[opensuse-factory] Leap 42.2 follows TW packages?

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Takashi Iwai

12 Jul 2016 12 Jul '16

10:42

Hi Ludwig, when a Leap 42.2 package is "forked" to take a TW package, does it automatically follow the later TW package update as well until the 42.2 code freeze? Or do we need to resubmit to 42.2 at each time? thanks, Takashi -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

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Dominique Leuenberger / DimStar

12 Jul 12 Jul

10:52

On Tue, 2016-07-12 at 12:42 +0200, Takashi Iwai wrote:

...

Hi Ludwig,

when a Leap 42.2 package is "forked" to take a TW package, does it automatically follow the later TW package update as well until the 42.2 code freeze? Or do we need to resubmit to 42.2 at each time?

Hi Takashi, Allow me to reply to this message while Ludwig is enjoying some time off. Packages that are marked to be coming from TW are NOT automatically updated based on TW. Despite the 'promise' that TW is supposedly stable, there are always smaller / bigger packages that are a bit 'too bleedy' to be considered for a real LTS product, such as Leap. For this reason, packages that have source openSUSE:Factory do require explicit action from the package maintainers. Hope that clarifies things, Dominique

James Mason

11:15

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA256 On Tue, 2016-07-12 at 12:52 +0200, Dominique Leuenberger / DimStar wrote:

...

For this reason, packages that have source openSUSE:Factory do require explicit action from the package maintainers.

... and this is why so many packages don't make it through the double- maintenance obstacle course from Devel projects to Leap. - -- James Mason Technical Architect, Public Cloud openSUSE Member SUSE jmason@suse.com -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2 iQEcBAEBCAAGBQJXhNFOAAoJEBs5UYhsRJAjol4H/3sLLEI6O6jv7BMTwlyMEJnv pvkz4FPMejf+Ta5LyPvSI0Qe0lE6S4l+SvBvlPOiNxANlNWMdAPVMbHmNYJMRR+r kArZCRK/Rs/W5cx5pNi2x6UHmd7xXYDhsD6u7911p9/JNF9ti0ZtaL3+q0qM+Rn/ WzdK2vqwlU4ImlZW8h1Ape7hV3HFXS42vJuMqMrjodPPMj9FYq0+Wv0QOCVJYysl /pqvVc/agdrtOG4JId7mjrFrdHA4LMgd0UZhgSeSbjbn0yxbvuMg3P4s5L/RgWPX S7QWHyyS2PqhadVIIiXF65qiTLCocjTf8QFrhOX+BWdyDZMLrAGSVjCoZEe+m8c= =O7Ly -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

Wolfgang Rosenauer

11:47

Hi, Am 12.07.2016 um 13:15 schrieb James Mason:

...

On Tue, 2016-07-12 at 12:52 +0200, Dominique Leuenberger / DimStar wrote:

...
For this reason, packages that have source openSUSE:Factory do require explicit action from the package maintainers.

... and this is why so many packages don't make it through the double- maintenance obstacle course from Devel projects to Leap.

I fully support the current decision to have explicit agreement what ends up in 42.2 since it still is supposed to be an easy upgrade from 42.1 to 42.2 and just following all upgrades sounds risky to me. What I do not really like in the process is that process wise you first need to submit to Factory, wait for its final inclusion and then request the 42.2 update. I fear we are losing traction in that case. At least I need to be very careful and keep some reference somewhere as TODO. I'm wondering if there are technical possibilities to make this more obvious or easier? Wolfgang -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

Takashi Iwai

12:14

On Tue, 12 Jul 2016 13:47:14 +0200, Wolfgang Rosenauer wrote:

...

What I do not really like in the process is that process wise you first need to submit to Factory, wait for its final inclusion and then request the 42.2 update. I fear we are losing traction in that case. At least I need to be very careful and keep some reference somewhere as TODO. I'm wondering if there are technical possibilities to make this more obvious or easier?

Yes, either some automation or a web interface would be definitely helpful. Takashi -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

Simon Lees

13 Jul 13 Jul

03:04

On 07/12/2016 09:44 PM, Takashi Iwai wrote:

...

On Tue, 12 Jul 2016 13:47:14 +0200, Wolfgang Rosenauer wrote:

...
What I do not really like in the process is that process wise you first need to submit to Factory, wait for its final inclusion and then request the 42.2 update. I fear we are losing traction in that case. At least I need to be very careful and keep some reference somewhere as TODO. I'm wondering if there are technical possibilities to make this more obvious or easier?

Yes, either some automation or a web interface would be definitely helpful.

A nice way to do this would be to include a checkbox (unchecked by default) along the lines of "Forward package to openSUSE Leap" which would then create a new request to Leap once the package is accepted into Factory, Similar to how theres a option to forward a request to Factory when submitting from a home repo to a devel repo. If someone checks the option and the package doesn't currently come from Factory in Leap (ie SLE or 42.1) We could also show a big warning with flashing lights asking if they are sure they want to accept the request. -- Simon Lees (Simotek) http://simotek.net Emergency Update Team keybase.io/simotek SUSE Linux Adeliade Australia, UTC+9:30 GPG Fingerprint: 5B87 DB9D 88DC F606 E489 CEC5 0922 C246 02F0 014B

Scott Bahling

12 Jul 12 Jul

15:18

On Tue, 2016-07-12 at 13:47 +0200, Wolfgang Rosenauer wrote:

...

Hi,

Am 12.07.2016 um 13:15 schrieb James Mason:

...
On Tue, 2016-07-12 at 12:52 +0200, Dominique Leuenberger / DimStar wrote:

...
For this reason, packages that have source openSUSE:Factory do require explicit action from the package maintainers.

... and this is why so many packages don't make it through the double- maintenance obstacle course from Devel projects to Leap.

I fully support the current decision to have explicit agreement what ends up in 42.2 since it still is supposed to be an easy upgrade from 42.1 to 42.2 and just following all upgrades sounds risky to me.

What I do not really like in the process is that process wise you first need to submit to Factory, wait for its final inclusion and then request the 42.2 update.

Ideally one would update Factory and Leap with one submit request and have the latter release contingent on the former and happen automatically (or at least semi-automatically). Is that not how it works today? At least that's the idea we have for the Backports project which also requires Factory acceptance first. But I don't think we have tested the parallel submit scenario yet with Backports. -Scott

Ludwig Nussel

20 Jul 20 Jul

16:15

Wolfgang Rosenauer schrieb:

...

Am 12.07.2016 um 13:15 schrieb James Mason:

...
On Tue, 2016-07-12 at 12:52 +0200, Dominique Leuenberger / DimStar wrote:

...
For this reason, packages that have source openSUSE:Factory do require explicit action from the package maintainers.

... and this is why so many packages don't make it through the double- maintenance obstacle course from Devel projects to Leap.

I fully support the current decision to have explicit agreement what ends up in 42.2 since it still is supposed to be an easy upgrade from 42.1 to 42.2 and just following all upgrades sounds risky to me.

What I do not really like in the process is that process wise you first need to submit to Factory, wait for its final inclusion and then request the 42.2 update.

You don't need to wait for Factory inclusion. Just submit the same sources to Factory and 42.2. The leap review bot will notice the Factory submission and wait for the Factory submission to pass the reviews. You don't have to track that yourself. Just make sure to submit to Factory first to avoid the small chance of the leap review bot looking at your submission just in that second you need to file the second one :-) cu Ludwig -- (o_ Ludwig Nussel //\ V_/_ http://www.suse.com/ SUSE Linux GmbH, GF: Felix Imendörffer, Jane Smithard, Graham Norton, HRB 21284 (AG Nürnberg) -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

Takashi Iwai

16:21

On Wed, 20 Jul 2016 18:15:49 +0200, Ludwig Nussel wrote:

...

Wolfgang Rosenauer schrieb:

...
Am 12.07.2016 um 13:15 schrieb James Mason:

...
On Tue, 2016-07-12 at 12:52 +0200, Dominique Leuenberger / DimStar wrote:

...
For this reason, packages that have source openSUSE:Factory do require explicit action from the package maintainers.

... and this is why so many packages don't make it through the double- maintenance obstacle course from Devel projects to Leap.

I fully support the current decision to have explicit agreement what ends up in 42.2 since it still is supposed to be an easy upgrade from 42.1 to 42.2 and just following all upgrades sounds risky to me.

What I do not really like in the process is that process wise you first need to submit to Factory, wait for its final inclusion and then request the 42.2 update.

You don't need to wait for Factory inclusion. Just submit the same sources to Factory and 42.2. The leap review bot will notice the Factory submission and wait for the Factory submission to pass the reviews. You don't have to track that yourself. Just make sure to submit to Factory first to avoid the small chance of the leap review bot looking at your submission just in that second you need to file the second one :-)

Good to know! Takashi -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

Takashi Iwai

12 Jul 12 Jul

11:40

On Tue, 12 Jul 2016 12:52:49 +0200, Dominique Leuenberger / DimStar wrote:

...

On Tue, 2016-07-12 at 12:42 +0200, Takashi Iwai wrote:

...
Hi Ludwig,

when a Leap 42.2 package is "forked" to take a TW package, does it automatically follow the later TW package update as well until the 42.2 code freeze? Or do we need to resubmit to 42.2 at each time?

Hi Takashi,

Allow me to reply to this message while Ludwig is enjoying some time off.

Packages that are marked to be coming from TW are NOT automatically updated based on TW. Despite the 'promise' that TW is supposedly stable, there are always smaller / bigger packages that are a bit 'too bleedy' to be considered for a real LTS product, such as Leap.

For this reason, packages that have source openSUSE:Factory do require explicit action from the package maintainers.

Thanks, now it's clear. I asked it because the policy was a bit different at the time of 42.1. At that time, the TW package update was tracked until 42.1 went to the code freeze. But then I guess we'd need a manual review for such forked packages some time later before RC, so that we catch any overlooked package updates / fixes. Takashi -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

Ludwig Nussel

20 Jul 20 Jul

16:36

Takashi Iwai schrieb:

...

On Tue, 12 Jul 2016 12:52:49 +0200, Dominique Leuenberger / DimStar wrote:

...
On Tue, 2016-07-12 at 12:42 +0200, Takashi Iwai wrote:

...
when a Leap 42.2 package is "forked" to take a TW package, does it automatically follow the later TW package update as well until the 42.2 code freeze? Or do we need to resubmit to 42.2 at each time?

Allow me to reply to this message while Ludwig is enjoying some time off.

Packages that are marked to be coming from TW are NOT automatically updated based on TW. Despite the 'promise' that TW is supposedly stable, there are always smaller / bigger packages that are a bit 'too bleedy' to be considered for a real LTS product, such as Leap.

For this reason, packages that have source openSUSE:Factory do require explicit action from the package maintainers.

Thanks, now it's clear.

I asked it because the policy was a bit different at the time of 42.1. At that time, the TW package update was tracked until 42.1 went to the code freeze.

42.2 isn't about the latest and greatest. For some packages it may indeed make sense to follow Factory automatically (like e.g. Firefox). That cannot be figured out automatically by bot though. Maybe someone could come up with a way to tag packages that are safe to always submit from Factory until RC. Then the update crawler¹ could be adjusted to also look at Factory.

...

But then I guess we'd need a manual review for such forked packages some time later before RC, so that we catch any overlooked package updates / fixes.

More pairs of eyes to check the package lists are always appreciated. The lookup file² lists packages that were not updated since 42.1 as coming from openSUSE:Leap:42.1[:Update]. Also, packages introduced in Factory or SLE since 42.1 are normally not automatically put into 42.2. So someone needs to submit new packages that should be part of the release manually. cu Ludwig [1] https://github.com/openSUSE/osc-plugin-factory/blob/master/update_crawler.py [2] https://build.opensuse.org/package/view_file/openSUSE:Leap:42.2/00Meta/looku... -- (o_ Ludwig Nussel //\ V_/_ http://www.suse.com/ SUSE Linux GmbH, GF: Felix Imendörffer, Jane Smithard,Graham Norton, HRB 21284 (AG Nürnberg) -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

Sven Semmler

18:09

On 07/20/2016 12:36 PM, Ludwig Nussel wrote:

...

More pairs of eyes to check the package lists are always appreciated. The lookup file² lists packages that were not updated since 42.1 as coming from openSUSE:Leap:42.1[:Update].

I just realized that kdirstat is part of the official tumbleweed repo but not available in leap 42.1. Maybe this could be reintroduced in 42.2? Or maybe qdirstat? Sure, 'du' does the trick too but the GUI is much nicer IMHO to clean out your /home directory. What would be the correct way for me to suggest inclusion of kdirstat for leap 42.2? /Sven -- Fingerprint: D7CA F2DB 658D 89BC 08D6 A7AA DA6E 167B 8F54 1FB6 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

Dmitriy Perlow

18:42

Sven Semmler Wed, 20 Jul 2016 21:09:15 +0300:

...

On 07/20/2016 12:36 PM, Ludwig Nussel wrote:

...
More pairs of eyes to check the package lists are always appreciated. The lookup file² lists packages that were not updated since 42.1 as coming from openSUSE:Leap:42.1[:Update].

I just realized that kdirstat is part of the official tumbleweed repo but not available in leap 42.1. Maybe this could be reintroduced in 42.2? Or maybe qdirstat?

Of course.

...

Sure, 'du' does the trick too but the GUI is much nicer IMHO to clean out your /home directory.

What would be the correct way for me to suggest inclusion of kdirstat for leap 42.2?

Just open submit request(s). -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

Sven Semmler

20:10

On 07/20/2016 02:42 PM, Dmitriy Perlow wrote:

...

Just open submit request(s).

Thanks Dmitriy, I am a total noob ... do you have a link or howto for me to do so? /Sven -- Fingerprint: D7CA F2DB 658D 89BC 08D6 A7AA DA6E 167B 8F54 1FB6 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

Benjamin Denisart

23:23

On 07/20/2016 10:10 PM, Sven Semmler wrote:

...

On 07/20/2016 02:42 PM, Dmitriy Perlow wrote:

...
Just open submit request(s). Thanks Dmitriy, I am a total noob ... do you have a link or howto for me to do so?

/Sven

Submit the inquired package from openSUSE:Factory to openSUSE:Leap:42.2 Cheers. Benjamin -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

Dmitriy Perlow

21 Jul 21 Jul

03:33

Sven Semmler Wed, 20 Jul 2016 23:10:23 +0300:

...

On 07/20/2016 02:42 PM, Dmitriy Perlow wrote:

...
Just open submit request(s).

Thanks Dmitriy, I am a total noob ... do you have a link or howto for me to do so?

1. Find package via https://software.opensuse.org/search 2. Press openSUSE Tumbleweed, official release 3. Login, press Submit package 4. Set openSUSE:Leap:42.2 as target project 5. Write some description 6. Press OK :) -- Best regards, Dmitriy Perlow R&D chemical engineer Lekpharm JLLC -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

Simon Lees

04:11

On 07/21/2016 01:03 PM, Dmitriy Perlow wrote:

...

Sven Semmler Wed, 20 Jul 2016 23:10:23 +0300:

...
On 07/20/2016 02:42 PM, Dmitriy Perlow wrote:

...
Just open submit request(s).

Thanks Dmitriy, I am a total noob ... do you have a link or howto for me to do so?

1. Find package via https://software.opensuse.org/search 2. Press openSUSE Tumbleweed, official release 3. Login, press Submit package 4. Set openSUSE:Leap:42.2 as target project 5. Write some description 6. Press OK :)

Just opening submit requests if you do not know what you are doing is NOT the answer. By submitting you are telling everyone that you are capable and willing to update the package should a security issue or major bug be found and you are saying that your willing to look after that package for the lifetime of Leap. What is a better solution is to first ask the existing tumbleweed maintainer if they are willing to submit it, if they are not listen to there concerns and if you believe that someone else maybe willing to address those concerns then post to this list asking if someone will maintain it for you. Alternatively you may be willing to learn how to do packaging in that case speak to the current maintainer if they exist and ask how to help out. Cheers -- Simon Lees (Simotek) http://simotek.net Emergency Update Team keybase.io/simotek SUSE Linux Adeliade Australia, UTC+9:30 GPG Fingerprint: 5B87 DB9D 88DC F606 E489 CEC5 0922 C246 02F0 014B

Sven Semmler

19:00

On 07/20/2016 11:33 PM, Dmitriy Perlow wrote:

...

1. Find package via https://software.opensuse.org/search 2. Press openSUSE Tumbleweed, official release 3. Login, press Submit package 4. Set openSUSE:Leap:42.2 as target project 5. Write some description 6. Press OK :)

Thank you! :-) -- Fingerprint: D7CA F2DB 658D 89BC 08D6 A7AA DA6E 167B 8F54 1FB6 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

Simon Lees

04:32

On 07/21/2016 03:39 AM, Sven Semmler wrote:

...

On 07/20/2016 12:36 PM, Ludwig Nussel wrote:

...
More pairs of eyes to check the package lists are always appreciated. The lookup file² lists packages that were not updated since 42.1 as coming from openSUSE:Leap:42.1[:Update].

I just realized that kdirstat is part of the official tumbleweed repo but not available in leap 42.1. Maybe this could be reintroduced in 42.2? Or maybe qdirstat?

Including qdirstat in leap is part of my todolist as part of my goal to get stuff out of my home repo and into openSUSE properly, I have spoken to the maintainer / author and am happy to do that. It needs to go through to a devel repo and openSUSE:Factory first so It may take a little while.

...

Sure, 'du' does the trick too but the GUI is much nicer IMHO to clean out your /home directory.

What would be the correct way for me to suggest inclusion of kdirstat for leap 42.2?

/Sven

-- Simon Lees (Simotek) http://simotek.net Emergency Update Team keybase.io/simotek SUSE Linux Adeliade Australia, UTC+9:30 GPG Fingerprint: 5B87 DB9D 88DC F606 E489 CEC5 0922 C246 02F0 014B

Michal Kubecek

12 Jul 12 Jul

12:08

On úterý 12. července 2016 12:52 Dominique Leuenberger / DimStar wrote:

...

Packages that are marked to be coming from TW are NOT automatically updated based on TW. Despite the 'promise' that TW is supposedly stable, there are always smaller / bigger packages that are a bit 'too bleedy' to be considered for a real LTS product, such as Leap.

For this reason, packages that have source openSUSE:Factory do require explicit action from the package maintainers.

On a similar topic: if a 42.2 package is inherited from 42.1 and I plan to update it in 42.1, is 42.2 going to inherit the update or do I need to submit the update to openSUSE:Leap:42.2 as well? Michal Kubeček -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

Dominique Leuenberger / DimStar

12:12

On Tue, 2016-07-12 at 14:08 +0200, Michal Kubecek wrote:

...

On a similar topic: if a 42.2 package is inherited from 42.1 and I plan to update it in 42.1, is 42.2 going to inherit the update or do I need to submit the update to openSUSE:Leap:42.2 as well?

If the package is marked as openSUSE:Leap:42.1 or openSUSE:Leap:42.1:Upadte inside https://build.opensuse.org/package/vie w_file/openSUSE:Leap:42.2/00Meta/lookup.yml then the leaper bot should pick up any new version inside :Update and submit it for inclusion. The same holds true for SUSE:SLE-12-* based packages. If you see cases where this does not work, make sure to give a sign. Cheers, Dominique

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11 participants

participants (11)

Benjamin Denisart
Dmitriy Perlow
Dominique Leuenberger / DimStar
James Mason
Ludwig Nussel
Michal Kubecek
Scott Bahling
Simon Lees
Sven Semmler
Takashi Iwai
Wolfgang Rosenauer