Re: [opensuse-factory] Excess bloat must be removed!
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From: Steve Barnhart
I won't comment on the backend integration stuff - but as a user you have three interfaces: YaST-qt (advanced), zen (simple) and rug (cli). Ubuntu has more or less the same - apt-get (cli), synaptic (adavanced) and their "add/remove software"-thingy (simple).
I suppose you're right, but YaST has become *so* slow and it has always been slow, so hopefully (as i've been reading) this is getting worked on for 10.2. Anyone know when exactly the GTK frontend for YaST will be included? It would be nice to not have to have kdelibs and base installed by default if I chose the GNOME desktop. And I basically have to use zen now mostly for updates since atleast it includes a notification since suseplugger was removed. basically my problem with zen (besides the slowness of it, head its being worked on), is that its so confusing and would probably be more confusing to new users. Zen needs to show _1_ version of each package. If I'm using zen-updater, only show updates if I'm in zen-installer show the newest version (also some kind of icon/way to notify me if my version is older). And its so unstable that I don't even use it to install packages anymore. It freezes on dependency checking sometimes, othertimes who knows what it is doing.
and Finally, and this is my big peeve. FIX THE FREAKIN MENUS! The organization takes WAY too much time and maybe it won't matter if slab is integrated but we do not need categories and then ANOTHER category
Having two levels of categories is a must. I have ~20 Internet-apps - if they weren't put into subcategories it would be a complete mess like most Windows menus are. Besides if you stayed current with SUSE news you'd know that Novell have developed the SLED gnome-main-menu thingy for people like yourself - and the good people at SUSE are working on a similiar menu for KDE based on usability testing and what not.
I know about slab (as I mentioned) in fact, who doesn't? Its an awesome feature and yes, that will likely clear up my problem as long as it can do what launchy and quicksilver do and jus as fast (as in typing the application clickly, finding the match and executing).
I know 10.1 was a bad apple, but hopefully this stuff is vastly cleared up.
To my recollection the menus and amount of apps on 10.1 was exactly the same on previous releases. None of your criticism except the package management frontends are 10.1 specific.
Well I was more talking about the mess that zen is right now and the entire slow feel of the distro.
Except for two webbrowsers, I don't have more than one app that does the same thing on a standard install. And seamonkey is not installed by default.
I'd hate to see SUSE turn into Ubuntu. If Ubuntu with SUSE polish is what you want I think you should join the Ubuntu mailinglists and suggest to them that they polish their distro more.
I like about SUSE that functionality is a higher priority than not confusing already confused people - which I consider an impossible task anyway.
Then I must have installed seamonkey and some stuff while trying to get rid of the online updates during installation! Its never done that before but on 10.1 after I told it I would update it showed me *all* updates instead of ones relevant to what's installed and kept coming up even after installing all of the updates that applied to me. I had to click cancel just for it to go away and move to the next step. As was proposed earlier, maybe if only one type of application for each category is installed do not go to second level. It may be nice for you people who have 20+ internet apps but it takes us with a couple much longer. I don't neccessarily see everything bad about Ubuntu. Yes SUSE has Yast and I LOVE it (if it can be sped up) and other distros are at a disadvantage because of it. SUSE also has the next thing I love more than almost anything (besides actually working and speed ha) and that is polish..LOTS of it :). BUT that's not saying SUSE can't trim their packages more (IE not be a 2.8 GB default install just by choosing GNOME). But if what was said earlier is true (trimming down to 3 cds and such) good, hopefully that is carried down to installation. -- Steve -- Steve --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
Hi, Steve Barnhart schrieb:
Its never done that before but on 10.1 after I told it I would update it showed me *all* updates instead of ones relevant to what's installed and kept coming up even after installing all of the updates that applied to me.
This bug (always showing all patches in YOU, whether they are already installed or not, whether they are needed or not) is a must-fix for 10.2. This bug is responsible for many "updating is totally broken and does not work at all" reports that multiply themselves infinitely and make supporting the distro quite painful (because if a user in a forum has a problem like "I cannot apply patches", there is always another user saying something like "don't even try, it doesn't work at all" faster than I can explain YOU's behaviour). It's very frustrating. Andreas Hanke --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
Has this bug been reported on bugzilla? There's so many on there that
seem like they could be applied to this situation. and they all look
like they were reported before 10.1 final..wth is up with that? Does
Novell not read bug reports?
On 8/23/06, Andreas Hanke
Hi,
Steve Barnhart schrieb:
Its never done that before but on 10.1 after I told it I would update it showed me *all* updates instead of ones relevant to what's installed and kept coming up even after installing all of the updates that applied to me.
This bug (always showing all patches in YOU, whether they are already installed or not, whether they are needed or not) is a must-fix for 10.2.
This bug is responsible for many "updating is totally broken and does not work at all" reports that multiply themselves infinitely and make supporting the distro quite painful (because if a user in a forum has a problem like "I cannot apply patches", there is always another user saying something like "don't even try, it doesn't work at all" faster than I can explain YOU's behaviour).
It's very frustrating.
Andreas Hanke --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
-- Steve --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
Steve Barnhart schrieb:
Has this bug been reported on bugzilla?
https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=183735 Andreas Hanke --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
participants (2)
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Andreas Hanke
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Steve Barnhart