https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=296525#c1 Lukas Ocilka changed: What |Removed |Added ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- CC| |locilka@novell.com AssignedTo|locilka@novell.com |sh@novell.com --- Comment #1 from Lukas Ocilka 2007-08-03 03:08:54 MST --- This is UI-related feature request. -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=296525#c3 --- Comment #3 from Maciej Pilichowski 2007-08-03 06:11:14 MST ---

Ctrl-Alt-F2 for example is in no way YaST-specific; this is a very basic Linux key combination. No offense, but users who don't know this key combination should better not try to issue commands in that root shell running on console 2.

Stefan, I can check the sizes of partitions using fdisk, I can check the mount points, not a problem, but I cannot: a) remember the _old_ way of switching to console because for _years_ I work in GUI mode b) memorize all the "basic" :-) shortcuts -- what do you expect from human being? KMail, Konqueror, Firefox, Konsole, KDevelop, etc etc etc etc, please face the fact there are _tons_ of programs with their own shortcuts, and user is supposed to memorize them all I am not offended in any way, but I don't think that "don't know how to switch to console? you should not run fdisk" is a bad judgment -- those things are not related to each other in such degree as you suggested.

Reading some documentation and/or a Linux book first is strongly recommended.

Do you use KMail for example? When you forget shortcut for "reply" you are about to read entire book? Or you just go to the shortcut settings and find one. We live in a computer era -- don't force users to use old methods. Books are nice for learning, not for searching.

The help text of the installation workflow surely is not the right place to teach users basic Linux skills. It would only clutter the help that is really relevant at that time.

Sure, I am just asking for one small button, similar to any KDE help. "Keyboard help", which could say "Press [F5] for refresh. ---- advanced shortcuts Press [sth] for xxx, use with caution "

Where would such a help text you envision begin, where would it end?

In a popup window.

Key combinations like Ctrl-Alt-F2 are just the beginning.

Yes, it was an example.

Others might want some instruction how to find out what disk partition contains what (how to read /proc/mounts, how to invoke fdisk or parted),

it is already written. See man xxxx. You see -- no book needed.

All this is clearly out of scope for the installer help texts. WAY out of scope. That's what our manuals are for.

Again, I think it is misjudgment of yours -- there is no encyclopedia about linux. Books good for learning are not good for searching (even encyclopedia is lousy comparing to computers). Pushing users to read entire book for some really trivial things is a bad approach -- software should be user-friendly, and in showing (on demand) information that "xxxx shortcut is for yyyy" I see no harm. What's more -- users (like me) can have little experience with _modern_ sotware, windows, macos, KDE, gnome, etc -- so they are used to it. There is no manual needed, there is no help per se needed, you just point the mouse and there is an explanation what this or that does. That is how far "to help" went these days. --- little analogy --------------------------------------------- Would you consider a scientist who does not remember in which drawer there are some tissue samples as a qualified person to run some DNA exploration tests? Because even student could say "gosh, it is sooooo basic thing". But student could have no clue about real genetics. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ And that is the point -- I remember so many _important_ stuff, that ctrl+alt+F2 (example) which I use twice in my _lifetime_ (*) is no importance for me. And I would expect computer would come handy here and give me a hand. Stefan, I am kindly asking you for reconsider -- I hope I presented here some good opposite arguments :-) Thank you for your time. (*) so far, only once, I used it several years ago on a regular basis, because I worked on some computations, but I cannot test it ("does it also work in yast?") using Beethoven method when I am in partition manager. I have to be sure, that the key X means Y. Thus my wish. -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=296525#c5 --- Comment #5 from Maciej Pilichowski 2007-08-03 07:16:46 MST --- (In reply to comment #4 from Stefan Hundhammer)

But frankly, you are the first user I ever got in contact with who knows how to use "fdisk", but not how to use the Linux virtual consoles.

Not exactly :-D I didn't know that I could treat Yast2 installer as regular X app. But honestly, if you asked me what is the shortcut for console switching after all those GUI years, I wouldn't remember :-) Thank you for you answer. -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.