On Tue 30 May 2006 18:31, Peter Nixon wrote:

On Tue 30 May 2006 17:58, Marcus Rueckert wrote:

...

hi,

on irc we had a discussion about adding some logical namespaces.

It was started by looking for the right place for a php project. we now agreed on having a "server:" namespace. the first proposed projects in that namespace we see: server:apache (the former Apache project) server:mail (exim and home:choeger:postfix could be moved there) server:ftp server:php (php project, and php extensions, and my hardened php package) server:dns (i will move my pdns, mydns, nsd packages there. maybe the bind and dnsmasq package could move there aswell?:) )

Oh goody. I was about to add pdns to my project, but it looks like you saved me the trouble :-)

...

It would be nice to have a server:voip aswell. peter nixon has some packages in that area iirc. :)

I am glad someone noticed! *grin*

I already created a project titled "telephony" a few weeks ago, but would be happy to rename it to the server: namespace. (Clients are for wimps!) I think that Telephony is probably a better name than VoIP, but I am willing to go with consensus here...

So, do these namespaces need to be specially created or can I do it from the web interface? If someone can create either server:voip or server:telephony and give me access to it I would be happy to move some packages over there. Cheers -- Peter Nixon http://www.peternixon.net/ PGP Key: http://www.peternixon.net/public.asc

On Mon 05 Jun 2006 11:30, Richard Bos wrote:

Op maandag 5 juni 2006 10:16, schreef Peter Nixon:

...

...

I already created a project titled "telephony" a few weeks ago, but would be happy to rename it to the server: namespace. (Clients are for wimps!) I think that Telephony is probably a better name than VoIP, but I am willing to go with consensus here...

So, do these namespaces need to be specially created or can I do it from the web interface? If someone can create either server:voip or server:telephony and give me access to it I would be happy to move some packages over there.

Is a column in the name desired? I read that rsync does not like it, see:

Well, The namespace was not defined by me :-)

<quote> That said, from the looks of it, putting a colon in a file path seems to trip up rsync somehow (unless I did not yet find a solution). The gwdg rsync server keeps maintaining the position that the service is unavailable as soon as I want to retreive files from the new KDE: repository on their OpenSUSE mirror... :-( update --- OK, Not killed. But by moving it to a new structure they broke my stuff. Bad. Thanks for lurchi pointing out that the colon can be replaced by a '?'-wildcard to make rsyncing work again... </quote> http://braincore.blogspot.com/2006/06/wtf-pee-ooh-d.html

Well, it doesn't make things easier. Why not just use a "_" e.g.?

Yes. You are right, some of the forms of rsync commands no longer work, and it took me a little while to figure out what did, but I am having no problems with: rsync repos.opensuse.org::buildservice-repos/home:/peternixon/SL-10.1/ Cheers -- Peter Nixon http://www.peternixon.net/ PGP Key: http://www.peternixon.net/public.asc

On Mon 05 Jun 2006 13:03, Adrian Schröter wrote:

Am Monday 05 June 2006 10:16 schrieb Peter Nixon:

...

On Tue 30 May 2006 18:31, Peter Nixon wrote:

...

On Tue 30 May 2006 17:58, Marcus Rueckert wrote:

...

hi,

on irc we had a discussion about adding some logical namespaces.

It was started by looking for the right place for a php project. we now agreed on having a "server:" namespace. the first proposed projects in that namespace we see: server:apache (the former Apache project) server:mail (exim and home:choeger:postfix could be moved there) server:ftp server:php (php project, and php extensions, and my hardened php package) server:dns (i will move my pdns, mydns, nsd packages there. maybe the bind and dnsmasq package could move there aswell?:) )

Oh goody. I was about to add pdns to my project, but it looks like you saved me the trouble :-)

...

It would be nice to have a server:voip aswell. peter nixon has some packages in that area iirc. :)

I am glad someone noticed! *grin*

I already created a project titled "telephony" a few weeks ago, but would be happy to rename it to the server: namespace. (Clients are for wimps!) I think that Telephony is probably a better name than VoIP, but I am willing to go with consensus here...

So, do these namespaces need to be specially created or can I do it from the web interface? If someone can create either server:voip or server:telephony and give me access to it I would be happy to move some packages over there.

The will need ACL permissions in future. ATM everything can be created by everybody (one reason why we do not open it to the public atm).

So please ask first on this list, if you want to create new top level namespaces, before you do it. Feel free to mess around under your home: namespace ;)

So should I create a server:telephony project? -- Peter Nixon http://www.peternixon.net/ PGP Key: http://www.peternixon.net/public.asc

Op maandag 5 juni 2006 19:02, schreef Marcus Rueckert:

On 2006-06-05 13:22:40 +0300, Peter Nixon wrote:

...

So should I create a server:telephony project?

yes. the server namespace is quite crowded already. :)

Including ":"? I think it is still possible to change the namespace seperator to something else than ":". This to prevent problems with programs like rsync.... -- Richard Bos Without a home the journey is endless --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice-unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice-help@opensuse.org

Op maandag 5 juni 2006 19:27, schreef u:

...

Including ":"?  I think it is still possible to change the namespace seperator to something else than ":".  This to prevent problems with programs like rsync....

of course we will fsck the mirrors again. especially with KDE:. do we really want it?

That's an 1 time occurence. Keeping the ":" will give difficulties for a long time... -- Richard Bos Without a home the journey is endless --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice-unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice-help@opensuse.org

Op maandag 5 juni 2006 20:15, schreef Marcus Rueckert:

...

That's an 1 time occurence.  Keeping the ":" will give difficulties for a long time...

peter nixon reported it is working for him. could you give some examples which no longer work?

No, I can't. Peter stated: Op maandag 5 juni 2006 10:35, schreef Peter Nixon:

Yes. You are right, some of the forms of rsync commands no longer work, and it took me a little while to figure out what did, but I am having no problems with:

rsync repos.opensuse.org::buildservice-repos/home:/peternixon/SL-10.1/

Wouldn't that put a burden on the mirror admins, to find the right rsync options (although the one above looks obvious enough to me). I think that this should be looked at. That's why we use the buildserver (still alpha). When the buildserver is released and fully operational, it is not possible to change it anymore (or it least much more difficult). -- Richard Bos Without a home the journey is endless --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice-unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice-help@opensuse.org

On 2006-06-05 20:52:23 +0200, Cornelius Schumacher wrote:

On Monday 05 June 2006 19:14, Richard Bos wrote:

...

Including ":"? I think it is still possible to change the namespace seperator to something else than ":". This to prevent problems with programs like rsync....

I agree that we should try to avoid as many problems we can by choosing a neutral namespace separator for the project names. Alternatives to ":" could be the already mentioned "_" or "+" or possibly "." or "-". Looking at the current project names only "+" wouldn't need any changes to existing project names.

So what do you like better (using four existing projects as examples and making character replacements where required):

we should define some rules that ban the seperator from package names aswell. and that will be hard. in that regard ":" was good. as projects barely use it in their names, unlike "_", "-" or "+". (the plus sign is forbidden by the buildserivce atm anyway.) i wonder if we just should force ns/project/package and stuff all projects without an explicit namespace into "unsorted" or something like that. then we wouldnt need some special namespace marker anyway i think if rsync fells over the 2nd ":" in the url it is definitely a sign for a broken url parser in rsync. darix -- openSUSE - SUSE Linux is my linux openSUSE is good for you www.opensuse.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice-unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice-help@opensuse.org

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Richard Bos wrote:

Op maandag 5 juni 2006 21:10, schreef Marcus Rueckert:

...

i wonder if we just should force

ns/project/package

and stuff all projects without an explicit namespace into "unsorted" or something like that. then we wouldnt need some special namespace marker

+1

+1 - -- -o) Pascal Bleser http://linux01.gwdg.de/~pbleser/ /\\ _\_v The more things change, the more they stay insane. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFEhJPar3NMWliFcXcRAt6QAKCg8/5oqRPFvlItUA7VvxMA4BvbYACfQLrx BWyxAdmbr2OIdEU31lNbyJE= =Ha2J -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice-unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice-help@opensuse.org

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Marcus Rueckert wrote:

On 2006-06-05 22:28:10 +0200, Pascal Bleser wrote:

...

Richard Bos wrote:

...

Op maandag 5 juni 2006 21:10, schreef Marcus Rueckert:

...

i wonder if we just should force

ns/project/package

and stuff all projects without an explicit namespace into "unsorted" or something like that. then we wouldnt need some special namespace marker +1

before you all +1 this too much i wonder why we didnt get any complains on sub namespaces.

Maybe because it wasn't even discussed in the first place. I just started using BS repos since KDE:KDE3 is hosted there. I don't use rsync for BS repos myself, and smart handles the ":" without problems, but just using "/" seems a lot more natural to me. cheers - -- -o) Pascal Bleser http://linux01.gwdg.de/~pbleser/ /\\ _\_v The more things change, the more they stay insane. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFEhJYbr3NMWliFcXcRAkf2AKCyVJWe4WCqCRC3EF1xfDMhhIsuogCgl6LI +JjFSFzDIFfaH5KDVkgrCrU= =nCE4 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice-unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice-help@opensuse.org

Am Monday 05 June 2006 21:58 schrieb Richard Bos:

Op maandag 5 juni 2006 21:10, schreef Marcus Rueckert:

...

i wonder if we just should force

ns/project/package

and stuff all projects without an explicit namespace into "unsorted" or something like that. then we wouldnt need some special namespace marker

That is what the home:<user> namespace is for. Everything outside of that should need an approvement in future. We spoke about namespace owners, who can do that. So it is not a single person, but different persons for each namespace. However, we do not have this yet ... bye adrian -- Adrian Schroeter SUSE Linux Products GmbH, Maxfeldstr. 5, 90409 Nuernberg, Germany email: adrian@suse.de --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice-unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice-help@opensuse.org

On 2006-06-05 23:58:53 -0400, Jonh Arson wrote:

Speaking about it, i tried uploading gtk+-2.8.18.tar.gz2 and the filename always get cropped to just gtk, those namespace thingy or whatever are really gonna be annoying if you use common char... what about ~

this is a bug. it is not related to this discussion. we are already investigating it. i hope in the long term the gnome team will join the build service. and you can just build against their targets. than you dont have to maintain your own gnome. darix -- openSUSE - SUSE Linux is my linux openSUSE is good for you www.opensuse.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice-unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice-help@opensuse.org

On 2006-06-06 09:13:04 +0200, Christoph Thiel wrote:

If I'm understanding you correctly, you are proposing to push all packages into "unsorted", as long as they don't belong to a namespace? So, with that, the only way to access $package would be to access unsorted or the corresponding namespace from $package_manager? If that's the case, I'd strongly disagree with this proposal. Without a proper trust model in place, this would make it virtually impossible to choose $packager (or $group_of_packagers) you like to trust.

it would be unsorted/project/package. and i dont like that solution much. as i said in another having a way to define subnamespaces would be nice to have. any suggestions? darix -- openSUSE - SUSE Linux is my linux openSUSE is good for you www.opensuse.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice-unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice-help@opensuse.org

On Tue, Jun 06, 2006 at 11:58:20AM +0200, Michael Schroeder wrote:

On Mon, Jun 05, 2006 at 09:10:07PM +0200, Marcus Rueckert wrote:

...

we should define some rules that ban the seperator from package names aswell. and that will be hard. in that regard ":" was good. as projects barely use it in their names, unlike "_", "-" or "+". (the plus sign is forbidden by the buildserivce atm anyway.)

i wonder if we just should force

ns/project/package

and stuff all projects without an explicit namespace into "unsorted" or something like that. then we wouldnt need some special namespace marker

No, a fixes hierarchy makes no sense.

To followup on my own mail, here are the requirements for the repository pathes: 1) must support arbitrary deep hierarchies for projects 2) must support arbitrary deep hierarchies for repositories The idea behind this is to allow project maintainers to create new projects in a sub hierarchy. For example, the "KDE:KDE3" maintainers should be able to create a "KDE:KDE3:AMAROK" subproject. Or the maintainer of "home:mls" should be able to create "home:mls:fancyproj". So in short, the buildservice maintainers only have an eye on the "top level" projects, everything else is done via the normal project permissions. 3) must be collision free If we would just use '/' as a hierarchiy seperator, we would get in trouble when there is a name clash with a repository. For example a project "KDE/KDE3/SL10" might clash with a repository "SL10" in "KDE/KDE3". The same is true for clashes between the repository and the real repository, i.e. "repodata", "i586" and the like. 4) it should be possible to rsync a project without loading down all projects in a lower hierarchy. This is also hard with simple slashes, because the KDE/KDE3 also includes KDE/KDE3/AMAROK. We us a simple conversion of ':' to ':/' for now, I admit this is a kind of a hack, but it meets the requirements. If anybody comes up with something more elegant, please speak up. We can still change the design, nothing is set to stone at the moment. Thanks, Michael. -- Michael Schroeder mls@suse.de main(_){while(_=~getchar())putchar(~_-1/(~(_|32)/13*2-11)*13);} --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice-unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice-help@opensuse.org

On Mon 05 Jun 2006 20:02, Marcus Rueckert wrote:

On 2006-06-05 13:22:40 +0300, Peter Nixon wrote:

...

So should I create a server:telephony project?

yes. the server namespace is quite crowded already. :)

OK. well, could one of the admins please do it for me, as I think the option to create new projects is MIA (well, I cant find it anyway) Cheers -- Peter Nixon http://www.peternixon.net/ PGP Key: http://www.peternixon.net/public.asc

On Mon 05 Jun 2006 20:50, Marcus Rueckert wrote:

On 2006-06-05 20:44:22 +0300, Peter Nixon wrote:

...

Date: Mon, 5 Jun 2006 20:44:22 +0300 From: Peter Nixon Subject: [opensuse-buildservice] Re: Namespaces To: opensuse-buildservice@opensuse.org

On Mon 05 Jun 2006 20:02, Marcus Rueckert wrote:

...

On 2006-06-05 13:22:40 +0300, Peter Nixon wrote:

...

So should I create a server:telephony project?

yes. the server namespace is quite crowded already. :)

OK. well, could one of the admins please do it for me, as I think the option to create new projects is MIA (well, I cant find it anyway)

http://build.opensuse.org/project/new and name it server:telephony. [done]

Ahhh. Thanks. It only shows up under: http://build.opensuse.org/project/list_all but not under http://build.opensuse.org/project/list_public Obviously I didnt look hard enough :-) Cheers -- Peter Nixon http://www.peternixon.net/ PGP Key: http://www.peternixon.net/public.asc

Am Monday 05 June 2006 21:12 schrieb Peter Nixon:

On Mon 05 Jun 2006 21:46, Peter Nixon wrote:

...

On Mon 05 Jun 2006 20:50, Marcus Rueckert wrote:

...

On 2006-06-05 20:44:22 +0300, Peter Nixon wrote:

...

Date: Mon, 5 Jun 2006 20:44:22 +0300 From: Peter Nixon Subject: [opensuse-buildservice] Re: Namespaces To: opensuse-buildservice@opensuse.org

On Mon 05 Jun 2006 20:02, Marcus Rueckert wrote:

...

On 2006-06-05 13:22:40 +0300, Peter Nixon wrote:

...

So should I create a server:telephony project?

yes. the server namespace is quite crowded already. :)

OK. well, could one of the admins please do it for me, as I think the option to create new projects is MIA (well, I cant find it anyway)

http://build.opensuse.org/project/new and name it server:telephony. [done]

Ahhh. Thanks. It only shows up under:

http://build.opensuse.org/project/list_all

but not under

http://build.opensuse.org/project/list_public

Obviously I didnt look hard enough :-)

OK. I have created a "server:telephony" project. Can an admin please delete the "telephony" project?

done -- Adrian Schroeter SUSE Linux Products GmbH, Maxfeldstr. 5, 90409 Nuernberg, Germany email: adrian@suse.de --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice-unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-buildservice-help@opensuse.org