https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838#c1 --- Comment #1 from Petr Gajdos 2012-11-08 21:09:20 UTC --- We have now: 1. Liberation 1.0 2. Croscore (derived from Liberation 1.0) now in M17N:fonts 3. Liberation 2.0 (derived from Croscore) now in M17N:fonts But from the analysis provided in redhat bug it seems that BCI instructions was discarded somewhere along the way. -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838#c3 Petr Gajdos changed: What |Removed |Added ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Status|ASSIGNED |NEEDINFO InfoProvider| |anixx@opensuse.org --- Comment #3 from Petr Gajdos 2012-11-08 21:16:07 UTC --- (In reply to comment #0)

Besides disabled bytecode it also has different layout metric (it is more condensed) which may cause documents which use Liberation to appear differently and incorrectly.

You are saying Liberation 2.0 are not metric compatible with Liberation 1.0? Can you please point me to the source of this information? -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838#c5 Ilya Chernykh changed: What |Removed |Added ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Status|NEEDINFO |ASSIGNED InfoProvider|anixx@opensuse.org | --- Comment #5 from Ilya Chernykh 2012-11-08 23:39:51 UTC --- This may be only an impression. A screenshot with the font conparison: As you can see, in the right picture some single vertical lines take several pixels while similar lines in other letters (or other parts of the same letter like in Russian ш in the word шрифтов) occupy 1 pixel. This unevenness creates an effect of blots spread through the text (for example, it looks like there are two blots in the word "совместимы" because м and ы letters do not fit the pixels, while other letters do). Due to subpixel smoothing this also creates an "rainbow" effect while the text in the text in the left window looks evenly gray. Some thick letters in the right window fuse such as letters "ым" in the word "лицензированными". The broken hinting also makes the lower part of the в letter to appear smaller than the upper part (look at the word "шрифтов"). -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838#c7 --- Comment #7 from Ilya Chernykh 2012-11-08 23:57:13 UTC --- Some other examples of hinting "improvements": http://storage5.static.itmages.ru/i/12/1109/h_1352418252_7414160_bdbc22d28a.... Here we see multiple fused letters, for example, sequences ов, ор, ои. http://storage4.static.itmages.ru/i/12/1109/h_1352418716_2364613_f7fbe5f6db.... Here we see fused letters along with huge intervals. You won't believe that "Были" here is one word without a space. http://storage2.static.itmages.ru/i/12/1109/h_1352418568_9664381_f4af9b5031.... This is a menu of Firefox. Here we see fused letters Ф and а as well as a huge space in the word "Журнал". -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838#c9 Petr Gajdos changed: What |Removed |Added ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- CC| |thomas.schraitle@suse.com, | |tiwai@suse.com --- Comment #9 from Petr Gajdos 2012-11-09 07:30:44 UTC --- Takashi, didn't I tell you yesterday? Here we are :-]. Another reason though. -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838#c11 --- Comment #11 from Petr Gajdos 2012-11-09 07:57:10 UTC --- (In reply to comment #10)

One possible way would be to call Liberation 2.0 liberation2-fonts or such, and let croscore-fonts provides/obsoletes liberation-fonts. This won't change the situation of "Liberation" family conflicts, though.

Right now Liberation fonts have different hint styles defined in 16-suse-hintstyle.conf. Maybe we need to fix this and/of provide the overriding config from liberation2-fonts?

+1 liberation-fonts and liberation2-fonts will conflict on file level, so liberation2-fonts could be provider of liberation-fonts and which one will be preffered could be chosen on project level. -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838#c13 Petr Gajdos changed: What |Removed |Added ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- CC| |coolo@suse.com --- Comment #13 from Petr Gajdos 2012-11-09 08:36:00 UTC --- Guys, the worse thing is metric compatibility. Recall 30-metric-aliases.conf, which basically says that Liberation fonts are metric compatible with Microsoft fonts, URW fonts etc. Recently I have added there also CrOS core fonts. Since this relation is transitive, liberation 2.0 should be metric compatible with fonts mentioned in 30-metric-aliases.conf or we do have a problem. Reading the provided redhat bug, there are some doubts too, but no more like an one's impression as far as I can see. Are we able to prove or disprove it on font file level using e. g. fontforge or other tool? I have used term 'metric compatibility' only as naively until now, what's actually the exact definition? I suppose one have to take e. g. kerning into account? -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838#c15 --- Comment #15 from Petr Gajdos 2012-11-09 09:35:55 UTC --- Takashi, (In reply to comment #10)

Right now Liberation fonts have different hint styles defined in 16-suse-hintstyle.conf. Maybe we need to fix this and/of provide the overriding config from liberation2-fonts?

maybe would be the option too to distinguish version of installed Liberation fonts directly in 16-suse-hintstyle.conf (or maybe rather new 16-suse-liberation.conf)? That could be detected via lang element as Liberation fonts 2.0 supports more languages. Advantage would be to have all liberation-fonts-specific-configuration on one place. -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838#c17 --- Comment #17 from Petr Gajdos 2012-11-09 10:40:49 UTC ---

So, if we'd like to keep M17N:fonts stuff somehow independent from distro version, an override config is preferred, IMO.

Ok. -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838#c19 --- Comment #19 from Petr Gajdos 2012-11-09 11:19:08 UTC --- I'll create liberation2-fonts after weekend. -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838#c21 --- Comment #21 from Ilya Chernykh 2012-11-09 13:07:11 UTC --- By the way, can the folders and files of Liberation-2 be somehow renamed so to make it not to conflict with Liberation? -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838#c23 --- Comment #23 from Petr Gajdos 2012-11-12 07:26:39 UTC --- (In reply to comment #20)

@Petr Gajdos I think that autohint is what we get anyway when BCI codes are absent. So on the screenshots above we see Liberation-2 with autohinting anyway.

Really? I think only when would KDE tweak somehow fontconfig configuration. pgajdos@laura:~[0]> rpm -q liberation-fonts liberation-fonts-2.00.1-15.1.noarch pgajdos@laura:~[0]> fc-match -v 'Liberation Sans' | grep hint hintstyle: 1(i)(w) hinting: FcTrue(s) autohint: FcFalse(w) But if you don't want to test, never mind, I will simply pick configuration from comment 12. But don't say then that Liberation fonts 2.0 are broken. They are simply not designed for using BCI algorithm. And you are likely to use BCI to render them. -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838#c25 --- Comment #25 from Petr Gajdos 2012-11-12 07:40:06 UTC --- (In reply to comment #22)

(In reply to comment #20) @Petr: How do you perform autohinting? Do you use Fontforge or another tool?

I'm not sure if you know it already, but in my home repo (home:thomas-schraitle) there is the ttfautohint package which seems to create pretty good hinting information:

http://www.freetype.org/ttfautohint/

ttfautohint's goal is a 99% automated hinting process for web fonts, acting as a platform for finely hand-tuned hinting.

Could be worth a try. :)

That should do upstream if they decide it is the best way. You can suggest it in RH bug. But in its comment_24 one of the commenter says there that using ttfautohint versus freetype autohinter makes no big difference (in general). But I haven't use it so far, so I cannot tell. I suppose I will not have time for testing it for Liberation fonts 2.0 in near future. I think we should use freetype autohinting for time being and we will see what happens in RH bug. There are participating Behdad and Akira (upstream of fontconfig), so I am sure they'll choose the best solution. -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838#c27 --- Comment #27 from Ilya Chernykh 2012-11-12 14:35:39 UTC --- Thank you very much! -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=788838#c29 --- Comment #29 from Bernhard Wiedemann 2012-11-14 14:32:03 CET --- This is an autogenerated message for OBS integration: This bug (788838) was mentioned in https://build.opensuse.org/request/show/141089 https://build.opensuse.org/request/show/141091 https://build.opensuse.org/request/show/141092 -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.