[opensuse-factory] Bugzilla vs. FATE post-Novell
Having separate tracker DBs for bugs and enhancement requests drives me nuts. Often the difference is one of semantics that people don't agree on. Searching for existing this way is about 4 times as much work. Now that openSUSE has been divorced from Novell, is it not in the plans for it to have a separate bug tracker? If so, can enhancement requests be restored to the same DB, like Fedora, Kernel, KDE, Gnome, Mandriva, Freedesktop, Mozilla and other FOSS do? FWIW, this came up today because in conjuction with bug day I tried a follow up on https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=700526. KPackageKit wanted to install 65 packages just because I asked it for flash-player. Zypper in flash-player only wanted 5, and only so many because I'd not yet installed Firefox with its mozilla-nss & mozilla-nss-certs that flash-player also requires and are usually already installed. So, I think KPackageKit ought to be made to obey /etc/zypp/zypper.conf's 'installRecommends = no', which I don't think appropriate to request of upstream KDE. To me it's a bug that all package manager UIs (YaST, Zypper, URPM, YUM, Smart, Aptitude, et al) don't rely on the same configuration settings, but knowing what I know about Novell's Bugzilla triage system I'd expect one filed there to be closed/FATE in short order. -- "The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation) Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks! Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
On 21 August 2011 20:32, Felix Miata
So, I think KPackageKit ought to be made to obey /etc/zypp/zypper.conf's 'installRecommends = no', which I don't think appropriate to request of upstream KDE. To me it's a bug that all package manager UIs (YaST, Zypper,
No, KPackageKit should (and I have no cause to think it doesn't) honor "solver.onlyRequires" from /etc/zypp/zypp.conf. /etc/zypp/zypper.conf is obviously only related to zypper. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
On 2011/08/21 20:54 (GMT+0100) Cristian Morales Vega composed:
Felix Miata wrote:
So, I think KPackageKit ought to be made to obey /etc/zypp/zypper.conf's 'installRecommends = no', which I don't think appropriate to request of upstream KDE. To me it's a bug that all package manager UIs (YaST, Zypper,
No, KPackageKit should (and I have no cause to think it doesn't) honor "solver.onlyRequires" from /etc/zypp/zypp.conf. /etc/zypp/zypper.conf is obviously only related to zypper.
Had I been aware zypp.conf had an option serving the same purpose, I would have phrased my question differently. Why do both exist? Why should whether or not recommendeds are installed by default or not depend on which package manager UI is used? -- "The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation) Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks! Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
Am 21.08.2011 21:32, schrieb Felix Miata:
Now that openSUSE has been divorced from Novell, is it not in the plans for it to have a separate bug tracker? If so, can enhancement requests be restored to the same DB, like Fedora, Kernel, KDE, Gnome, Mandriva, Freedesktop, Mozilla and other FOSS do?
I don´t know exactly, but there´s the subdomain bugzilla.opensuse.org (yeah, it directs to a wiki page, but maybe in the future....?) maybe this will be used for an openSUSE bugzilla in the future. hope this helps, -- -o) Kim Leyendecker /\\ openSUSE Ambassador, openSUSE Wiki Team DE _\_v http://www.opensuse.org - Linux for open minds -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
On 21/08/11 16:32, Felix Miata wrote:
Having separate tracker DBs for bugs and enhancement requests drives me nuts.
You are not the only one ;) For some reason I never really understood, there is apparently a need to have a separate systems, that have no meaningful integration whatsoever, where submit requests are not integrated with bug reports or feature requests. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
Cristian Rodríguez wrote:
On 21/08/11 16:32, Felix Miata wrote:
Having separate tracker DBs for bugs and enhancement requests drives me nuts.
You are not the only one ;)
Nope, you're not alone. /Per -- Per Jessen, Zürich (24.1°C) -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
On Monday, August 22, 2011 01:41:26 AM Per Jessen wrote:
On 21/08/11 16:32, Felix Miata wrote:
Having separate tracker DBs for bugs and enhancement requests drives me nuts. Well, why not integrate them then keep (and refine) the user friendly FATE interface as the front-end for feature requests. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
On 2011/08/22 12:00 (GMT-0700) Roger Luedecke composed:
Felix Miata wrote:
Having separate tracker DBs for bugs and enhancement requests drives me nuts.
Well, why not integrate them then keep (and refine) the user friendly FATE interface as the front-end for feature requests.
Between the line between bug and new feature is often a vast chasm that can move according to personal interpretation and/or subsequent discussion of assignee, triager, interested observers and/or filer. -- "The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation) Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks! Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
On Mon, 22 Aug 2011 12:00:14 -0700, Roger Luedecke
On Monday, August 22, 2011 01:41:26 AM Per Jessen wrote:
On 21/08/11 16:32, Felix Miata wrote:
Having separate tracker DBs for bugs and enhancement requests drives me nuts. Well, why not integrate them then keep (and refine) the user friendly FATE interface as the front-end for feature requests.
Hello Could feature requests be added to the Bugzilla system upstream. Glenn -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
On 2011/08/23 07:15 (GMT+1000) doiggl@velocitynet.com.au composed:
Could feature requests be added to the Bugzilla system upstream.
Not only are they already there, they're also already in bugzilla.novell.com's (called enhancement), but in the latter, they get closed and the reporter directed to submit to FATE. -- "The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation) Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks! Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
On Tue, Aug 23, 2011 at 02:53:56AM -0400, Felix Miata wrote:
On 2011/08/23 07:15 (GMT+1000) doiggl@velocitynet.com.au composed:
Could feature requests be added to the Bugzilla system upstream.
Not only are they already there, they're also already in bugzilla.novell.com's (called enhancement), but in the latter, they get closed and the reporter directed to submit to FATE.
We use FATE as it allows way more in the way of roles and multiple products than Bugzilla, which is pretty single minded on all things. Ciao, Marcus -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
On 2011/08/23 08:57 (GMT+0200) Marcus Meissner composed:
We use FATE as it allows way more in the way of roles and multiple products than Bugzilla, which is pretty single minded on all things.
I have yet to figure out how FATE helps with characteristics or behavior falling in the monumental gray area between clearly something new or different, and unambiguously broken, a huge portion of which are subject to different interpretations. That's an important reason why I started this thread. It's plenty hard to search for and actually find things in one big DB without having to also figure out which of two DBs that one thing might be found in. -- "The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation) Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks! Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
On 2011/08/23 08:57 (GMT+0200) Marcus Meissner composed:
We use FATE as it allows way more in the way of roles and multiple products than Bugzilla, which is pretty single minded on all things.
I have yet to figure out how FATE helps with characteristics or behavior falling in the monumental gray area between clearly something new or different, and unambiguously broken, a huge portion of which are subject to different interpretations. That's an important reason why I started this thread. It's plenty hard to search for and actually find things in one big DB without having to also figure out which of two DBs that one thing might be found in. I would have to agree. It sounds sensible to create a unified system sharing one DB but having different front ends for the
On Tuesday, August 23, 2011 12:32:45 AM Felix Miata wrote: particular use-case. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
On Tue, Aug 23, 2011 at 02:53:56AM -0400, Felix Miata wrote:
On 2011/08/23 07:15 (GMT+1000) doiggl@velocitynet.com.au composed:
Could feature requests be added to the Bugzilla system upstream.
Not only are they already there, they're also already in bugzilla.novell.com's (called enhancement), but in the latter, they get closed and the reporter directed to submit to FATE.
We use FATE as it allows way more in the way of roles and multiple products than Bugzilla, which is pretty single minded on all
On Monday, August 22, 2011 11:57:41 PM Marcus Meissner wrote: things.
Ciao, Marcus
I wouldn't imagine a bug-reporting platform would be perfectly suited to feature proposals. One would wonder though if having a bug reporting and feature request system with a merged DB and different front ends may prove advantageous. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
On 08/24/2011 11:13 AM, Roger Luedecke wrote:
On Tue, Aug 23, 2011 at 02:53:56AM -0400, Felix Miata wrote:
On 2011/08/23 07:15 (GMT+1000) doiggl@velocitynet.com.au composed:
Could feature requests be added to the Bugzilla system upstream.
Not only are they already there, they're also already in bugzilla.novell.com's (called enhancement), but in the latter, they get closed and the reporter directed to submit to FATE.
We use FATE as it allows way more in the way of roles and multiple products than Bugzilla, which is pretty single minded on all
On Monday, August 22, 2011 11:57:41 PM Marcus Meissner wrote: things.
Ciao, Marcus
I wouldn't imagine a bug-reporting platform would be perfectly suited to feature proposals. One would wonder though if having a bug reporting and feature request system with a merged DB and different front ends may prove advantageous.
There are many bug trackers, which also have feature request handling in them. The issue is : developers in general like bugzilla. It is powerful and they are used to it. While I do not have a solution, I am sure it will be a topic during the upcoming conference. Cheers, Peter -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
On Sunday 21 August 2011 15:32:55 Felix Miata wrote:
Having separate tracker DBs for bugs and enhancement requests drives me nuts. Often the difference is one of semantics that people don't agree on. Searching for existing this way is about 4 times as much work.
Now that openSUSE has been divorced from Novell, is it not in the plans for it to have a separate bug tracker?
I don't think anyone has mentioned it so I will: FATE has *nothing* to do with novell and it never did. FATE was in use *long* before Novell, it was developed at suse and was kept, not imposed, by Novell. Just FYI Anders -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
participants (10)
-
Anders Johansson -
Cristian Morales Vega -
Cristian Rodríguez -
doiggl＠velocitynet.com.au -
Felix Miata -
Kim Leyendecker -
Marcus Meissner -
Per Jessen -
Peter Linnell -
Roger Luedecke