiki there are also HOWTOs and other documentation. The first place to look for help is our support database. * get real-time support from the community using IRC chat * subscribe to support mailing-lists and get help from our very large user base * ask questions and/or search for answers in our communities' forums * search for information and help in our wiki articles and howtos * search our Support Database (SDB) for existing workarounds Right, call to action looks better. ccing Karl as he's doing the translation coordination. I don't know how far he's already on the greeter and if there is time for change now. ======================================================================== (each of the * being links that trigger the respective action) (.. and whatever the order is)

Note that what would be even more effective is to have an intermediate screen with complementary information. I'd say that's something for after 10.3. e.g. when clicking the IRC link (as above), get into another screen that shortly explains what IRC is, that the room is a community thing and by no means "official support", and with additional links, for example: * more information about IRC (-> wikipedia) * #suse channel rules (-> http://suse-irc.org/rules.html (1)) and a big fat button "connect now" that would start the respective IRC client and connect to irc://irc.freenode.net/#opensuse

(1) we could move that to opensuse.org or opensuse-community.org, might be more appropriate

Same thing for mailing-lists, forums, SDB, wiki, ...

And maybe it would be a good idea to split a) "how to contribute" type of links (build service, wiki, community) b) "how to get help" type of links (IRC, mailing-lists, forums, SDB, ...) in order to get more space in the greeter window (maybe use tabs in the susegreeter window ?)

One thing that must really be kept in mind is that the "how to get help" links are not very interesting on first login and that the user will want to use them _when he needs help_. 1) "damn, my sound card doesn't work" or "why does amarok not play my MP3s" or ..., which leads to: 2) "where can I get help ?" 3) -> clearly label the desktop icon ("Get help!" would be most I fully support the "Get help" labeling even as there is more written as Support and Communication. appropriate IMO but then again, I can already hear suits claim "yeah but it's community support not official support and ...") We are a community distribution so community help is one channel for official support.

I'll put the susegreeter thing to today's IRC meting agenda to get agreement on it. M

4) -> clearly explain the options and quickly get the user there, which can be achieved through action oriented bullet lists (as explained above)

Thanks for reading.

cheers

-- Michael Löffler, Product Management SUSE Linux Products GmbH, Maxfeldstraße 5, 90409 Nuremberg SUSE LINUX Products GmbH - Nürnberg - AG Nürnberg - HRB 16746 - GF: Markus Rex --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org